Airlines/Liquididity.Strongest..to..Weakest

[FWAAA]

Time to steer this thread back to (my) original question of,...."who has the Most Liquidity" ?

Minus WN,I'm guessing American has the most Liquidity ($$$$)

I agree, based on the published numbers and not fantasy values.

$5B in cash.

Well, $4.6 billion of unrestricted cash, the amount that counts.

A regional Airline(If they had to sell it) worth more than the FEW remaining Regional's(That the other Carrier's OWN, like DL/Comair...NW/Compass...LCC/ ?....UA/ ?.......CO/ ?

Agreed. Dunno how valuable, but UA doesn't own any regionals nor does CO.

A FFlyer program(if they had to sell it) worth More than the others.

Agreed. Not worth anywhere near $4 - $9 billion, but then, no frequent flyer program is worth even a small fraction of those fantasy numbers. UA's current market cap is but $800 million; random substance tests are appropriate for anyone claiming that MP is worth 10 times the value of UAUA as a whole.

A "Full Sized" Maintenance division(if they had to sell it),more than the other carriers.

Dunno. But I'm sure that one of the chop shops or maybe even one of the respected MROs would pay something to take over AA maintenance bases, etc.

A computer system..SABRE, far more sophisticated than the others.

I don't see any value here - especially since Sabre is an independent company and AA is only a customer.

In addition to the above, AA has $5 billion of unencumbered assets against which it could borrow (assuming anyone will loan AA money).

UA apparently has $3 billion of unencumbered airplanes.

Last quarter, AMR's cash flow was over half a billion better than UA's. Interesting to see if UA turned that around in the second quarter.

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

A regional Airline(If they had to sell it) worth more than the FEW remaining Regional's(That the other Carrier's OWN, like DL/Comair...NW/Compass...LCC/ ?....UA/ ?.......CO/ ?

I wonder how much AE is really worth 'today"? I doubt there is a buyer who would be willing to pay what AMR might be asking for AE, and at the same time I don't think AMR is desperate enough (yet) to sell AE for the amount of $$$ that may be offered 'today".

I think the frequent flyer program would be item that would bring in most money, if/when AMR gets desperate to sell it, followed by the "maintenance division" followed by AE.

 

[Hi-C-Camp]

I wonder how much AE is really worth 'today"? I doubt there is a buyer who would be willing to pay what AMR might be asking for AE, and at the same time I don't think AMR is desperate enough (yet) to sell AE for the amount of $$$ that may be offered 'today".

I think the frequent flyer program would be item that would bring in most money, if/when AMR gets desperate to sell it, followed by the "maintenance division" followed by AE.

The problem is - no one wants to purchase a regional, that is not a secret... For FWAAA, sorry charlie, but MP is worth more than AAdvantage... This goes with the mindset at AMR thinking that b/c they are bigger they are better or worth more... But who cares anyway, not worth talking to a brick wall about it..

 

[FA Mikey]

The problem is - no one wants to purchase a regional, that is not a secret... For FWAAA, sorry charlie, but MP is worth more than AAdvantage... This goes with the mindset at AMR thinking that b/c they are bigger they are better or worth more... But who cares anyway, not worth talking to a brick wall about it..

Care to explain with facts how and why its worth more than AAdvantage.

 

[FWAAA]

Care to explain with facts how and why its worth more than AAdvantage.

You and your pesky "facts."

It's more fun to argue made-up fantasy numbers.

MP may very well be worth more than AAdvantage. If it is, wonder what UA is waiting for? Why not sell MP and pay down (or maybe payoff all) debt? And buy some new fuel efficient planes with the excess?

 

[FA Mikey]

Numbers and facts can be so burdensome at times. I doubt MP would be worth more, if based on nothing more than UAL precarious financial position. If someone bought MP and UAL failed, its basically worth zilch. After all most people gain miles from and cash them in for air travel. It applies to AA and all the other carriers as well. What is the value of Eagle if AA wasnt here using the seats? What is the value of UAL or AMR maintenance if the principal revenue stream (AMR or UAL ) ceased operations or shurnk to a fraction of thier size?

 

[Hopeful]

Yeah, my boss is his wife....

At least she has more balls than you...

 

[eolesen]

Uh, let's leave the childish personal attacks out of this.... take it to PM's if you have to.



I also disagree that MP would be worth more than AAdvantage. AAdv has a larger base than the other programs, and it's got better name recognition.

 

[bwipilot]

In regards to CAL joining the STAR alliance: maybe CAL saw how bad of shape UAL is in and figured it would be great to become the primary US domestic carrier for the STAR aliance when UAL goes kaput.

 

[Fly]

Or maybe they read tht AA had the highest chance of going bankrupt so decided to steer clear.

 

[FrequentFlierCA]

Or maybe they read tht AA had the highest chance of going bankrupt so decided to steer clear.

Maybe, but UA has greater cash burn than anybody else. I see them as having the greatest risk of bankruptcy (probably Chapter 7 this time). I read an article today that talked about the pilot furloughs; if UA hadn't done that their unrestricted cash would have fallen under $1 billion in early 2009, causing several loan covenants to be breached.

Bottom line: they are in bad shape.