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AOLs track record is fine. We stopped your DOH cramdown and the Nic is ready to be used.Ah yes, It seems that both AOL and USAPA have the same track record to date. Both sides have held the other one to a stalemate. Looks like both sides have seem to have met some of their goals. Too bad the two sides could not meet in the middle somewhere huh? That might be quite the successful venture. Oh wait...I forgot that whole NIC or nothing thing.
rrrrrrrAOLs track record is fine. We stopped your DOH cramdown and the Nic is ready to be used.
USAPA was formed to put DOH on the property. Even with a majority, you failed to do so.
Negs are over and USAPA has no one to meet in the middle with. The Nic is the list accepted by the company.
End of story.
You want to move forward, you do it with the Nic.
You want to move forward, you do it with the Nic.
The APA would win even without any US pilots' votes. AA still has far more mainline pilots than US, counting both east and west. And you'd have to be on crack to think that any AA pilots would vote for USAPA. APA may not be perfect, but the USAPA looks to be pilots pretending to be a union. APA has almost 40 years of relative success representing its pilots compared to the history of USAPA and its predecessors at ALPA.Agreed the APA would win a union election. I would imagine that would be supported from most of the East pilots.
While that may be true, consider this possible chain of events:The NIC list is NOT an official seniority list of US Airways. If it were, it would be being used now, it's not. You cannot use an unofficial list for a new integration. The only official lists at US Airways are the East, West and new hires.
Almost correct. Sure, the battle would be over, seniority finalized, and everyone would be not truly happy, but better off nonetheless.The APA would win even without any US pilots' votes. AA still has far more mainline pilots than US, counting both east and west. And you'd have to be on crack to think that any AA pilots would vote for USAPA. APA may not be perfect, but the USAPA looks to be pilots pretending to be a union. APA has almost 40 years of relative success representing its pilots compared to the history of USAPA and its predecessors at ALPA.
While that may be true, consider this possible chain of events:
AA and US merge/combine/etc (become one airline).
APA, just like it did with the TWA pilots, strives to integrate them fairly, consistent with the new post-TWA federal law (McCaskill/Bond).
APA submits the integration to arbitration. The arbitrator says, well, another aribitrator has already done the heavy lifting with respect to the US integration, and his name is Nicolau. And here's his list. It's even better if Nicolau is the arbitrator. Rather than reinvent the wheel, the arbitrator sets about combining the APA list with the Nic list, which at one time represented the product of agreed-upon binding arbitration of the US pilots, before one group decided to attempt an end-run around the result they deemed unfair and unfavorable.
So the arbitrator combines the APA list and the Nic list. No group is truly happy with the end result, a sure sign that the arbitrator did his job.
Sure, the cut-their-nose-off-to-spite-their-face USAPA East crowd would file lawsuits and fight it for years. But meanwhile, the pilot group would be combined.
I'm not saying that US and AA should get married so US can solve its pilot integration quagmire. But it's possible that a merger with AA could result in a combined list that renders moot the current East v West dispute.
Said the guy posting on these boards.
My life is not wasted if I can give an eastie a clue. I've done that already.
Everything else is gravy.
Almost correct. Sure, the battle would be over, seniority finalized, and everyone would be not truly happy, but better off nonetheless.
However, the Nic would not be used; the east, west, new hire, and fuloughed lists would be used to combine with AA.
The transition agreement would be superceded by a new agreement, and Nic would be moot.
Everyone must realize however, that the result may not be better than what you have with the Nic - it could actually be worse!
Cheers.
Not even close. Please don't mix your wishful thinking in with fact - doesn't work.Almost correct. Sure, the battle would be over, seniority finalized, and everyone would be not truly happy, but better off nonetheless.
However, the Nic would not be used; the east, west, new hire, and fuloughed lists would be used to combine with AA.
The transition agreement would be superceded by a new agreement, and Nic would be moot.
Everyone must realize however, that the result may not be better than what you have with the Nic - it could actually be worse!
Cheers.
Helane Becker really should check her facts.Helane Becker, Dahlman Rose:
"Given the current environment for the airlines, we believe further consolidation is likely."
"We continue to believe it may be difficult for American Airlines to emerge from Chapter 11 as an independent, standalone company."
"American's cornerstone strategy (focusing on New York JFK, Miami, Chicago, Dallas/Ft. Worth, and Los Angeles) has not worked for the past five years, and frankly, we do not see how it works going forward."
"While American is the industry leader in Latin and South America, it has a limited route network in Asia Pacific, and that cannot be solved solely through joint ventures with Qantas, Cathay Pacific, and Japan Airlines."
AA announced the cornerstone strategy (focusing on flights to/from NYC, ORD, DFW, LAX and MIA and eliminating most non-hub point to point routes) about 30 months ago, in September, 2009, not "for the past five years." Oddly enough, AA has increased its revenue quite nicely since September, 2009 with the new Cornerstone strategy. What hasn't been working are labor costs and the inability to fly anywhere near as many 70-90 seaters as UAL and DAL are permitted by their pilot agreements.
...
If reducing costs substantially and modifying the pilot scope provisions aren't enough to compete against UA or DL, then it's game over, because combining AA and the dysfunctional US won't solve the AA weaknesses.