TWU gets 4.8% equity

[jimntx]

Has anyone asked the question as to what happens to that 4.8% equity if the members actually vote out the TWU by voting in AMFA or Teamsters? Would anyone care to bet that the 4.8% goes to the new union, or that it stays under the control of the TWU International?

Also, let's remember that the 4.8% is just pieces of paper called stock certificates unless the company starts to make a profit and pays dividends. And, we know from past experience that profits can not occur until all expenses--including executive bonusses--have been paid in full.

 

[TWU informer]

Has anyone asked the question as to what happens to that 4.8% equity if the members actually vote out the TWU by voting in AMFA or Teamsters? Would anyone care to bet that the 4.8% goes to the new union, or that it stays under the control of the TWU International?

Also, let's remember that the 4.8% is just pieces of paper called stock certificates unless the company starts to make a profit and pays dividends. And, we know from past experience that profits can not occur until all expenses--including executive bonusses--have been paid in full.

A portion will belong to us in the Mechanic and Related work group, but will require legal fight to make the TWU understand that.
Side issue that they will try to use to save themselves. Typical.

The TWU will never be able fear or buy me again....I'm done with 'em.

Just as the Contract belongs to the members, so will the equity stake.

 

[Brain]

Are you serious? Why does it always come to what the other guy makes? Hey maybe you don't know this but there are a lot of folks out here working that are not skilled making more then us. And guess what..some are represented by a labor unions, now I would bet most are not though. Doesn't that just chap your a$$. I not going to address the rant about them spending money to defend there members or how they do illegal things. Because that would just be stupid of me!

 

[xUT]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&NR=1&v=4SzSKPZgAJw

 

[TWU informer]

ROFLMAO "PInky and the Brain"!

 

[Rusty]

I have no axe to grind. I just don't think they are "GOOD" for our Craft and Class as our Labor representative. And by the way I would trade if that is what my coworkers voted for. I am sure you know how I would vote. If a Labor Union was to do an Organizing drive here, I would remove myself from being a rep, and throw my support into it.

Is AMFA democratic where everyone is elected by the membership they represent? Yes.
Can AMFA officials be recalled by the membership? Yes.
Can observers be present during negotiations? Yes.

these things are true. but don't think your going to fill a room full of Observers..It won't happen...
If this is what you think it takes to fight for a good contract with a corporation then with amfa you will be at the top in no time. By the way I'm not sure by having control of your union this is going to get you a good contract. But what do I know, become part of amfa. then go to AA and let them know you are a professionals in control of your union and see what happens..


'

Craig, do you have a better way? Could you please expalin it? I think you are saying you dont' like open negotiations. Does that mean unelected officials behind closed doors will do better in your opinion?

It seems to me that would be the same as no union at all. Why not just get a company man to go talk to the company man?

 

[amtcraig1]

No I am not a fan of open negotiations. Yes I believe union officials working for me will do better behind closed doors than my coworkers in an open room. I also believe those union officials have far greater resources and money than me and my coworkers.

This is only my opinion; a union is only as strong as its membership. Something at some time got the membership riled up at your union. And I suspect instead of going to the meetings and voicing your concerns and demanding action you all decided (or fellow coworkers pushing amfa) told you your only hope is to get rid of your union. Talk about removing the/little power you my have had for your union with the company. Then after all the infighting and the continual infighting, you want to make them accountable for doing perhaps the best they can under the circumstances.

As far as no union at all, I can tell you I spent approximately 15 years in a nonunion shop (Zantop-Cargo) and I don't see much difference with what I have now.

 

[Barfbag]

The APA's percentage is 13.5%, APFA's is 3%.

My IAM equity in TWA and $ 2.25 will get me on a NYC subway. Any takers ?

 

[Rusty]

No I am not a fan of open negotiations. Yes I believe union officials working for me will do better behind closed doors than my coworkers in an open room.

Are you saying elected or unelected officials? Correct me if I am wrong but, I take it you mean unelected, otherwise they would be your coworkers and of course legal help they would retain.

I also believe those union officials have far greater resources and money than me and my coworkers.

I can't argue with you on that one, the unelected officails in our union can make over several times our wages, not to mention benefits, and then promote concessions for our membership, at the same time taking raises for them selves.


his is only my opinion; a union is only as strong as its membership. Something at some time got the membership riled up at your union. And I suspect instead of going to the meetings and voicing your concerns and demanding action you all decided (or fellow coworkers pushing amfa) told you your only hope is to get rid of your union. Talk about removing the/little power you my have had for your union with the company. Then after all the infighting and the continual infighting, you want to make them accountable for doing perhaps the best they can under the circumstances.

As far as no union at all, I can tell you I spent approximately 15 years in a nonunion shop (Zantop-Cargo) and I don't see much difference with what I have now.

I recall the membership going to the hall in mass and several times on one issue in particular. It was to vote down building a new union hall. After several times of voting it down, the president said he didn't need membership approval after all.

Wow had never heard of Zantop-cargo, very interesting story.

 

[Rusty]

Obviously I have not figured out the quote tagging yet..

 

[Buck]

Obviously I have not figured out the quote tagging yet..

Quoting Posts

Displayed below each post in a topic, there is a 'Quote' button. Pressing this button will allow you to reply to a topic, and have the text from a particular reply quoted in your own reply. When you choose to do this, an extra text field will appear below the main text input box to allow you to edit the content of the post being quoted.

 

[Brain]

Rusty, well I had not heard that story with the union hall.
That's just unacceptical. I like the way AMFA does it, in a local hotel meeting room. Can't believe you have never heard of Zantop Airlines?

 

[Frank Szabo]

Buried in this court document on pages 102-105, Jim Little & the company have an agreement letter of 4.8% equity for TWU.

http://www.amrcasein.../4131_15463.pdf

Who gets this? The "union" or the membership?

 

[FWAAA]

The equity obviously belongs to the employees but that doesn't mean the worthless union will see it that way. The total value of the claim could easily be $350 million to $500 million, so it wouldn't surprise me if Jim Little saw it as a lottery win for the union, and not the property of the membership.

I said it early on, and I'll say it again. The real crime isn't that AA jammed some concessions down your throats - that has happened to all workgroups in all airline bankruptcies in the past and would have happened no matter which union represented the employees. The crime is that you were poorly represented by the worthless union in this Ch 11 proceeding and for the decades leading up to it.

One good thing might come out of the worthless union's representation of AA's mechanics during this Ch 11 case: Perhaps AA's AMTs will finally cast aside the worthless union once and for all. And the replacement union (whichever it might be) won't be burdened with the "fault" of having permitted the concessions, which were inevitable no matter which union represented you. So if you vote in AMFA, at least AMFA won't take the blame for the LBO.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

And I suspect instead of going to the meetings and voicing your concerns and demanding action you all decided (or fellow coworkers pushing amfa) told you your only hope is to get rid of your union. Talk about removing the/little power you my have had for your union with the company. Then after all the infighting and the continual infighting, you want to make them accountable for doing perhaps the best they can under the circumstances.

Craig,

Going to meetings and voicing concerns is for
LOCAL issues. The problem with the twu is at the
INTERNATIONAL level.

If we had observers at our negotiations we'd be
able to see the international parrot the same excuses
the company sings. I like the idea of watching negotiations.

The STRUCTURE of the twu is wrong.

The twu is unwilling/unable to change their structure.

The twu needs to be replaced with a craft, democratic
union that is structured upon accountability. If the twu
doesn't like my right of Freedom of Speech that is their
problem.