Will U Get United Routes / Den ?

[Harry Callahan]

spindoc, I think from your posts that you must be scared to death. You sound like the only one worried to me. Most CWA&IAM members will do much better than they are doing now. It is just time to get this crap over with!

 

[USA320Pilot]

When considering whether or not to participate in the new business plan, I believe an employee should think about job options outside of the company.

One issue that will have a negative effect on US Airways employees is demographics and age. Due to the downsizing and a seniority based system for the union employees, age discimination will occur limiting meaningful employment opportunities.

Respectfully,

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

When considering whether or not to participate in the new business plan, I believe an employee should think about job options outside of the company.

One issue that will have a negative effect on US Airways employees is demographics and age. Due to the downsizing and a seniority based system for the union employees, age discimination will occur limiting meaningful employment opportunities.

Respectfully,

USA320Pilot

Your post has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO ABOUT THE TOPIC!

 

[Fly]

Interesting stuff.

How's this for speculation.

Dr. Bronner & Lakefield to Unions.

"We will purchase UA assests provided that organized labor conceeds to an AWA wage and work rule type contract. US employees on furlough will be recalled as our pending agreement with UA does NOT include people. We are loyal to our workers and have aquired equipment, gates and various and sundry rights ONLY. With the expansion of our fleet there will be plenty of work for all of the mechnics currently on staff. We expect the arbitration to be dropped (if unfavorable) and the Airbuss MTC 3rd party contract to go forward.


Paging Mr A320, Paging Mr A320, Paging Mr A320, ICT in ailse three

and the point of that is..........? Flame bait?

 

[RowUnderDCA]

spindoc, I think from your posts that you must be scared to death. You sound like the only one worried to me. Most CWA&IAM members will do much better than they are doing now. It is just time to get this crap over with!

Gee the post seemed kind of matter-of-fact to me. How would you get 'fear.' out of that?

 

[Ch. 12]

CH 12: Just what are the similar jobs in other industries???? :blink:

It's not that difficult to figure this out. The job groups are:

Customer service = customer service in another industry

mechanics = mechanics in another industry

inflight service = service applicable in another industry

ramp labor = manual labor in another industry

Really...the point isn't that the other industry's jobs aren't related to airplanes but the functions require the same skill set.

Airline employees (including management) do not out perform other industries and should not be paid as if they are 3x as productive. I know for a fact that mgmt pays LESS in the airlines than in other industries. Labor is the exact opposite.

 

[Bluestreak]

Chapter 12,

You forget that other industries aren't as safety sensitive as aviation. The safety issues account for why an airline mechanic should be paid more than an auto mechanic. Also, why a rampy should make more than a warehouse worker.

 

[700UW]

The ironic thing is a good auto mechanic working at a dealer makes more then an aircraft mechanic.

 

[ktflyhome]

You failed to mention Pilots.

Inflight Service=service applicable to another industry????
How is that?? Are you comparing Flight Attendants with waiters and waitresses???
I don't know of anyone in the restaurant business who has to be trained on FAR's, CPR, difliberators, first aid, emergency equipment, terrorism, bombs, emergency evacuations.....just to name a few.

I've done years in the restaurant and bar business. That is a piece of cake. I never had folks try to give me dirty diapers, throw luggage on my feet, punch and poke at me, take off their shoes to reveal dirty toenails, masturbate under the blankets, try to put food from their mouth into my hand.....just to name a few.

I never had to show up for work an hour early without being paid. Never had to sit hours for not being paid.

Am I complaining? NO. Just pointing out a few "differences". I have actually loved being a flight attendant...but this company is making me hate the job these days.

Oh, by the way....I know of many Bartenders who make a hellava lot more than me.

 

[TomBascom]

The ironic thing is a good auto mechanic working at a dealer makes more then an aircraft mechanic.

A good auto mechanic is paid according to his merit. An IAM mechanic is paid according to his seniority.

 

[700UW]

Not true, the IAM represents thousands of auto mechanics at car dealerships all over the US.

 

[Fly]

Here's my take......we ARE waiters and waitresses. It's painful to type that too, but it's true. It's also a job that somehow is allowed to discriminate against many, many people. They look for a certain "type" and don't hire others, even if they too could perform CPR, open a door, etc. I'm not trying to be disrespectful but I'm pretty certain that ANYONE who's butt is on fire would be able to open the giant door with a giant red arrow pointing in the direction to pull the handle (of course, if the plane crashes, there are usually tons of holes one can jump out of and the door is pretty unnecessary ). I think everything got screwed up when flight attendants dumped the "stewardess" name and started calling themselves "safety professionals". (I'm also ALWAYS amazed when I go to briefing and I check out some of the OLD, OLD flight attendants...and I think...."whoa, this chick used to be HOT!" YIKES They only hired the hotties in the 60's ya know) Anyway, if it does anything, it keeps me going to the gym and trying to look good myself :unsure: OK, whole topic is ff:

As far as U getting United's routes....NEVA! and, imho, if we do drop any hub, it would be Denver. They made no attempt to support United during the last couple of years AND they cost so much in airport fees that it can't be profitable. Let Denver get by with Frontier and see how happy they are.

 

[funguy2]

Strictly speaking on wages...

I wouldn't call it lowering the bar. It's more like adjusting it to reflect the economy and status of the industry. If the bar can only ever go up, how can carriers keep up with the expenses during low revenue periods (such as the current trend)?

We have to learn that wages cannot only keep going up but have to be flexible in the weakened economy. Carriers are paying boom economy rates in a recession. Does this make sense? Just b/c somebody would no longer be making over $20/hr to take reservations, that does not equal "Walmart territory". I would actually say that these are well above the market reference when looking at similar jobs in other industries.

Ch. 12:

Excellent Post. I think you are right... I've seen job advertisements for call center jobs in the $10-$13/hr range.

 

[funguy2]

Airline employee wages have long been at a premium compared to comparably graded jobs as defined by the Dept. of Labor. The reality is that the airline labor market was never deregulated when the domestic airline industry was deregulated in 1978. Airline labor costs are now being brought in check and it is a painful process, particularly for those carriers where it is being forced upon them at the same time they are fighting for their survival.

Airline wages will never return to the levels enjoyed in the 90s – which like much of the American economy was vastly unrealistic. Some carriers will have to overcompensate on cost cuts in order to survive while others will make a more gradual change. Defined pension benefits are likely gone from the industry; for carriers like US and UA, they will be eliminated in order to survive while carriers like Delta are eliminating defined pensions over time.

Airline careers are great for a couple years to see the world and learn to work with people but you probably will want to have a little chat with your kids if they start talking about wanting to work for an airline.

World Traveller:

Great post... It's true... In 1978, when dregulation occured, system load factors for airlines were in the range of 55%. Today, system load factors of 80% are common for peak months.

The reality is that the inflated wages enjoyed by airline employees were supported by the fact that airlines had lots of room to make additional revenue on existing flights... (25 points of load factor) However, now that revenue is squeezed, and so are many "other" expense categories such as travel agent commissions, catering, etc, there is just no where left to run... in a macro sense.

 

[usairways_vote_NO]

It's not that difficult to figure this out. The job groups are:

Customer service = customer service in another industry

mechanics = mechanics in another industry

inflight service = service applicable in another industry

ramp labor = manual labor in another industry

Really...the point isn't that the other industry's jobs aren't related to airplanes but the functions require the same skill set.

Airline employees (including management) do not out perform other industries and should not be paid as if they are 3x as productive. I know for a fact that mgmt pays LESS in the airlines than in other industries. Labor is the exact opposite.

You forgot about pilots = crop dusting, military, charter, transportation industry i.e. grey hound, bus drivers

Sorry I just had too