W2
- Thread starter Hopeful
- Start date
Garfield1966
Veteran
I like mine fine because the fact that I have one means I still have a job unlike 10's of thousands of other people in the this country who are not as fortunate. Why do you not go complain to one of them about how under paid you are and see how sympathetic they are.
OP
Hopeful
Veteran
- Dec 21, 2002
- 5,998
- 347
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #4
So GARFIELD1966:
Please answer this, would you be willing to work for minimum wage?
Your comment is exactly what corporate America and American Airlines specifically wants to hear from the employees!
"THEY'RE LUCKY TO HAVE JOBS,"
"LET'S TAKE MORE FROM THEM,"
That luck to have a job rhethoric only goes so far.
"THAT GUY GARFIELD REALLY HAS HIS HANDS ON THE PULSE OF THE WORKFORCE"
"IF GARFIELD IS WILLING TO WORK FOR CRAP, LETS SCREW THE REST OF EM
LIKE WE HAVE BEEN"
Please answer this, would you be willing to work for minimum wage?
Your comment is exactly what corporate America and American Airlines specifically wants to hear from the employees!
"THEY'RE LUCKY TO HAVE JOBS,"
"LET'S TAKE MORE FROM THEM,"
That luck to have a job rhethoric only goes so far.
"THAT GUY GARFIELD REALLY HAS HIS HANDS ON THE PULSE OF THE WORKFORCE"
"IF GARFIELD IS WILLING TO WORK FOR CRAP, LETS SCREW THE REST OF EM
LIKE WE HAVE BEEN"
I wish I still had a W2 from AA. For those of you complaining about the money they are making, why dont you step into my shoes at the unemployment line ( Which has now run out w/out any extension ) and tell my 3year-old daughter why she will not be celebrating her birthday next week. Again now Let me reemphasize the fact that American has the Most selfish employees working for them. This is union and non union. So those that are still getting a paycheck be thankful and shut up! :angry:
Garfield1966
Veteran
Not sure about you but I am no where near min wage.
Hopeful, I guess it was asked and answered by Flyboy.
Hopeful, I guess it was asked and answered by Flyboy.
Garfield1966
Veteran
Sorry, I thought that was implied. I do not feel that the wages and compensation I am being offered now are unreasonable. As I mentioned in a different thread, our wages are so much higher than else where in the world I think a better question would be, how much compensation do you want till your employer takes your job and ships it over seas to a 3rd world nation?
Too answer your question directly, no I am not willing to work for $4 and change per a hour unless there are no other alternatives.
Too answer your question directly, no I am not willing to work for $4 and change per a hour unless there are no other alternatives.
OP
Hopeful
Veteran
- Dec 21, 2002
- 5,998
- 347
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #10
Garfield:
That's my point. I understand and symphatize with people who are out of work. All the years I've been in this business, I've been there on the street two times myself. By no means am I am implying it's better to be on unemployment or working for mininum wage than staying in the employ of AA. But at some point, one has to say "enough is enough!"
Look at USAIR, they have emerged from bankruptcy, have had a judge alter the way USAIR operates, and guess what? They are in worse shape than ever and could be facing possible liquidation under Chapter 7. Once a carrier starts selling assets, as USAIR, plans to do, that signals the beginning of the end. We only need to look at PANAM, Eastern, and Braniff for proof.
I am glad to see that AA has avoided that path, but my big concern is that the next crisis facing the industry will lead to more concessions from the employees.
That's my point. I understand and symphatize with people who are out of work. All the years I've been in this business, I've been there on the street two times myself. By no means am I am implying it's better to be on unemployment or working for mininum wage than staying in the employ of AA. But at some point, one has to say "enough is enough!"
Look at USAIR, they have emerged from bankruptcy, have had a judge alter the way USAIR operates, and guess what? They are in worse shape than ever and could be facing possible liquidation under Chapter 7. Once a carrier starts selling assets, as USAIR, plans to do, that signals the beginning of the end. We only need to look at PANAM, Eastern, and Braniff for proof.
I am glad to see that AA has avoided that path, but my big concern is that the next crisis facing the industry will lead to more concessions from the employees.
Garfield1966
Veteran
Hope,
I guess that is always a concern. I think that any company will look at the bottom line and make a determination that when you start to cut, you risk cutting into the meat. Now I know some would argue that the cuts made were too deep. There is no way to find that out for certain. As you pointed out US air is in far worse shape for going into BK. United could end up in bad shape as well. If AA had not made the cuts it had, would we have been in better shape, worse shape? I do not have the answers to that.
I believe that a majority of people working for AA and for most other corporations are probably being paid “more than they are worthâ€. I include my self in that category. Now, I also believe that share holders and BOD’s are being paid more than they are worth as well. We live in a nation where we worship the dollar. Those who have, want more, those who do not have (folks like us) want enough to be happy. I am not sure how long you have been flying but I have been with AA for close to 20 years. I have been reamed on several occasions in terms of raises so I am not making nearly what others with 20 years are making but I make a decent living. Loosing 25% hurt but mom and dad raised me to live well with in my means so it was not huge shock for me.
I guess my way of answering your question is with another question. What was the alternative? What should the alternative be if something else happens? To me it is like school. You have to teach to accommodate the lowest common denominator. We have to compete with the low fare carriers and be able to match them at their game even though they are not close to being in our class. AA and every other carrier have to reduce cost. Wages are the easiest and most efficient way of doing so.
I guess that is always a concern. I think that any company will look at the bottom line and make a determination that when you start to cut, you risk cutting into the meat. Now I know some would argue that the cuts made were too deep. There is no way to find that out for certain. As you pointed out US air is in far worse shape for going into BK. United could end up in bad shape as well. If AA had not made the cuts it had, would we have been in better shape, worse shape? I do not have the answers to that.
I believe that a majority of people working for AA and for most other corporations are probably being paid “more than they are worthâ€. I include my self in that category. Now, I also believe that share holders and BOD’s are being paid more than they are worth as well. We live in a nation where we worship the dollar. Those who have, want more, those who do not have (folks like us) want enough to be happy. I am not sure how long you have been flying but I have been with AA for close to 20 years. I have been reamed on several occasions in terms of raises so I am not making nearly what others with 20 years are making but I make a decent living. Loosing 25% hurt but mom and dad raised me to live well with in my means so it was not huge shock for me.
I guess my way of answering your question is with another question. What was the alternative? What should the alternative be if something else happens? To me it is like school. You have to teach to accommodate the lowest common denominator. We have to compete with the low fare carriers and be able to match them at their game even though they are not close to being in our class. AA and every other carrier have to reduce cost. Wages are the easiest and most efficient way of doing so.
Kev3188
Veteran
"You have to teach to accommodate the lowest common denominator. We have to compete with the low fare carriers and be able to match them at their game even though they are not close to being in our class. AA and every other carrier have to reduce cost. Wages are the easiest and most efficient way of doing so."
And now, those of us at NW are being told we need to take wage cuts, to keep up with you at AA! :angry: :angry: :angry:
And now, those of us at NW are being told we need to take wage cuts, to keep up with you at AA! :angry: :angry: :angry:
"Loosing 25% hurt but mom and dad raised me to live well with in my means so it was not huge shock for me."
Garfield1966,
Excellent point Garfield. In fact, I based my familys lifestyle and home purchase based on the possibility of a 30% cut even before 9/11.
The problem is that I took a 49% paycut
Garfield1966,
Excellent point Garfield. In fact, I based my familys lifestyle and home purchase based on the possibility of a 30% cut even before 9/11.
The problem is that I took a 49% paycut
NewHampshire Black Bears
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
- 10,154
- 681
Hopeful,Hopeful said:
You ask a VERY valid question.
Unfortunatly, as seen in some reply's to your question, there are those, who are in DENIAL, because they cannot see that what you have asked, "IS A VALID QUESTION" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(to a certain degree) I can understand that someone laid off, would say "that a half a loaf is better than none"
But I have a harder time understanding someone(who has a lot of seniority) (who did'nt get laid off), saying "oh well, at least we have a job". That's the "KOOL AID" mentality.
Also, the fact that NO ONE can/has answered your question, "When is enough, enough", means to me that these folks dont have an ounce of "fight" in them !!!!!
As far as your concerned, I pray that the AMT's get AMFA in "yesterday", because "DELLA" will get a lot of your money back, over a short period of time.
To those who say, AMFA will cause people to get "laid off", I say, "So sorry but seniority rules"
NH/BB's
