Aircraft maint issues

[B737 driver]

This was my response to the Watcher on the WN forums, not you guys.

 

[swamt]

The association should have never signed to work on each other’s metal until they brought TWU up to the same benefits the IAM had. We need to stop arguing amongst ourselves and focus on getting the best possible contract for all.

BINGO!!! I said that the day it was announced. That was their one and "only" leverage that the asso. just agreed to and handed it over to them without any say so from the membership. That day is when you guys lost any hope of a quick JCBA.

 

[swamt]

The IAM NEVER told its members there would be a vote.

Why focus on this?

It won’t help you get a contract, it will actually hurt it, company is playing the employees, divide and conquer and you play right into their hands.

Wrong. The asso. did promise a vote. The asso. is made up of the IAM and the TWU combining and became the new asso.. Both the TWU and the IAM promised a vote until it was rammed down the members throats by the NMB certifying it with no membership vote. They lied. lied lied and will continue to do so and you will just keep on believing, believing and believing them...

 

[swamt]

No one is playing me. I can read and research. Maybe you should do the same. Do some digging into multi-employer pension plans. The TEAMSTERS are great case study.
Did you believe the IAM when they told you that you would lose your IAM pension if you voted them out and went for AMFA?

Of course he did, as he did admit. The IAM said with no doubt that the guys would in fact lose not freeze they said the guys would lose their pensions. It was a scare tactic to keep the other unions from getting voted in. We had detailed discussions on this. The IAM was saying they would lose the pensions and I was trying to tell the guys that it may stop getting funded but they would not lose it and for them to nego a better 401K match to offset it. I remember it like it was yesterday.

 

[The Watcher]

They did no such thing and even provided the proof.

It would have been frozen, if you had less than five years it would be a lump sum payment.

I was at the road shows with the pension people and read it in black and white.

How many times must this be gone over by people not in the plan?

 

[Rogallo]

The association should have never signed to work on each other’s metal until they brought TWU up to the same benefits the IAM had. We need to stop arguing amongst ourselves and focus on getting the best possible contract for all.

Then the association should be abolished and one union should step aside. JMHO!

"One Union, One voice" What a concept!!

 

[swamt]

Not a problem. We outnumber you 2-1...When you fall, it's gonna hurt reaaal bad.

Typical LUS employee feeling.

Yes you do outnumber them. And it's gonna hurt really bad when the get the true experience of being outnumbered 2 to 1. LOL. I can't wait to see the redemption. Payback is a biatch!!!

 

[The Watcher]

Yes you do outnumber them. And it's gonna hurt really bad when the get the true experience of being outnumbered 2 to 1. LOL. I can't wait to see the redemption. Payback is a biatch!!!

Do you work for AA?

 

[swamt]

Do you work for AA?

Maybe...

 

[The Watcher]

Maybe...

Credibility

Or shall I say lack of?

 

[The Watcher]

AMERICAN’S RISKY RETIREMENT PROPOSAL
29 Mar 2018

The TWU-IAM Association bargaining committee is committed to fighting for industry-best retirement security. Aside from frozen pension and PBGC benefits that apply to pre-merger employees, today’s retirement benefits for Legacy American Airlines Association members come in the form of a 401(k) with company matching contributions while Legacy U.S. Airways Association members have a Defined Benefit Plan and a 401(k) with no matching contributions. Both retirement plans now lag behind industry standards and require improvement. The company’s proposal, however, fails to provide the retirement security that we deserve.

Steve Johnsen’s proposal falls short of industry-leading and even fails to reach its own internal standards. Currently, American Flight Attendants receive a maximum 401(k) company contribution of 9.9% while American Pilots receive 16%. In neither of these cases are employee contributions required. Brothers and Sisters, we deserve better than the company’s inadequate proposal.

Ultimately, retirement plans are about risk. American Airlines is attempting to shift as much retirement risk away from the company and to the employee as they can get away with. Your negotiating committee rejects company proposals that unnecessarily shift retirement risk to the membership and will not allow American Airlines to treat our members like second-class citizens. We are committed to fighting for and winning the retirement security we deserve.

Fraternally,

Your Association Negotiating Committee

 

[B737 driver]

AMERICAN’S RISKY RETIREMENT PROPOSAL
29 Mar 2018

The TWU-IAM Association bargaining committee is committed to fighting for industry-best retirement security. Aside from frozen pension and PBGC benefits that apply to pre-merger employees, today’s retirement benefits for Legacy American Airlines Association members come in the form of a 401(k) with company matching contributions while Legacy U.S. Airways Association members have a Defined Benefit Plan and a 401(k) with no matching contributions. Both retirement plans now lag behind industry standards and require improvement. The company’s proposal, however, fails to provide the retirement security that we deserve.

Steve Johnsen’s proposal falls short of industry-leading and even fails to reach its own internal standards. Currently, American Flight Attendants receive a maximum 401(k) company contribution of 9.9% while American Pilots receive 16%. In neither of these cases are employee contributions required. Brothers and Sisters, we deserve better than the company’s inadequate proposal.

Ultimately, retirement plans are about risk. American Airlines is attempting to shift as much retirement risk away from the company and to the employee as they can get away with. Your negotiating committee rejects company proposals that unnecessarily shift retirement risk to the membership and will not allow American Airlines to treat our members like second-class citizens. We are committed to fighting for and winning the retirement security we deserve.

Fraternally,

Your Association Negotiating Committee

Ok I will interject Watcher if this was a 401k with a match, your money, Union has no access to it. Your pension gets frozen and eventually insolvent, you are dealing with a dinosaur. If your employer goes bankrupt, like USair pension gets cut. That's the first thing they want the bankruptcy judge to throw out. Your 401k , yours. My 401k with 24 years @ SWA , plus profit sharing, not bad. The old guys been here for 30 to 40+, they have well over 2 million. Tell me watcher how is your pension?

 

[The Watcher]

The union has no access to the IAMNPF monies.

Educate yourself on it and how it works.

The pension is a total separate entity from the IAM.

It’s run by a director who is chosen by the plan’s trustees, who are made up of half chosen by the IAM and half chosen by the employers who participate in the fund.

There are some IBT members who are in the plan as the IAM and IBT have a few employers where the IAM and IBT do coordinated bargaining and the IBT has no access to the money.

The ramp didn’t get a reduction in the IAMNPF due to either of US Airways bankruptcy cases.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

When you 401k doesn’t perform because of the stock market who is responsible for making up th losses?

Some people’s 401k’s will run out of money before they die.

Can’t say the same for a DBP as it’s insured.

The man is who created the 401k has even stated its purpose is to supplement your retirement money. Not be your main retirement source. Corporate America has bamboozled workers and sold them a bag of beans.

My US Airways’ DBP was terminated I will receive the same amount for the years of service in the plan with no reduction of accrued benefits. I just didn’t earn any future credit.

And if a company files bankruptcy it won’t cause the IAMNPF to be thrown out by the courts.

Big rule difference from a single employer plan vs a multi employer plan.

Please stop with misinformation.

And Fidelity has been fined numerous times in regards to 401k violations they were found guilty of.

 

[B737 driver]

So tell m

The union has no access to the IAMNPF monies.

Educate yourself on it and how it works.

The pension is a total separate entity from the IAM.

It’s run by a director who is chosen by the plan’s trustees, who are made up of half chosen by the IAM and half chosen by the employers who participate in the fund.

There are some IBT members who are in the plan as the IAM and IBT have a few employers where the IAM and IBT do coordinated bargaining and the IBT has no access to the money.

The ramp didn’t get a reduction in the IAMNPF due to either of US Airways bankruptcy cases.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

When you 401k doesn’t perform because of the stock market who is responsible for making up th losses?

Some people’s 401k’s will run out of money before they die.

Can’t say the same for a DBP as it’s insured.

The man is who created the 401k has even stated its purpose is to supplement your retirement money. Not be your main retirement source. Corporate America has bamboozled workers and sold them a bag of beans.

My US Airways’ DBP was terminated I will receive the same amount for the years of service in the plan with no reduction of accrued benefits. I just didn’t earn any future credit.

And if a company files bankruptcy it won’t cause the IAMNPF to be thrown out by the courts.

Big rule difference from a single employer plan vs a multi employer plan.

Please stop with misinformation.

And Fidelity has been fined numerous times in regards to 401k violations they were found guilty of.

So tell me expert how is your frozen pension?

 

[The Watcher]

My pension isn’t frozen, it was terminated. Did you not read the post you are quoting?

Already answered and explained, go read it again.

And you blew off the whole post.

AA froze the TWU represented employees pension and have to make up the shortfall in the plans for around $2 billion as its underfunded.