USair denies AA pilots jumpseat...

[snapthis]

As an east pilot I can tell you that when we heard about this we were all pissed off.  The idiot capt. that did this does not represent the east group.  Garbage like this has no place out on the line.  
 
I told the guy I was flying with when we heard about this that I bet the west is going to milk this for all its worth and within a day you will see it splattered all over every web board,  looks like somebody decided to pass it on to Ted reed also.
 
I don't know which is worse, the idiot that denied the jumpseat or the degenerates that are posting it everywhere they can.
 
This capt. is known to the line guys,  if you have not heard the name yet all you need to do is pass through one of the crew rooms and you will probably hear it.  I am not going to post the name since it should be dealt with internally to make sure it does not happen again.    Word is that in addition to the union and line pilots all over him about it that the company has taken a very dim view of the subject as well,  but I have no direct knowledge of that.
 
To the three guys that were denied the seat I apologize for the actions of that particular individual.  You are all welcome on our jumpseat anytime.

The West was not milking, rather disassociating ourselves from the EAST Captain who denied the
jumpseat.

 

[Hope777]

The West was not milking, rather disassociating ourselves from the EAST Captain who denied the
jumpseat.

I would hope you would Disassociate from any Captain that did this, either East or West.

 

[hula-flyguy]

same game the US pilots played with the west in the early days of that merger.  Thought they may have grown up by now, guess that was just wishful thinking.

 

[Piedmont1984]

same game the west played with the east in the early days of that merger. 

There, I fixed it for you.

 

[Mach85ER]

I read all the articles regarding this subject and it appears the AA and US pilots are in for a very long haul for their seniority integration. 
 
I will say this though.  I congratulate the US pilot for refusing the AA pilot the seat.  After all the US pilots have gone thru tremendous heartbreaks over that past mergers, while the AA pilots have tried to stick it to the man, over and over again, from their past mergers.  This very well could be a very good tool to use to get both sides closer together and come to a final contract...

 
 
swamt,
 
         You apparently are quite uniformed about AA's previous mergers. Any chance you want to guess the amount of AirCal, Reno and TWA done today by AA pilots?
 
Virtually nothing.
 
So what's your solution, take 2500 pilots from the previous mergers and put them at the top of the list? Keep in mind there are only 3500 Captain slots.
 
I would love to hear your valuable, well reasoned solutions.
 
The LCC is different. Parker needs to maintain a good part of the LCC flying done today.

 

[Bob Owens]

Groups are like individuals, every one has an a$$hole.

 

[snapthis]

I would hope you would Disassociate from any Captain that did this, either East or West.

Absolutely.

In this case, since the previous merger is unmerged, I did not have that opportunity.

 

[lpbrian]

Unionism at its best....

 

[Topcat187]

Well, PMUS f/as are quick to point out that "our contract specifies boarding by seniority."  Well, at PMAA, our (APFA) contract specifies that APFA controls who sits on the jumpseats.  To facilitate f/as commuting to/from work, only AA and (pre-merger) AE f/as may occupy a cabin jumpseat.

You might want to look at the FA contract again. It doesnt say "only" they can fly in the cabin jumpseat, it just says they can fly in the cabin jumpseat.

 

[bigjets]

It's highly moronic for pilots to fight each other on the line, and is not indicative of the majority of the pilots I come across. 
 
But on the other hand, the flight crews have no problem denying jumpseat privileges to the rest of the airline employees who are just trying to get someplace, there are plenty of American employees who commute, because of layoffs. 
 
What is really disheartening is the fact that pilots from OTHER AIRLINES get to ride on OUR AIRLINE for free, in the cockpit, while we will be sitting at the gate watching the plane push back.  Also American has arranged for flight crews from other airlines the right to walk up and get a seat if one is open, for free, other flightcrews can do it on our airline and AA flightcrews can do it theirs. another benefit other employees don't have. So in the end who gives a f*** a pilot got denied a jumpseat. Pilots aren't the only airline employees who non-rev.  

 

[nycbusdriver]

It's highly moronic for pilots to fight each other on the line, and is not indicative of the majority of the pilots I come across. 
 
But on the other hand, the flight crews have no problem denying jumpseat privileges to the rest of the airline employees who are just trying to get someplace, there are plenty of American employees who commute, because of layoffs. 
 
What is really disheartening is the fact that pilots from OTHER AIRLINES get to ride on OUR AIRLINE for free, in the cockpit, while we will be sitting at the gate watching the plane push back.  Also American has arranged for flight crews from other airlines the right to walk up and get a seat if one is open, for free, other flightcrews can do it on our airline and AA flightcrews can do it theirs. another benefit other employees don't have. So in the end who gives a f*** a pilot got denied a jumpseat. Pilots aren't the only airline employees who non-rev.  

 
 
Don't blame the pilots for that.  FARs are very strict on who gets to ride in the cockpit, and since 9-11, those strictures are even tighter.
 
Decades ago it was possible to "sneak" someone up there, but now that our employee groups are full of snitches, it's impossible unless the pilots want to lose their jobs.  And, even if a flight attendant was given illegal access by the captain to "get to work," the flight attendant would lose his/her job, too, if it was discovered...and, of course, any other flight attendant on the crew, or employee who might be riding, could turn in the incident.  Even a nosey passenger can cause an investigation to be launched...it has happened before.
 
Personally, I have no problem with changing the rule to allow adequately-briefed employees to ride in the cockpit.  But I don't make the rules, and given the paranoia of the TSA and DHS, it's not going to change.

 

[bigjets]

 
 
Don't blame the pilots for that.  FARs are very strict on who gets to ride in the cockpit, and since 9-11, those strictures are even tighter.
 
Decades ago it was possible to "sneak" someone up there, but now that our employee groups are full of snitches, it's impossible unless the pilots want to lose their jobs.  And, even if a flight attendant was given illegal access by the captain to "get to work," the flight attendant would lose his/her job, too, if it was discovered...and, of course, any other flight attendant on the crew, or employee who might be riding, could turn in the incident.  Even a nosey passenger can cause an investigation to be launched...it has happened before.
 
Personally, I have no problem with changing the rule to allow adequately-briefed employees to ride in the cockpit.  But I don't make the rules, and given the paranoia of the TSA and DHS, it's not going to change.
 
 

 
I don't know who is feeding you some bull, but Jetblue and SWA allow their employees jumpseat privileges. This isn't Foxnews or MSNBC lets stay away from the rhetoric please.  

 

[bigjets]

 

 
 
Don't blame the pilots for that.  FARs are very strict on who gets to ride in the cockpit, and since 9-11, those strictures are even tighter.
 
Decades ago it was possible to "sneak" someone up there, but now that our employee groups are full of snitches, it's impossible unless the pilots want to lose their jobs.  And, even if a flight attendant was given illegal access by the captain to "get to work," the flight attendant would lose his/her job, too, if it was discovered...and, of course, any other flight attendant on the crew, or employee who might be riding, could turn in the incident.  Even a nosey passenger can cause an investigation to be launched...it has happened before.
 
Personally, I have no problem with changing the rule to allow adequately-briefed employees to ride in the cockpit.  But I don't make the rules, and given the paranoia of the TSA and DHS, it's not going to change.
 
 

 
I don't know who is feeding you some bull, but Jetblue and SWA allow their employees jumpseat privileges. This isn't Foxnews or MSNBC lets stay away from the rhetoric please.  
 

 
 
I don't know who is feeding you some bull, but Jetblue and SWA allow their employees jumpseat privileges I assume they operate under the same regulations AA does.  It's probably more of the case of the pilots hoarding a good deal for themselves, just like when the pilots years ago tried to get a higher non-reving classification for themselves and their families.
 
Pilots are very important to the airline, and are deservedly compensated very well for it, but those planes don't fix or load themselves, pilots don't arrange the flight schedule, market the airline or manage the passengers. It takes a lot of work to make this airline go, not just the skill of flying an airliner. 
 

 

 

[AdAstraPerAspera]

Nyc is talking about the cockpit jumpseat, not the cabin jump. And flight attendants get miffed enough already when a fellow FA is commuting and squeezing them on the double jump and taking up space in the tiny 737 galley, do you think they will be too thrilled when the unwashed masses have access to that jump, too? WN and B6 don't have to prepare meals in their galleys, for one thing... that may be part of it. It's crowded enough up there during dinnertime.

 

[1AA]

 
 
Don't blame the pilots for that.  FARs are very strict on who gets to ride in the cockpit, and since 9-11, those strictures are even tighter.
 
Decades ago it was possible to "sneak" someone up there, but now that our employee groups are full of snitches, it's impossible unless the pilots want to lose their jobs.  And, even if a flight attendant was given illegal access by the captain to "get to work," the flight attendant would lose his/her job, too, if it was discovered...and, of course, any other flight attendant on the crew, or employee who might be riding, could turn in the incident.  Even a nosey passenger can cause an investigation to be launched...it has happened before.
 
Personally, I have no problem with changing the rule to allow adequately-briefed employees to ride in the cockpit.  But I don't make the rules, and given the paranoia of the TSA and DHS, it's not going to change.

Point made but the AMT's at AA had a committee to explore the possibility of AMT's getting F/D jump seat privileges for personal travel. I remember speaking to one of the guys in that committee during the negotiations. The meetings consisted of the Company, the FAA, the flight department and the TWU. The FAA had no objections, so it was left up to the company to make policy. Unfortunately the flight department objected so the company honored their decision and we were locked out of the flight deck jump seat. No FAA or TSA restrictions, just company and flight said no.
Alaska, Southwest and JetBlue allow AMT's to jump seat in the flight deck on their respective carriers. Like a earlier poster wrote it is sad when a pilot from another airline walks up on a full flight and gets F/D jump seat for free and employees of that airline have to sit and watch the aircraft push back without them on it. That is a typical I Got Mine attitude.