American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[WeAAsles]

Let’s try to put some Math together here and I hope I got this right? The Company doesn’t want to put this out there obviously. Here’s our future wages on a 5 year deal if we go 3% above Delta and go 2% per year from there. (AA quoted Delta plus 3 and then 2%)

$31.03 (DOS) 2018
$31.66, 2019
$32.30, 2020
$32.95, 2021
$33,61, 2022
$34.29, 2023

Now let’s just post the known Payscale that we can compare ourselves to and consider how fast UAL will be above us and stay above us.

 

[Kev3188]

Let’s try to put some Math together here and I hope I got this right? The Company doesn’t want to put this out there obviously. Here’s our future wages on a 5 year deal if we go 3% above Delta and go 2% per year from there. (AA quoted Delta plus 3 and then 2%)

$31.03 (DOS) 2018
$31.66, 2019
$32.30, 2020
$32.95, 2021
$33,61, 2022
$34.29, 2023

Now let’s just post the known Payscale that we can compare ourselves to and consider how fast UAL will be above us and stay above us.

View attachment 12757

My guess is that it’s a “push.” DL is waiting for AA so they can just beat it and spin it as a benefit to staying non union, and AA is waiting for DL, so they can coat out whatever “DL+3” is.

 

[NYer]

My guess is that it’s a “push.” DL is waiting for AA so they can just beat it and spin it as a benefit to staying non union, and AA is waiting for DL, so they can coat out whatever “DL+3” is.

Airline will probably go with the UA +3%, plus the 2.5% annual raises (for Fleet), when they present the formal counter-proposal, or soon thereafter.

They're releasing the current information so we talk about it and when they add to it more members will be looking to getting an opportunity to vote (mostly on the LAA side). That adds pressure on the Association when the moment comes to make that decision.

 

[WeAAsles]

Airline will probably go with the UA +3%, plus the 2.5% annual raises (for Fleet), when they present the formal counter-proposal, or soon thereafter.

They're releasing the current information so we talk about it and when they add to it more members will be looking to getting an opportunity to vote (mostly on the LAA side).

“It's also a bit funny how some are falling exactly into the trap the Company set by publicizing their positions on the JCBA, which is to show what pieces they need to change to gain more support, like wages, the bonus or even modifying or shift work away on the Fleet side among other items”

 

[P. REZ]

That's my only motivation to vote, the CASH and if someone tells you different, they LIE

Bob,

If you found out that the offer from the company was cost negative or neutral, would you still support?

P. Rez

 

[WeAAsles]

My guess is that it’s a “push.” DL is waiting for AA so they can just beat it and spin it as a benefit to staying non union, and AA is waiting for DL, so they can coat out whatever “DL+3” is.

Since we’re “talking about it”

I say once the PS formula was modified back at OAL’s anything set at 3% just doesn’t again work for me anymore (Only talking direct monetary compensation here)

I think on wages I’d like 8% above where I am right now. Yea that’s it. That’s what would work for me.

That’s $33.28 DOS. Yes. Now that would work for me just talking wages here.

 

[bob@las-AA]

Bob what in the World are you talking about? It’s as if you’re looking for excuses to want to vote on something that no they’re not going to bring out as is anyway period.

And you ignored the wages that sucked.

The offer from the Company currently is 9% and yes it can be more and should be if you actually “listened” to what more senior and educated individuals have written here on it.

The Bonus sucks. It’s a Bonus for Paupers.

If you think the Medical is cheap fine. You have no Wife or kids anyway so of course your viewpoint is IGM.

Days off. Good hope you’re Tuesday Wednesday for the rest of your life then.

PT “You’ll adapt” THIS is why many times people here don’t take you seriously. Again you “purposely” argued every single solitary point just to cross your arms and stamp your feet and say “I don’t care, I WANT IT GIVE IT TO ME”

Dude, you think the company will add some kind of special sauce to this deal, and it is a good deal, as is. I love how you throw in a caveat just to invoke a reaction, namely PT, been a PTer for 60% of my time here, and yes those who can adapt will with no problem. And as far as being “taken seriously or not”, I couldn’t care less for the multitude of colorful personalities on this forum, that includes whatever opinion you or they have for me. I am the leader of the IGM crowd, don’t stand in my way.

 

[WeAAsles]

Dude, you think the company will add some kind of special sauce to this deal, and it is a good deal, as is. I love how you throw in a caveat just to invoke a reaction, namely PT, been a PTer for 60% of my time here, and yes those who can adapt will with no problem. And as far as being “taken seriously or not”, I couldn’t care less for the multitude of colorful personalities on this forum, that includes whatever opinion you or they have for me. I am the leader of the IGM crowd, don’t stand in my way.

Ok but what you “want” I guarantee is less than you can “get” and in a perfect World I’d gladly see you get it and I’ll hold back just a little while longer thank you very much. But you’re gonna wait just a little some with us there Bud.

I also know Bob that you probably have a lot of catching up to do to account for getting into this career so late in life to set up some decent retirement goals so I am sympathetic for you in that area.

And I guess if you were PT for 60% of your career you didn’t even get in the 5 years to vest for a Pension before they pulled the rug out from under you huh?

 

[P. REZ]

Dude, you think the company will add some kind of special sauce to this deal, and it is a good deal, as is. I love how you throw in a caveat just to invoke a reaction, namely PT, been a PTer for 60% of my time here, and yes those who can adapt will with no problem. And as far as being “taken seriously or not”, I couldn’t care less for the multitude of colorful personalities on this forum, that includes whatever opinion you or they have for me. I am the leader of the IGM crowd, don’t stand in my way.

Bob,

Again, if info given to you showed it was less or the same money overall for all employees, would you still support?

P. Rez

 

[Kev3188]

I think on wages I’d like 8% above where I am right now. Yea that’s it. That’s what would work for me.

That’s $33.28 DOS. Yes. Now that would work for me just talking wages here.

Fine by me! The more you get, the more pressure there is on DL to match/beat it.

Dude, you think the company will add some kind of special sauce to this deal, and it is a good deal, as is. I love how you throw in a caveat just to invoke a reaction, namely PT, been a PTer for 60% of my time here, and yes those who can adapt will with no problem. And as far as being “taken seriously or not”, I couldn’t care less for the multitude of colorful personalities on this forum, that includes whatever opinion you or they have for me. I am the leader of the IGM crowd, don’t stand in my way.

Jesus.

At least you’re honest, I guess.

 

[WeAAsles]

Bob,

Again, if info given to you showed it was less or the same money overall for all employees, would you still support?

P. Rez

I’m still waiting since yesterday morning to get a reply to this one?

Maybe Bob wants to give it a shot?

“””””””Fleet MATH as to why it will not pass IMO.

But first I want to hit this “frustration” line being floated. I’m on multiple Social Media pages and itjust doesn’t exist. For those who are currently at $65,000 there isn’t exactly a fantastical reason to have frustrations. (Maybe slight aggravation’s yes) So no I don’t see this overwhelming emotion that’s being sold here.

Now MATH for this sub par offer.

27% IAM side is being offered essentially nothing but takeaways. So I see that as an overwhelming no votethere.

TWU All East Coast, Central and Mid West cities lovethe OT that the Winter Season And Deicing brings. So that and the changes to the OT language willbring an overwhelming no. NYC, BOS and ORD are all strong Union towns that WON’T accept job loss.

TWU MIA could be shaky on both the CS and OTchange. So with no real wage increases and that piece could cause problems here. We do have a lotof New Hires who WILL jump on the $3000 though.

The wages myself and others have pointed out areterrible. .22 cents and 2% per year will easily put us in last place against our peers for the entirety of theagreement from next year on. Yes let’s not pretend here, people do focus on wages.

The good is not enough to outweigh all the bad. And that’s not to say some of it isn’t “good” Great NO, Good yes.

Holidays, Good
Extra Vacation only over 30 years, stinks
Sick time, Meh
IOD time, Yuck (We used to have 80 days)
401k Match, Good but could be better.

The Buyout offer should be outside any agreement.

From there I’d be very interested in the fine print regarding work rules?

So now since people here on this site insist on doing this I want to see a detailed broken down analysis on why they see it passing. Keep your emotions and fluff in check and give me your own Mathematical breakdown on how you would get to your pass vote?”””””””

 

[WeAAsles]

Jesus.

At least you’re honest, I guess.

Bob can be as honest as old Abe and it still wouldn’t matter if the deal he says would work for him wouldn’t pass if it were released anyway.

I’ve given the reasons why I believe it wouldn’t pass and I’ve yet to read someone refute me?

 

[bob@las-AA]

Ok but what you “want” I guarantee is less than you can “get” and in a perfect World I’d gladly see you get it and I’ll hold back just a little while longer thank you very much. But you’re gonna wait just a little some with us there Bud.

I also know Bob that you probably have a lot of catching up to do to account for getting into this career so late in life to set up some decent retirement goals so I am sympathetic for you in that area.

And I guess if you were PT for 60% of your career you didn’t even get in the 5 years to vest for a Pension before they pulled the rug out from under you huh?

that is correct.

 

[WeAAsles]

that is correct.

Ok Bob so what your clamoring for is another 3.5% on the back end from what the Company is selling and .22 cents or $358.00 for 12 months work on the front end (Not counting all the middle items you like)

Now break down that $3000 Bucks over 5 years.

Again I gave you a breakdown and I’m going to keep waiting for anyone out there to respond who thinks I’m wrong and it would pass?

Bob you consider yourself a smart dude so go ahead and have a crack at it? Bust me up and break it down?

 

[bob@las-AA]

Ok Bob so what your clamoring for is another 3.5% on the back end from what the Company is selling and .22 cents or $358.00 for 12 months work on the front end (Not counting all the middle items you like)

Now break down that $3000 Bucks over 5 years.

Again I gave you a breakdown and I’m going to keep waiting for anyone out there to respond who thinks I’m wrong and it would pass?

Bob you consider yourself a smart dude so go ahead and have a crack at it? Bust me up and break it down?

I’m working right now, and I will challenge this when I get home.