A Little Fairness

[Hopeful]

Finally a little fair play

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

WAIT!!!!!!!!!

I thought that cio, twuer and the other alias posting twu supporters were singing that there would be no election? Does the NMB's granting of an extension mean that NO DECISION was made with Ms. Hennessey's ruling?

I can't wait to read the twu's spin on this one!

Perhaps the NMB will allow a fair, democratic election at AA so AMTs can chose a craft union that holds itself accountable to the members because the members ARE THE UNION!

GO AMFA!

The twu smoke & mirror machine will go into overdrive over this!

 

[Nightwatch]

TWU's spin? Really Ken, I believe the NMB is being fair. AMFA filed for an extension and one was granted? If you see more than that then I'm happy for you.

Perhaps the NMB will allow a fair, democratic election at AA so AMTs can chose a craft union that holds itself accountable to the members because the members ARE THE UNION!

When have you entered a undemocratic vote? Most times when you vote by ballet that is considered democratic. But what happens if AMFA would, God say it's not so, lose? Would the vote have been fixed? And a real quick newsflash Ken, the members are currently the union now, that wouldn't change.

I somewhat understand your elation, but let's not wet ourselves.

 

[Bob Owens]

TWU's spin? Really Ken, I believe the NMB is being fair. AMFA filed for an extension and one was granted? If you see more than that then I'm happy for you.



When have you entered a undemocratic vote? Most times when you vote by ballet that is considered democratic. But what happens if AMFA would, God say it's not so, lose? Would the vote have been fixed? And a real quick newsflash Ken, the members are currently the union now, that wouldn't change.

I somewhat understand your elation, but let's not wet ourselves.

There you go again NW. Maybe you better get some sleep.

Ken never said anything about an "undemocratic vote". Thats your term. He did say "fair democratic election". The Soviets used to vote too, but we did not consider them to be "fair democratic elections".

 

[Hopeful]

CIO and the boys did say NO ELECTION. We're just pointing out that Hennessey allowed the additional names to be included. She never said NO ELECTION.

 

[twuer]

I didn't see Hennessey's name on that document. Merely protocol! All this proves is that amfa doesn't have all their eggs in one basket, all their ducks in a row or better yet they don't have their crap together!!!

 

[Hopeful]

Not that document. The one where Hennessey declared those additional names to be included. She never stated NO ELECTION, just those names to be included.

 

[scorpion]

I didn't see Hennessey's name on that document. Merely protocol! All this proves is that amfa doesn't have all their eggs in one basket, all their ducks in a row or better yet they don't have their crap together!!!

No! Actually it means there are a butt load of reasons to appeal and more time is needed to give an accurate accounting. Its called having your crap together, getting all your ducks in a row, making sure you don't miss any rotton eggs so they can all be accounted for.

 

[Raptor]

Listen if you guys are getting excited over an extension I wouldn't I am sure this is the NMB's way of saying they were fair and impartial when they come back and say Hennesseys ruling stands, I have no doubt that the board is not even looking at the case anymore, Odds are very high that the NMB is not going to change her ruling and the TWU supporters know it, it ain't never been done before and it won't be done this time, The NMB is not dumb they know how to play the we are being fair game when really they are doing nothing of the kind they are simply playing the game the way they have in the past.

Don't get your hopes up on the NMB guys cause you will only be disappointed again.

You might as well start getting ready for that next drive.

You know there are three types of thinking optimistic thinking, pessimistic thinking and Reality thinking, I practice Reality thinking good bad or ugly the other two are a waste of time to me.

If you cut your hand and bleed 3 out of 3 times there is a very high probability that on the 4th time you will bleed as well that is the realitiy of the situation wishing that you won't will not change it.

 

[Hopeful]

Who needs another drive?

Little says he's going to fix everything and make nice with the AMFA supporters!

 

[Raptor]

Who needs another drive?

Little says he's going to fix everything and make nice with the AMFA supporters!

Hmmmm <_< I wouldn't put to much faith in that either
The world just isn't fair and we picked the wrong profession

Blood sucking Lawyers are where all the money is these days, and maybe the medical profession I would like to see them send that over sea's or hire OSM to do that work. It ain't going to happen.

 

[Buck]

So the TWU supporters are not happy with the concessions they brought upon themselves and now they have no faith in their own unelected leadership to fix what has been done.

So I ask you Raptor and any other TWU supporter, what is the solution, what would you have Jim Little dictate to the membership?

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

TWU's spin? Really Ken, I believe the NMB is being fair. AMFA filed for an extension and one was granted? If you see more than that then I'm happy for you.



When have you entered a undemocratic vote? Most times when you vote by ballet that is considered democratic. But what happens if AMFA would, God say it's not so, lose? Would the vote have been fixed? And a real quick newsflash Ken, the members are currently the union now, that wouldn't change.

I somewhat understand your elation, but let's not wet ourselves.

nw,

The "spin" I speak of is how twu supporters claimed there will be no election after Ms. Hennessey made her ruling before she split for greener pastures. The NMB never said that there would NOT be an election. But the twu supporters and little included read what they wanted to read.

I never said UNDEMOCRATIC VOTE. I mention a FAIR, DEMOCRATIC ELECTION. I do not mean the type of "election" like the twu wants. You know, the type where you can CHANGE your vote after casting it. That is not democratic.

When you vote by ballot that makes it democratic nw? That is partly correct. But mostly only if EVERYONE eligible to vote gets a ballot to cast. What happened to the individuals that did not get a PIN to vote on concessions at AA recently? That certainly was NOT a democratic vote. Or how about having a sham of an election like the twu had for concession only to have jim little accept the contract AFTER we were told we would have a FULL REVOTE? Oh, since the courts ruled that the twu owns the contract the members do not have a voice in voting for or against said contract that makes it democratic too?

nw, the members in the twu ARE NOT the union. Are you really that dense? The international owns the contract NOT the members. However, the members suffer under the contract.

I am not "wetting" myself nw. That can be accomplished by the coffin toating teamtwu members after AMFA wins a FAIR & DEMOCRATIC ELECTION!

 

[Raptor]

So the TWU supporters are not happy with the concessions they brought upon themselves and now they have no faith in their own unelected leadership to fix what has been done.

So I ask you Raptor and any other TWU supporter, what is the solution, what would you have Jim Little dictate to the membership?

I am glad you asked what the solution is here it come so get ready.

First we all quit AA get out of the dieing Aviation Industry and go to Medical school to be a Doctor of some sort after that we rake in the cash from the misery of all those millions of sick people who cannot get cheaper Medical care over sea's
That is pretty much the only solution I have got it won't be easy especially at 40 something years old but it can't be much harder than getting AMFA in at AA

The truth is I don't think there is a solution to the problems of our Industry I am not so sure that hard times are not going to be here in Aviation for quite awhile and at this point, I don't necessarily think that changing Unions is going to make that much of a difference, it might if good times come back and the Airlines have alot of money again, if not then I think we will all have to get use to the amount of money we are making in this Industry and deal with it as best we can.
I am not looking to make any new purchases for a long time.
Northwest's contract is amendable next year it will be interesting to see what happens in this tough economy.

No matter what happens I have restructered my finances to deal with the less pay and I am no longer suffering, I can and will retire in 14 years and I am out of this piss poor Industry
I tried my best to get AMFA in and failed now for me it is time to get on with life and be happy while I am counting down the days till retirement.

As for TWU supporter these days I think I am only supporting myself since I am the only one I am sure that I can count on.

Ok Buck did I cheer you up any. :unsure:

If so glad I could help.

Oh and by the way I do have some good news.

I saved a bundle on my car insurance at geico and I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.

 

[Buck]

I am glad you asked what the solution is here it come so get ready.

First we all quit AA get out of the dieing Aviation Industry and go to Medical school to be a Doctor of some sort after that we rake in the cash from the misery of all those millions of sick people who cannot get cheaper Medical care over sea's
That is pretty much the only solution I have got it won't be easy especially at 40 something years old but it can't be much harder than getting AMFA in at AA

The truth is I don't think there is a solution to the problems of our Industry I am not so sure that hard times are not going to be here in Aviation for quite awhile and at this point, I don't necessarily think that changing Unions is going to make that much of a difference, it might if good times come back and the Airlines have alot of money again, if not then I think we will all have to get use to the amount of money we are making in this Industry and deal with it as best we can.
I am not looking to make any new purchases for a long time.
Northwest's contract is amendable next year it will be interesting to see what happens in this tough economy.

No matter what happens I have restructered my finances to deal with the less pay and I am no longer suffering, I can and will retire in 14 years and I am out of this piss poor Industry
I tried my best to get AMFA in and failed now for me it is time to get on with life and be happy while I am counting down the days till retirement.

As for TWU supporter these days I think I am only supporting myself since I am the only one I am sure that I can count on.

Ok Buck did I cheer you up any. :unsure:

If so glad I could help.

Oh and by the way I do have some good news.

I saved a bundle on my car insurance at geico and I stayed in a Holiday Inn last night.

So your solution is to abandon the industry and therefore the profession that your union and its form of unionism of choice has decimated.

In a deregulated industry, your form of unionism has catered to the airline companies in the form of concessions instead of letting the market thin itself out.

As for your claim at working hard to get AMFA on the property, from what I understand is that you are like a fish out of water.

I for one will never be satisfied with the concessions that the TWU has provided, I will not get used to this nor will I, in my 40's give up on my fellow coworkers.

You will not make any new purchases because you have chosen the path of concessions. It is those like you that I despise the most.

Yea, I got mine or I will soon, that is the mentality that has destroyed the profession and the unionism in general.