Aircraft maint issues

[WeAAsles]

I wish I was wrong.

No you want the person you’re getting your “word” from to be wrong.

You seriously think they’re only offering those 5, 5 and 5 things you mentioned? Seriously?

Why would they be offering concessions against what one side already has much better?

This week should be very interesting?

 

[Deleted member 14439]

No you want the person you’re getting your “word” from to be wrong.

You seriously think they’re only offering those 5, 5 and 5 things you mentioned? Seriously?

Why would they be offering concessions against what one side already has much better?

This week should be very interesting?

Weez, i`m hearing much of the same Vort is. Scope is going to hit us hard in maintenance. I hope you guys in fleet do better. I seriously doubt anything of substance comes out this week. I`m betting they will set future negotiations dates and thats about it. Happy Presidents day! LUS AMTs are making 2x today if they are working.

 

[Vortilon]

These are the estimated prices for an A&P course study at a tech school in my area. They have an (donated) MD80 aircraft at the school for the students to study and learn from as well as many other aircraft. (I will let you guess who donated it)

Airframe

Estimated Tuition, Lab & Required Fees: $5,600.00
Additional Required Costs: $2906.90**

Powerplant

Estimated Tuition Fees: $5,600.00
Additional Required Costs: $2810.50**

Total of $16917.40 investment for a what..... just under 100K a year with full benefits.

An A&P is starting to look like a better and better deal all of the time.

What do you say about a dispatcher who goes to night school for 3 months spends less than half of what an A&P does for tuition, and only a fraction of the FAA required 1900 hrs of instruction - yet makes even more than an A&P? Obtaining dispatch qualification where i went to school was an elective. All that for a job that could pretty much be done with a cell phone app. As long as we are on topic of comparing jobs and pay vs education, nothing against pilots - my college roommate was one, but aside from the ratings and flight time, there isn't a degree requirement. Sure, it would be preferred, but not necessary.

Then for the fresh A&P school graduate, there are 3 FAA tests that must be passed, two written, and one practical with a DME. These are not free. Next step would be gaining experience to put on a resume', unless the budding A&P had some prior experience from the military for example. Most large airlines require 5 years heavy jet experience to qualify for an A&P position. Then if the applicant is successful, and gets hired - they can look forward to working night shift for many years, working on holidays, and having oddball days off. Last but not least, the applicant better be able to pass a drug and alcohol screening. Doug Parker couldn't even pass that.

There is a lot more to it, than you're suggesting with your post.

 

[Buck]

What do you say about a dispatcher who goes to night school for 3 months spends less than half of what an A&P does for tuition, and only a fraction of the FAA required 1900 hrs of instruction - yet makes even more than an A&P? Obtaining dispatch qualification where i went to school was an elective. All that for a job that could pretty much be done with a cell phone app. As long as we are on topic of comparing jobs and pay vs education, nothing against pilots - my college roommate was one, but aside from the ratings and flight time, there isn't a degree requirement. Sure, it would be preferred, but not necessary.

Then for the fresh A&P school graduate, there are 3 FAA tests that must be passed, two written, and one practical with a DME. These are not free. Next step would be gaining experience to put on a resume', unless the budding A&P had some prior experience from the military for example. Most large airlines require 5 years heavy jet experience to qualify for an A&P position. Then if the applicant is successful, and gets hired - they can look forward to working night shift for many years, working on holidays, and having oddball days off. Last but not least, the applicant better be able to pass a drug and alcohol screening. Doug Parker couldn't even pass that.

There is a lot more to it, than you're suggesting with your post.

There may be a lot less to it.

Look at A&P Fast Track.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez, i`m hearing much of the same Vort is. Scope is going to hit us hard in maintenance. I hope you guys in fleet do better. I seriously doubt anything of substance comes out this week. I`m betting they will set future negotiations dates and thats about it. Happy Presidents day! LUS AMTs are making 2x today if they are working.

Vort didn’t mention anything about SCOPE in his post. It was the Holidays, Vacation and Sick time that I was alluding that he might be getting bad info on.

As far as thinning your ranks on jobs I’ve heard many of the same voices in the wind floating my way as you. I really don’t know if any of that has changed lately but I think this week could be a catalyst maybe?

 

[Vortilon]

There may be a lot less to it.

Look at A&P Fast Track.

That's nothing new, refresher courses for people with prior verifiable experience. The FAA requirements for A&P schooling or verifiable experience haven't changed.

 

[Vortilon]

Vort didn’t mention anything about SCOPE in his post. It was the Holidays, Vacation and Sick time that I was alluding that he might be getting bad info on.

As far as thinning your ranks on jobs I’ve heard many of the same voices in the wind floating my way as you. I really don’t know if any of that has changed lately but I think this week could be a catalyst maybe?

Bottom line, the company is not improving their last offer, anybody paying attention knew what was on that proposal. Now. that is from the horses mouth. At the time, the NC told the company "if this proposal is so good, show it to the members". The company thought better of that. There is debate on weather or not to show everybody just what the company thinks about us. I guess they didn't want an all out mutiny, Some of the company negotiators are just plain devil spawn. The company has no use for facilities maintenance in the future. The company wants the future stores headcount greatly reduced as well. Also, the LUS guys don't want to be forced on to the same lovely medical plan we have been saddled with. The TWU's track record of preventing headcount reduction is sketchy at best.

The only incentive the company has to get a deal done - is that on the Aircraft Maintenance side, there is still a lot of separation between LUS and LAA, Until there is a JCBA in place, the company can't move aircraft where they want them. The company really thinks the LAA people are content

 

[WeAAsles]

Bottom line, the company is not improving their last offer, anybody paying attention knew what was on that proposal. Now. that is from the horses mouth. At the time, the NC told the company "if this proposal is so good, show it to the members". The company thought better of that. There is debate on weather or not to show everybody just what the company thinks about us. I guess they didn't want an all out mutiny, Some of the company negotiators are just plain devil spawn. The company has no use for facilities maintenance in the future. The company wants the future stores headcount greatly reduced as well. Also, the LUS guys don't want to be forced on to the same lovely medical plan we have been saddled with. The TWU's track record of preventing headcount reduction is sketchy at best.

The only incentive the company has to get a deal done - is that on the Aircraft Maintenance side, there is still a lot of separation between LUS and LAA, Until there is a JCBA in place, the company can't move aircraft where they want them. The company really thinks the LAA people are content

Now all of that I’ve heard. Personally if this goes on much longer IMO our guys should put out a proposal like that publicly.

If the Company can bypass the Negotiations process like they did last July posting that stuff on Jetnet, we should know about all the gory details they chose to leave out as well.

 

[dfw gen]

Word out of Negotiations is the company isn't coming off their offer from 6 months ago. They think 5 weeks of vacation is industry leading while UAL is sitting at 7 weeks. The company thinks 5 holidays at time and one half is industry leading. The company thinks earning 5 sick days per year is industry leading. Oddly enough, the company is okay with restoring full pay for the first day. For the guys who like to work doubles, now the company only wants to pay for 15.5 hours instead of 16. This info needs to be put paper, and distributed.

That is a fact. That is what tge company is offering.

 

[Deleted member 14439]

Now all of that I’ve heard. Personally if this goes on much longer IMO our guys should put out a proposal like that publicly.

If the Company can bypass the Negotiations process like they did last July posting that stuff on Jetnet, we should know about all the gory details they chose to leave out as well.

Agreed. I feel like the NC should be putting the information out to the members. Imho guys are going to be very surprised and terribly disappointed in what the company defines as industry leading.

 

[dfw gen]

I hate coming in here, because one fool knows it all.
But what you are saying is true vort. Talk to someone else that listens to the friday morning confrence call. They will tell you the same thing that i hear.

 

[Buck]

That's nothing new, refresher courses for people with prior verifiable experience. The FAA requirements for A&P schooling or verifiable experience haven't changed.

In Tulsa at the Maintenance Base there is alot of speculationof not so much a reduction in force, but a realignment of the work groups.No one is openly discussing the number of mechanics. However as the MD80 eases into retirement, there is alot of support groups. A direct support of similar parts overhauled for the 737 Fleet would make this "transition" easier. But we are getting a lot of new aircraft.

 

[Buck]

Agreed. I feel like the NC should be putting the information out to the members. Imho guys are going to be very surprised and terribly disappointed in what the company defines as industry leading.

Overall the negotiation committee has never released pre-TA language to membership at the TWU.

 

[Deleted member 14439]

Overall the negotiation committee has never released pre-TA language to membership at the TWU.

I know. How has that worked out. I believe it's time to change tactics. The NC should put the information out. Maybe then the membership would get pissed off enough to support them.

 

[Buck]

I know. How has that worked out. I believe it's time to change tactics. The NC should put the information out. Maybe then the membership would get pissed off enough to support them.

The new disclaimer has been the Company and the Association has placed a super secret password on the TA.