AE/Envoy Pilots Reject AIP

[eolesen]

At least get the facts straight on what I think, IOR... I've known the former GM at PDX for over 20 years, and am well aware of what happened there. I also listed the stations which were outsourced as part of the bankruptcy.

The point is that john john keeps insinuating that there is more outsourcing coming.

The fact is that there's nothing left below 8 mainline departures a day, and past practice proves that old AA wouldn't outsource above the wing where they're insourced below. There's no business case for doing that. I wouldn't expect new AA to change that.

CWA expects that they'll be able to put the outsourcing genie back into the bottle.

My guess is that if the agents vote in CWA, a new Class III will wind up in the contract which covers stations where no other AA classification is insourced. I don't see new AA agreeing to restoring agents at stations where maintenance and fleet won't exist.

 

[IORFA]

Just pointing out one station I know for a fact goes against what you said. You stated AA only outsourced agents at stations that were losing mainline. That is false. They outsourced PDX and mainline never left. In fact, they have grown to the size they used to be for years, before they purposely downsized long enough to outsource the ramp first. Since you know the schmuck who was in PDX, is he still employed in TUS? If so, it is a shame that people like that are still involved with AA!

 

[IORFA]

You've made that claim before, so do you care to back it up?Exactly how many and which mainline stations or jobs have been shifted to Eagle or proposed to shift in the past two years?Specifics, please... not the typical CWA threat of what might happen. AA's had that flexibility for decades, and the only times that card has been played is when the station is being closed to mainline altogether.The only thing that comes close is bag drop staffing, which in my opinion is no different than putting a Skycap behind a desk.CWA hasn't managed to prevent US from using Skycaps, or forced them to be insourced, have they?...

.
Here is your post I'm talking about.

 

[eolesen]

is he still employed in TUS?

Yep. My guess is he'll retire there, since US doesn't serve the city except for Mesa.

You're right regarding the timing for PDX, ONT, etc., but it is a fact that AA didn't pull the trigger on those stations until after the restructuring and the lease rejections at various airports & other locations were worked out. If AA had years to do it "just because they can" why didn't they?...

And the larger point still stands that john john can't manage to come up with specifics when asked.

 

[jimntx]

Jim, it is a $3.00 override. In your example, at AA the only MEX route paid international rates is MIA-MEX-MIA. Any other MEX flight is domestic. The only reason for this is that it is cheaper to pay more and fly a more direct route over the gulf.

 
 
Thanks for the info.  I really did think the override was $2.00.  I was just making up an example because  I know some IMA flight attendants were unhappy over a MIA-MEX-DFW-MIA sequence because "they are International f/as and they should be paid the override for every leg."  The company and the union had to point out to them that was not what the contract said.  I forget whether it was the MEX-DFW and DFW-MIA legs or just the DFW-MIA leg that didn't get the override.  I know when I have to work any Mexico flight out of DFW, I get nada other than regular flight pay.

 

[DFWFSC]

Yep. My guess is he'll retire there, since US doesn't serve the city except for Mesa.

You're right regarding the timing for PDX, ONT, etc., but it is a fact that AA didn't pull the trigger on those stations until after the restructuring and the lease rejections at various airports & other locations were worked out. If AA had years to do it "just because they can" why didn't they?...

And the larger point still stands that john john can't manage to come up with specifics when asked.

US still has mainline agents and managers at a few smaller cities that are grandfathered in somehow
even though all the flights are express....according to a guy I work with who use to work in ABQ or ELP....somewhere out that way.

 

[IORFA]

Thanks for the info.  I really did think the override was $2.00.  I was just making up an example because  I know some IMA flight attendants were unhappy over a MIA-MEX-DFW-MIA sequence because "they are International f/as and they should be paid the override for every leg."  The company and the union had to point out to them that was not what the contract said.  I forget whether it was the MEX-DFW and DFW-MIA legs or just the DFW-MIA leg that didn't get the override.  I know when I have to work any Mexico flight out of DFW, I get nada other than regular flight pay.

To make it even more cornfusing, we just got an AA.com email about the international override. Apparently, starting in February, ALL international F/A's will be paid the override for ALL trips in their entirety. Domestic legs included if any. Even an international reserve working an all domestic sequence will be paid the override, like it used to be. On the other hand, domestic F/A's working an international trip will only be paid the override for the international legs worked. Sounds like they are being lazy. For the last few months, they were adding the override after every trip for every F/A. I get the feeling it is easier to just "flip" the switch back on to the way they used to do it. Probably easier and cheaper.

 

[john john]

Yep. My guess is he'll retire there, since US doesn't serve the city except for Mesa.

You're right regarding the timing for PDX, ONT, etc., but it is a fact that AA didn't pull the trigger on those stations until after the restructuring and the lease rejections at various airports & other locations were worked out. If AA had years to do it "just because they can" why didn't they?...

And the larger point still stands that john john can't manage to come up with specifics when asked.

What specifics? What you have is an airline that views their employees as a liability and will outsources whipsaw interfere when they can
Management did everything possible to deny PSAs a election, pads election list, refuses to cooperate with federal agency in charge of elections, uses court injunction to delay and began massive outsourcing of jobs until US Court of Appeals rules election should proceed

 

[RJcasualty]

PSA struggles:                                                                                                                                                      
Staffing Shortage Update
PSA management has recently taken a number of actions in an attempt to mitigate the pilot staffing shortage. First, management denied or canceled all Association leave for January, February, and March. Second, this weekend, management decided to hold four pilots at PSA indefinitely rather than allow them to begin a class at US Airways in March.

Third, management advised the MEC yesterday that it was canceling vacations for pilots bidding in Round 2 due to extremely short staffing in March. Section 7.H of the Collective Bargaining Agreement describes the responsibilities of pilots and the company when taking this action. As the shortage continues, further vacation cancellations may occur, so every pilot is encouraged to review the language.

Fourth, management has canceled selected recurrent training events—both ground schools and LOFT sessions—over the past week to mitigate the shortage temporarily. This move creates a number of contractual complications in the rescheduling of these events. Delaying training is also unsustainable as it creates further training backlog.

The MEC is concerned that management’s focus on fixing immediate problems will compound the difficulties of implementing new aircraft. Therefore, we strongly encourage PSA management to take a longer view, using realistic targets with a sufficient margin to allow for success. Attempting to operate on a razor thin margin reduces the chances of success during the coming year and is likely to deteriorate the working environment for PSA pilots. We mustn’t be the continued victims of improper planning.

 

[nycbusdriver]

PSA struggles:                                                                                                                                                      
Staffing Shortage Update
PSA management has recently taken a number of actions in an attempt to mitigate the pilot staffing shortage. First, management denied or canceled all Association leave for January, February, and March. Second, this weekend, management decided to hold four pilots at PSA indefinitely rather than allow them to begin a class at US Airways in March.

Third, management advised the MEC yesterday that it was canceling vacations for pilots bidding in Round 2 due to extremely short staffing in March. Section 7.H of the Collective Bargaining Agreement describes the responsibilities of pilots and the company when taking this action. As the shortage continues, further vacation cancellations may occur, so every pilot is encouraged to review the language.

Fourth, management has canceled selected recurrent training events—both ground schools and LOFT sessions—over the past week to mitigate the shortage temporarily. This move creates a number of contractual complications in the rescheduling of these events. Delaying training is also unsustainable as it creates further training backlog.

The MEC is concerned that management’s focus on fixing immediate problems will compound the difficulties of implementing new aircraft. Therefore, we strongly encourage PSA management to take a longer view, using realistic targets with a sufficient margin to allow for success. Attempting to operate on a razor thin margin reduces the chances of success during the coming year and is likely to deteriorate the working environment for PSA pilots. We mustn’t be the continued victims of improper planning.

 
 
Sounds like PSA management is trying to plug holes in the dike, but ignoring the fact that the foundation is washing away.
 
And so it begins.
 
Will PSA slowly come to a screeching halt, or will it be a quick meltdown.
 
If I were Delta or United, I would be snatching up PSA pilots first, just to watch it implode. And those PSA pilots being held from mainline?  I would get them in the next class, even if I had to schedule an "extra section!"

 

[RJcasualty]

There's also talk that Envoy is ready to sweeten the rejected AIP--- just enough to sway the bed-wetters. Stay tuned.

 

[RJcasualty]

Foster parenting has reached its limits at RAH:  http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2014/02/republic-ceo-we-havent-talked-to-american-airlines-about-getting-more-jets.html/

 

[nycbusdriver]

Foster parenting has reached its limits at RAH:  http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2014/02/republic-ceo-we-havent-talked-to-american-airlines-about-getting-more-jets.html/

 
I love it!  Been anticipating this development for over 30 years!
 
If Republic, one of the "better" of the regionals, cannot retain/attract pilots, is Mesa even in business anymore?

 

[will fix for food]

I love it!  Been anticipating this development for over 30 years!
 
If Republic, one of the "better" of the regionals, cannot retain/attract pilots, is Mesa even in business anymore?

Yes they are still in business and hiring.

By hiring I mean they call you up and ask you if you have 1500 and an ATP and if you say "yes" , they give you a class date. No silly interview required.

And no, I'm not kidding.

 

[mwa]

2 reps have found a way to finagle another vote - the increased sweetness has yet to be disclosed. More like sour grapes for the yes voters.