Why does US Airways pay so poorly...?

[usair_begins_with_u]

The only good thing LCC Mgmt has ever done is expose the complete irrelevance of the organized labor movement in the United States in the 21st century.

LCC pays low because it has the strong no nonsense management in place to #### slap the union's around like a red headed step child.

The fear of union action against an airline is no more. What are you getting for those union dues these days boys and girls? Better work rules? LOL

 

[usair_begins_with_u]

True story.. if you took your $20 a paycheck union dues and instead invested them in a moderately agressive mututal fund, you'd have $130,000 in savings after 30 years.

 

[insp89]

The only good thing LCC Mgmt has ever done is expose the complete irrelevance of the organized labor movement in the United States in the 21st century.

LCC pays low because it has the strong no nonsense management in place to #### slap the union's around like a red headed step child.

The fear of union action against an airline is no more. What are you getting for those union dues these days boys and girls? Better work rules? LOL

Hey union basher,
You "forgot" to mention anything about the crooked -one way dead end- bankruptcy rules that managements across the industry use as their tool, to shaft not only employees, but also creditors..
Strong no nonsense LCC management ? Yeah, they are strong enough to rape and pillage the very company that they are supposed to manage..
Pull your head out and think back to when Wolf, Gangwal, Bronner, Siegel and Lakefield did their very best to walk away FILTHY rich at the expense of employees and creditors.
It's evident that Parker is cut from the same piece of cloth. He had no problem cashing in his beloved stock options [$9 mil] AFTER the merger went through, which allowed him to profit greatly off the backs of labor and the creditors, due to the rise in the stock price post merger.. :down:

 

[Travelpro72]

What happened to Lakefield?

 

[insp89]

What happened to Lakefield?

I really don't know what became of good ole Bruce..

Maybe he went back into the Navy, to install screen doors onto submarines.

 

[usair_begins_with_u]

I'm not trying to bash you or the unions, I'm actualy trying to help you. The industrial revolution is over, in case you have not heard. This is now the information age. Knowledge workers are the only ones who can command an above average wage. It's not to late for many of you. Get some education, training, learn a knowledge based skill. There are numerous grants, loans and subsidies for those who seek them. God gave you a brain, try using it. Sorry, there is just no room at the inn for unions in the information age. Machines and foriegners are more than willing to do work Unions had made their mainstay. Machines and foriegners do not scream for benefits, or threaten work stoppages.

Posting here wishing things were better will not change the simple economics of the airline industry. The same greed that guides CEO's is the same greed that compels the rank and file to demand higher wages. Please recongize the irony I see when union chaps start picking at corporate greed. Please, kettle meet pot. Those with the knowledge and exp of how to organize labor and capitial have created a market for you to sell your services (read skills). Not everyone, i.e. very few ppl have the know how or ability to organize large sums of capital and human resources into a profit generating enterprise. No one owes you jack in this life. You make yourself valuable, and set your own wage level by acquiring skills demanded in a free and self adjusting labor market.

Its never too late.

 

[insp89]

I'm not trying to bash you or the unions, I'm actualy trying to help you. The industrial revolution is over, in case you have not heard. This is now the information age. Knowledge workers are the only ones who can command an above average wage. It's not to late for many of you. Get some education, training, learn a knowledge based skill. There are numerous grants, loans and subsidies for those who seek them. God gave you a brain, try using it. Sorry, there is just no room at the inn for unions in the information age. Machines and foriegners are more than willing to do work Unions had made their mainstay. Machines and foriegners do not scream for benefits, or threaten work stoppages.

Posting here wishing things were better will not change the simple economics of the airline industry. The same greed that guides CEO's is the same greed that compels the rank and file to demand higher wages. Please recongize the irony I see when union chaps start picking at corporate greed. Please, kettle meet pot. Those with the knowledge and exp of how to organize labor and capitial have created a market for you to sell your services (read skills). Not everyone, i.e. very few ppl have the know how or ability to organize large sums of capital and human resources into a profit generating enterprise. No one owes you jack in this life. You make yourself valuable, and set your own wage level by acquiring skills demanded in a free and self adjusting labor market.

Its never too late.

"It's never too late" I'm sure a person of superior intelligence such as yourself , is aware that the country of India has Phd's working for pennies on the dollar compared to their American counterparts..

If you think "foriegners" are going to effect just union members, You are sadly mistaken..I dare say, Globalism and the seeking of finding the cheapest rate will eventually come knocking at your palace door..

Wow, must be nice to set your own wage level..What is a great mind like yours doing on a website with all the "unwashed?"

Thank You for your attempt to "Help" those less fortunate.

 

[flyastrojets]

There was once a person in a management station position, with experience on the corporate side, who flew to Tempe to interview for a management job -- coming in as the recommended candidate from the person at Crystal city (who was told he could keep his job, sans 40% paycut), expecting to hear the job paid $50k... only to walk away from the interview being told its $28k a year.

Said person now works for a regional carrier, making MORE money and better benefits, in a non-management position.

Speaking from some experience at AAnother carrier, this is not a phenomenon that is unique to US. And I personally believe that it is why airlines collectively can't keep frontline managers/supervisors that are worth a darn (with a few exceptions I'm sure).

 

[JS]

True story.. if you took your $20 a paycheck union dues and instead invested them in a moderately agressive mututal fund, you'd have $130,000 in savings after 30 years.

You get paid every four days? :blink:

 

[diogenes]

I'm not trying to bash you or the unions, I'm actualy trying to help you. The industrial revolution is over, in case you have not heard. This is now the information age. Knowledge workers are the only ones who can command an above average wage. It's not to late for many of you. Get some education, training, learn a knowledge based skill. There are numerous grants, loans and subsidies for those who seek them. God gave you a brain, try using it. Sorry, there is just no room at the inn for unions in the information age. Machines and foriegners are more than willing to do work Unions had made their mainstay. Machines and foriegners do not scream for benefits, or threaten work stoppages.

Posting here wishing things were better will not change the simple economics of the airline industry. The same greed that guides CEO's is the same greed that compels the rank and file to demand higher wages. Please recongize the irony I see when union chaps start picking at corporate greed. Please, kettle meet pot. Those with the knowledge and exp of how to organize labor and capitial have created a market for you to sell your services (read skills). Not everyone, i.e. very few ppl have the know how or ability to organize large sums of capital and human resources into a profit generating enterprise. No one owes you jack in this life. You make yourself valuable, and set your own wage level by acquiring skills demanded in a free and self adjusting labor market.

Its never too late.

There isn't a real skill you can learn that can't be outsourced. I read a recent article where some insurance companies are sending their clients to India for surgery.

Jesusonaraft, if a freakin' surgeon can't keep his job (nor can ALPA pilots) pray explain exactly who can?

Manufacturing, computer programming, accounting, are gone or going.

I want to live to see two things.

Lawyers and CEO's get outsourced.

And we serfs finally get a clue. It ain't abortion. It ain't who's God is the most holy. It's what kind of rules do we want to play by. Friedman's apologia to greed is nothing more that the laissez faire capitalism practiced in the US from 1780 thru 1930. Never produced a middle class. It won't this go-around, either.

 

[sharktooth]

I'm not trying to bash you or the unions, I'm actualy trying to help you. The industrial revolution is over, in case you have not heard. This is now the information age. Knowledge workers are the only ones who can command an above average wage. It's not to late for many of you. Get some education, training, learn a knowledge based skill. There are numerous grants, loans and subsidies for those who seek them. God gave you a brain, try using it. Sorry, there is just no room at the inn for unions in the information age. Machines and foriegners are more than willing to do work Unions had made their mainstay. Machines and foriegners do not scream for benefits, or threaten work stoppages.

Not certain where you get your infantile ideas about unions, but, with a few notable exceptions, most unions have been responsible for giant changes in the workplace, especially, in the areas of safety and benefits.

For instance, the pilots unions have all funded research for safer flight, almost all through the dues structure, with very little help from the affected corporations.

A well-run union of self-respecting employees can actually help a corporation to run better, more efficiently and ultimately save them money, over, say, the way USAIrways is run.

Contrary to your juvenile view of labor relations, most intelligent upper managers look forward to interfacing with a well-run union. Of course, if your managers are not so smart, then their fear will ensure a bad situation, screaming and yelling will ensue.

Posting here wishing things were better will not change the simple economics of the airline industry. The same greed that guides CEO's is the same greed that compels the rank and file to demand higher wages. Please recongize the irony I see when union chaps start picking at corporate greed. Please, kettle meet pot. Those with the knowledge and exp of how to organize labor and capitial have created a market for you to sell your services (read skills). Not everyone, i.e. very few ppl have the know how or ability to organize large sums of capital and human resources into a profit generating enterprise. No one owes you jack in this life. You make yourself valuable, and set your own wage level by acquiring skills demanded in a free and self adjusting labor market.

Its never too late.

Your arrogance is pretty interesting, and I can see that your less than average abilities combined with natural desires to get ahead would lead most anyone to think you are greedy.

I don't think "greed" means what you think it does. A desire to advance oneself is rarely "greed". To advance oneself at the expense of others, likely, is.

It is said one is only worth what one negotiates, a rule you might wish to think about. When negotiators limit themselves, they risk excluding possible solutions that might work out for all parties, hence, it is generally thought that openers be as wide-ranging as possible, leading ignorant fellas like you to think the union or management is being "greedy".

As far as Mr. Glass goes, we really don't know whether he is good or bad, the USAIrways employees really never fought him at all, simply running away, refusing to educate themselves to defuse vague threats, conceding the field well before he was ever really tested.

 

[qwerty]

It's evident that Parker is cut from the same piece of cloth. He had no problem cashing in his beloved stock options [$9 mil] AFTER the merger went through, which allowed him to profit greatly off the backs of labor and the creditors, due to the rise in the stock price post merger.. :down:

You have to be kidding. Parker knew what would happen to the stock price when the DL offer was announced - by clearing out his options (remember the whining that he exercised more options than he had too?), he gave up the potential for another $4-5 million.

Of course he's rewarded for reducing costs, that his job.

I love the constant whining about executive pay - maybe if the old US had spent more on quality management talent back in the day, you wouldn't all be in the position you are now in. Instead they got people like Siegel at a fire sale price, how did that work out for you?

 

[insp89]

You have to be kidding. Parker knew what would happen to the stock price when the DL offer was announced - by clearing out his options (remember the whining that he exercised more options than he had too?), he gave up the potential for another $4-5 million.

Of course he's rewarded for reducing costs, that his job.

I love the constant whining about executive pay - maybe if the old US had spent more on quality management talent back in the day, you wouldn't all be in the position you are now in. Instead they got people like Siegel at a fire sale price, how did that work out for you?

qwerty,
Evidently, You must be unaware that Parker's stock options he exercised were time limited..
If his options were NOT time limited, There is NO doubt in my mind he WOULD of waited until the Delta offer was announced.
I'm glad you love to here the constant "whining" about executive pay, because you will continue to here it, as long as the "workers" are obligated to work under sub-par, bankruptcy negotiated contracts.
The jury is still out on your hero Mr. Parker. He has a long way to go in merging the work forces of the old AWA and the old Usair..and now he wants to throw Delta into the mix ??
We got Siegel at a "fire sale" price ? You must of forgotten the day he left the company with millions of dollars lining his pockets..

 

[Bear96]

Contrary to your juvenile view of labor relations, most intelligent upper managers look forward to interfacing with a well-run union.

What do you base that statement on?

 

[usair_begins_with_u]

What do you base that statement on?

A disgusting dose of Heavy drinking and ignorance most likely. After reading that statement I figured any logic would lost on this obvious over-achiever.

Source 1: http://www.ncpa.org/pd/unions/unionsa3.html
Source 2: http://economics.about.com/od/laborinameri...ion_decline.htm
Source 3: http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/106567.php
Source 4: http://www.unionfreeamerica.com/killing_jobs.htm

Union % of workers on private payrolls

If unions are so great and so strong, why do you guys keep taking massive pay cuts?? Why are union jobs disapearing? (See graph above) Why are the only people upset old stoggy has beens with 20+ years of seniority?

Maybe you can take a lesson from the successful folks at SkyWest

SkyWest Airlines has been union-free for over 30 years. It is our desire to remain so. Today, SkyWest is standing amidst the ruins of a once proud industry. Our success is our people. We have accepted the responsibility of open and honest communication. We have maintained an open-door policy that enables any employee access to anyone in management, from your supervisor to our CEO. We want you to be informed. And as SkyWest continues to grow, the continued empowerment of employees through education is what will not only preserve, but improve Our Culture.

We feel strongly that the long-term interests of all SkyWest employees can be best served by maintaining our current environment of open and honest communication without adding an unnecessary layer of outside third party bureaucracy. We should not compromise the environment we have worked so hard to create. The existence of a third party will undoubtedly change the relationship that we currently have of dealing directly with one another.

And while union organizers may want you to believe they have your best interest at heart, the truth is that unions are businesses that generate money by signing up new members and collecting dues. They do not provide wages, benefits, buildings and equipment, or any other asset necessary to keep our company in business. A union can only provide its members with what a company is willing to give. The truth is that a union only has two things it can guarantee its members: its right to strike and make its members pay dues and assessments.

History has taught us that powerful unions, particularly in our industry, do not hesitate to place their companies in financial peril -- ultimately costing thousands of hardworking men and women their jobs. Understand, this is not "just a pilot" issue. Union activity affects every single employee.

Our dedication to fairness in all that we do, coupled with an uncompromising commitment to quality, truly sets SkyWest apart as an airline and an employer. We believe in treating each employee with respect. We have continued to update our policies and procedures to ensure that you will be treated fairly and consistently. By working together, we have created an environment of competitive wages, good working conditions, and opportunity for both personal and professional growth. Together we have built SkyWest; and together we can continue to build a better SkyWest for our fellow employees and ourselves.