American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[MetalMover]

Tim
Arbitration can be turned down as you know. Then it’s a cooling off period and more than likely a PEB, as I agree with one thing you say, in that we won’t be able to strike. But the company is even pushing for a PEB not arbitration. Again, just because you say I’m lying 100 times doesn’t make it true. What would someone gain lying about that anyway? I think a PEB would be just as bad as arbitration, so why would anyone lie about it?

And here is how it most likely play out. An arbitrator or PEB could very well look at the industry SCOPE. AA wants to operate like the other airlines with respect to scope and. namely outsourcing.
Oh, and one more point to ponder. The longer these stalled negotiations continue, the greater the chance for some major event to hit the economy.
Hence, maybe another BK filing?
All these pesky demands the company seeks can easily be attained with another BK filing.

Either way, the company will get what it wants. They always do.

 

[WeAAsles]

You’re welcome.

You don’t own Delta and the Market dictated that at least the wage rates needed to be reset back to where they were headed prior to our 2003 concessions and then the Industry Bankrutcies that followed.

The wage rate reset was distributed among all Employee groups from lower level Management and Pilots on down.

 

[WeAAsles]

No not necessarily . I donr go looking to make peeps look bad. But. If there an offer i believe it shld be posted for all to see. However if u wont send it to me then i cannot really believe there was an offer unless provided for us to see n debate

He never saw a physical offer and most certainly wasn’t distributed any copies of any offers. He does know what we all know in that the Company offered to continue staffing the 40 cities we currently are in. But what is also not known is if there are any expiration dates on those cities designated Class 2 in your Contract?

Tim already had his transfers in to multiple locations here in Florida and when the call came for one of them he wasn’t going to let it pass him by and especially not after that brutal winter storm he lived through.

I expect he may have also been called in for a Full Time position which doesn’t open up every day in those small cities.

So basically when one opens up if you want it you better jump on it when you have the chance.

 

[WeAAsles]

He is used to the Michael Quill tactics because he grew up battling the city of NY where there is ONLY ONE TRANSPORTATION ENTITY TO DEAL WITH...The MTA....

He absolutely is an admirer and student of Mike Quill. Although the man is certainly charting his own path.

Right now though in NYC all the Bus and Rail Contracts are settled and Tony Utano And his people are more than capable of handling their other Local 100 issues.

The big open contracts in the TWU right now are us here at AA and securing a first CBA for JetBlue FA’s. So that’s what he’s (they’re) focusing on now.

And Mike Quill tactics should be universal if needed.

 

[WeAAsles]

And here is how it most likely play out. An arbitrator or PEB could very well look at the industry SCOPE. AA wants to operate like the other airlines with respect to scope and. namely outsourcing.
Oh, and one more point to ponder. The longer these stalled negotiations continue, the greater the chance for some major event to hit the economy.
Hence, maybe another BK filing?
All these pesky demands the company seeks can easily be attained with another BK filing.

Either way, the company will get what it wants. They always do.

It’s not as simple to just file Bankruptcy because the Company wants to continue to try and break the backs of their creditors (Labor Unions)

Remember that under those restructuring Bankruptcies now there is a code 1113 which states that all concessions need be distributed evenly. If AA tries to do another cut to their creditors eventually many of them could choose to no longer do business with AA?

(Remember at one time AA was having difficulty getting a vendor to supply them Coffee Cups)

Otherwise I’d like to hope we would have AIP’s long before any Federal Mediator starts talking PEB since that would likely be many many years from now.

 

[Kev3188]

You don’t own Delta...

Actually, I do; as do 1000's of other people.

As for the rest of your post, it makes it look like you really don't understand game theory at all. Maybe check it out on your next Google spree?

 

[WeAAsles]

Actually, I do; as do 1000's of other people.

As for the rest of your post, it makes it look like you really don't understand game theory at all. Maybe check it out on your next Google spree?

Owning a handful of DAL shares doesn’t mean you control any day to day operating decisions and certainly not any decisions regarding employee compensation.

On your game theory quote I know where you’re going with it but you are over analyzing the reasons why Labor costs were reset in the industry.

You’re economically naive.

 

[Kev3188]

Maybe, maybe not. If your NC could ever seal the deal, we'd find out...

P.S. I control all sorts of day-to-day operating decisions. It's part of my job. Don't you?

 

[CremaDiLimone]

And thank kevin cause if it weren't for DL we would have never got the raise we did

nah, it was ua that first raised the bar...munoz, getting bernie sanders' heart. delta followed. $30/hr was just around the corner after $28/hr.

i'm 99% certain...ua and dl people here and that's what i remember. all this and aa was at $24/hr at the time..until 2016.

 

[WeAAsles]

Wages within the industry were brought up after consolidation was complete because the Airlines now had the financial ability to do so and it was a needed course of action to improve Customer service which besides route convenience is pretty much the only way the Carriers will be able to differentiate themselves moving forward.

AA, Delta, UAL and SWA all have fairly similar fares where they directly compete with each other.

 

[Kev3188]

Wages within the industry were brought up after consolidation was complete because the Airlines now had the financial ability to do so and it was a needed course of action to improve Customer service which besides route convenience is pretty much the only way the Carriers will be able to differentiate themselves moving forward.

That's cute. Now tell me how else they compete. Maybe make your daily trip over to the MIT site first?

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Oh, and one more point to ponder. The longer these stalled negotiations continue, the greater the chance for some major event to hit the economy.
Hence, maybe another BK filing?
All these pesky demands the company seeks can easily be attained with another BK filing.

in regards to aa's balance sheet - the worm is finally starting to turn. $760 million in debt eliminated last year and another $1+ billion this year. $7.6 billion in liquidity on jan 1 2019. Cap Ex is shrinking.

delta assumed $2 billion more in debt last year, while it had $1.8 billion in liquidity on jan 1 2019.

 

[WeAAsles]

nah, it was ua that first raised the bar...munoz, getting bernie sanders' heart. delta followed. $30/hr was just around the corner after $28/hr.

i'm 99% certain...ua and dl people here and that's what i remember. all this and aa was at $24/hr at the time..until 2016.

I believe prior to that Delta did do a wage increase that provided Ramp going up into the $26 per hour range but don’t quote me on that because these things are now getting more difficult to remember over time.

The industry itself was raising the bar leapfrogging each other again till they got back to the point at least in wages where they would have been had the destructions of the early 2000’s never occurred.

2% per year from the wages we were earning prior to 2003 pretty much equals where we are at today. (Not counting a missed wage increase in 2018)

 

[MikeS]

It’s going to take the company to move. We can’t bring out what’s on the table. It’s just too much job ( meaning work ) loss for our group. If the move never happens, then I think we will end up in a PEB. The PEB will listen to both sides, put together a contract, and we would have the membership vote on it. That I believe is where we are headed if the company doesn’t move.

I would like to know what leverage do you think we have to move the company, you said a few posts back we can't strike, I personally don't think we have any, a big fat zero. If that's the case let's stop negoitiating and just move on to the next step, sitting and praying the company is gonna find a conscience and give in is hurting all LAA guys, or don't you care about us??

 

[WeAAsles]

That's cute. Now tell me how else they compete. Maybe make your daily trip over to the MIT site first?

Perhaps maybe you should go over there once in awhile?

Anyway if you think you’ve personally influenced my wages and need a pat on the back or something, I’m sorry I can’t oblige you.

Nice red jacket you have there Kev.