Allowing Bk Carriers To Destroy The Industry

[AA-MCI]

I figured landing at the correct airport was far more important then the correct use of the = by mistake. That's why I wasn't hired years ago. Afer all, we all have landed at the wrong airport..well, maybe not.

[post="257755"][/post]​

Taking off was a whole different issue, right? For a while there in the '90s we thought you guys were trying to open a seaplane hub at LGA! Remember, Ice on airfoil BAD.

 

[Dizel8]

For a while there in the '90s we thought you guys were trying to open a seaplane hub at LGA!

[post="257895"][/post]​

Now that is just mean, funny, but mean!

 

[C54Capt]

Back to the topic of this thread, there was an interesting piece published on www.atwonline.com, which quotes AirTran CEO Joe Leonard saying " There is no talk of making money. Those carriers (UAL, US) are getting by on handouts and riding on the backs of the taxpayers of the nation."

Although I agree in principle, these carriers are merely using BK as a business tool the way the laws are written. For those of you who are crying foul, I agree, the playing field is not level but take your frustrations out on your legislators not on your competitors, and certainly not on your competitor's employees.

 

[jimntx]

For those of you who are crying foul, I agree, the playing field is not level but take your frustrations out on your legislators not on your competitors, and certainly not on your competitor's employees.

[post="257948"][/post]​

Does anyone see the irony in the fact that Congress has just made it infinitely more difficult for individuals to file for bankruptcy or use the BK courts to escape debts, but business use of the same courts is not addressed at all?

Seems those pesky individuals have been living above their means and not being prudent in their finances. Businesses are just poor victims of circumstances and need the courts' protection. :huh:

 

[uafa21]

It just goes to show you that we have a double standard in the US. Corporations can get by with just about anything and not be held responsible while the actual voters, taxpayers and citizens are held responsible for everything.

Till we start holding elected officials responsible nothing will happen. The republican held Presidenceny, House and Senate have in my opinion been a failure. They have done nothing but take care of themselves and large mutinational corporations that made donations to put elected officials into power.

There should be no funds from corporations for elections. Money and support should only come from voters. As far as the bk laws, what a travistry. Individuals file bk for various reasons, some very valid some not. Corporations file mostly because of bad management. Individuals lose everything they have while corporations continue to operate and pilage.

It's all fair if a corporation lies, cheats, steals and murders. There is just no accountability.

 

[jimntx]

There should be no funds from corporations for elections. Money and support should only come from voters.

[post="257955"][/post]​

But, my dear, didn't you know that is already the case? Haven't you heard the Repubs in Congress and the U.S. Chamber of Commerce scream about the fact that unions can donate to political candidates, but corporations can not.

There is no corporate money donated to political campaigns. :huh: (If you don't believe me, just ask Tom DeLay. )

 

[uafa21]

It looks like NW is going to ask for wage consessions of $1.1B plus look at freezing the pension plan. This is just the tip of the old iceberg. Who's to blame for this idea?

 

[Bigsky]

United

 

[Busdrvr]

United

[post="259574"][/post]​

You guys are downright comical. Everybody seems to forget the below market rate loans that MN provided NWA (which are still outstanding) in exchange for MX jobs that got outsourced instead. Nor do you mention the huge paycuts you took at the time. Or the concessionary contratc your pilots signed BEFORE UAL's pilots took on. Incredible.

 

[North by Northwest]

OK Busdrv...for the 10th time. You have continuously brought the MN state financing up over and over again ... EACH time called out like a fool. The loan was REPAID and OBLIGATIONS for employment MET. Unlike United's pathetic inabilty to follow through with the state of IN and the WHITE elaphant built at IND. Furthermore, WHATEVER NWA, or NWA pilots did ....they did it OUT of BANKRUPTCY! A feat United didn't have the skill to accomplish( undenialble greed was more important to the goose that laid the golden egg, Ual pilots HAD to have MORE...and some MORE, and that STILL wasn't enough!). Your incredible denial as to why your EX company is a failure is nothing less than stupifying. Where was Il when United needed them? Clearly United didn't have the skill to deliver a sound business plan to the ATSB. Frankly, the ONLY business plan Ual has exhibited is to steal from employees and operate rudderlessly in Bankruptcy for GOD only knows HOW LONG. But, my dear friend since you no longer work there that is not your concern. Your intense bitterness at NWA's superior operational skill is evident, get over it focus on you new job.

 

[Busdrvr]

OK Busdrv...for the 10th time. You have continuously brought the MN state financing up over and over again ... EACH time called out like a fool. The loan was REPAID and OBLIGATIONS for employment MET. Unlike United's pathetic inabilty to follow through with the state of IN and the WHITE elaphant built at IND. Furthermore, WHATEVER NWA, or NWA pilots did ....they did it OUT of BANKRUPTCY! A feat United didn't have the skill to accomplish( undenialble greed was more important to the goose that laid the golden egg, Ual pilots HAD to have MORE...and some MORE, and that STILL wasn't enough!). Your incredible denial as to why your EX company is a failure is nothing less than stupifying. Where was Il when United needed them? Clearly United didn't have the skill to deliver a sound business plan to the ATSB. Frankly, the ONLY business plan Ual has exhibited is to steal from employees and operate rudderlessly in Bankruptcy for GOD only knows HOW LONG. But, my dear friend since you no longer work there that is not your concern. Your intense bitterness at NWA's superior operational skill is evident, get over it focus on you new job.

[post="259828"][/post]​

Pleace show me the previous 9 times I was "called out"

http://minneapolisfed.org/research/studies/econwar/pp97-4.cfm

Back in 1991, Northwest and other promoters of the financing disputed suggestions the deal was a “bailout.â€￾ But after the $270 million MAC loan was issued, the airline became more blunt about its financial difficulties. In hindsight, it seems clear the MAC operating loan was NWA's primary motive in seeking state aid, and that the base proposal became a secondary means to that end.
When announcing the revised base plan in April 1994, CEO John Dasburg said, “If it hadn't been for the $270 million that we received at the outset of this transaction, I fear that Northwest would not be here today.â€￾
Bruce Hendry says flatly that without the MAC's $270 million, NWA “most certainly would have been bankrupt.â€￾



http://www.brainerddispatch.com/stories/10...006030002.shtml

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) -- In 1992, Minnesota taxpayers loaned a troubled Northwest Airlines $270 million. Well, Northwest is still in trouble -- and after 11 years of payments, its tab with the state has actually grown by $12 million.
Further, the decline in the airline industry has hurt the value of Northwest's collateral backing those 1992 bonds -- pilot training equipment, airplane parts and European routes. The collateral's value has fallen by about $110 million, according to an estimate made by the Metropolitan Airports Commission, the Star Tribune reported on Sunday.

In a worst-case scenario, if Northwest were to default on payments, MAC could impose a property tax in the seven-county Twin Cities area to ensure that bond holders are repaid -- a power the airport authority has not used since 1969.

As to your slams on UAL, your pilots actually shut down the Airline in the 90's. all the while knowing that mamma Minny would bale your worthless carcass out again.

Please post the link that shows that NWA has no additional obligation to the State of Minny. also please post a link that shows that NWA lived up to the ORIGINAL commitments it made in exchange for taxpayer money. The history of the bailout has been NWA consistantly reniging on it's deal.

As to BK, you'll see it soon enough. unfortunately, the only assets you have for DIP are those "great 9's that despite your irrational ill informed rantings are now being parked (guess they aren't so wonderful after all). how's your pension funding?

 

[North by Northwest]

Here we go AGAIN...with Busd worrying about NWA while his company is swimming in BK. This is so tiresome. You have repeated this sad bitter mantra for going on three years. Don't you worry your little head about what NWA does. Don't be bitter because Ual made commitments with states and cities and companies and failed to live up to them. You are a joke to be laughed at everytime you attempt to predict the downfall of another company. Misery must be lonely. United is broken...FAILED. NWA is ongoing ...paying it's bills. United stole money from it's vendors to make temp payments on jets it can't afford, can't even aford C checks on. United can't even operate in Bankruptcy without worry about having it's jets REPO'ED! When that happens it surely will be the END. Now run along and spend some more time reading and researching NWA's operation. Maybe you can write your amatur CEO and tell him he should pay attention to how an old pro stays out of Bankruptcy.

 

[Globetrotter11]

North by Northwest :<<Here we go AGAIN...>>

I, for one, enjoy Busdrvrs postings. B)

Other than making disparaging remarks about him, would you care to comment on the substance of what he writes?

The troubling thing is that he usually has the facts on his side, it seems.

Globetrotter11

 

[N924PS]

Concerned with how NWA is operating... now that is a joke. Try it our way you might have a job next year. Why is it you contiually exhibit emotional imbalance when discussing reality? Ual = Broke, flying around in aircraft looking over their sholder for the REPO man. If I were you I would make sure I cash my pay check the same day. You are the SAME guy that is a continuous embarasment to Ual employees . Ual owns NOTHING...get it loser. Ual can't even finance a DC-9. Little history lesson Grasshopper, NWA was flying the Pacific when "international" for Ual was NY=LA. Ual won't even last 25 years in the international arena. So much for flying someone elses 777's. I'd take our "experience" for choice of aircraft any day. Take your severace pay and get some therapy. How in the hell did you get past the psych eval? Now say a prayer before bed that NWA does not announce a fare cut down the road. (Busdvr .. E asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum)

[post="254159"][/post]​

N by NW:

Just remember the bigger they are the harder they fall. And that includes pompous blowhards like you.

You're next in line at NWA, you just can't accept it. Much as the Delta folks had the "deer in the headlights" look. It CAN'T happen here. Wanna bet?

As Don Henley once sang "Get Over It!!"

 

[Busdrvr]

Here we go AGAIN...with Busd worrying about NWA while his company is swimming in BK. This is so tiresome. You have repeated this sad bitter mantra for going on three years. Don't you worry your little head about what NWA does.

Ummm Einstein, Who was it who started this thread on the NWA Board ABOUT UNITED? If anyone has some strange infatuation with someone elses company, that'd be you.

Oh and Thanks Globetrotter!!