sw plane goes off the rnway in mdw

[EyeInTheSky]

My thoughts and prayers go out to all involved. Very sad day. I find it quite pathetic that some of you are picking on grammar choices.

That being said, a passenger phoned into Chicago's ABC affiliate station from one of the "warming buses." She said they stayed on the plane for at least 10 minutes before evacuating. Being flight crew, I am perplexed by the evacuation delay. I am sure we will find out the answers in the coming days. You can listen to the woman at this link
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=local&id=3708676

 

[desertfox]

The end result seems similar to this........
Date of Accident: 05 March 2000
Airline: Southwest Airlines
Aircraft: Boeing 737-3T5
Location: Burbank, California, USA
Registration: N668SW
Previous Registrations: G-BLKB, N753MA
Flight Number: 1455
Fatalities: 0:142
MSN: 23060
Line Number: 1069
Engine Manufacturer: CFM International
Engine Model: CFM56-3B1
Year of Delivery: 1985
Accident Description: Arriving in Burbank on a flight from Las Vegas, NV, the crew contacted SOCAL Approach and were told to expect the visual approach to runway 8 at BUR. Approximately 10 miles from the field, while descending to 3000 feet, the crew was instructed to maintain 230 knots until further advised. One minute later, the crew was cleared for the visual approach to runway 8, with an instruction to maintain 3,000 feet until passing the Van Nuys VOR (approx 6nm from the runway).

For unknown reasons, the flight crew passed the VOR and failed to start their descent from 3000 feet. 3.9nm from the runway threshold, at an airspeed of 230 knots and an altitude of 3000 feet, the crew began their descent to land. Due to the steep nature of the descent (nearly 7°), the crew received two "sink rate" warnings at approximately 400' AGL, and a "pull up" warning at 190' AGL. The aircraft touched down 2800' down the 6032' runway with a groundspeed of 181 knots.

Despite using max reverse thrust, spoilers, and brakes, the crew was unable to stop the aircraft before the end of the runway. The plane broke through a blast fence at approximately 40 knots, skidded across Hollywood Way, and came to rest 38' from a Chevron gasoline station. The aircraft was evacuated via the escape slides.

Check out picture link............
http://www.airdisaster.com/photos/wn1455/photo.shtml

In todays case it would appear that field conditions and visability may have had a part to play, but as in most accidents, a combination of factors is usually involved. Sink rate, approach speed, and approach technique will all be examined no doubt.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

A six year old little boy was Crushed to Death while riding in his car, by a skidding A/c, that plowed thru the MDW airport fence, and wound up on a public street.

This first paragraph IS true.
BUT notice I wrote "A skidding A/C"

Nothing more, Nothing less !!!!!!!!!!!!

Right now, as far as this little boy is concerned, it does'nt make a DAM bit of difference, "Which" A/C it was !

The SYSTEM has PLENTY of time to assign blame as to WHO, or WHAT was at fault !!!!!!!!!!!!!

I for one will ask our CREATOR for many prayers for the family !!!

I ask you all, to join me !!

NH/BB's

 

[l8rd8r]

The airline industry is a family and no matter where you are when you hear the news of an airline crash it gets your attention...

MY FAMILYS HEARTS AND PRAYERS GO OUT TO EACH EMPLOYEE, CUSTOMER AND BYSTANDER THAT WAS AFFECTED BY THIS. TAKE A MOMENT TODAY TO THINK ABOUT THAT CHILD AND HIS FAMILY. MY CHEERS TO THOSE THAT SAFETLY EVACUATED THAT AIRCRAFT...A USAIR FAMILY MEMBER

 

[SilentWarrior]

Thoughts and prayers go to the families as well as the flight crew involved.

The blame game can start at a later time. Let the NTSB do its job.

 

[EyeInTheSky]

This is freaky:

33 years to the day at MDW

1972, December 8: Crash of United Airlines Flight 533

"This was probably the most investigated airplane crash in history" said Deputy Cook County Coroner John Haigh when he announced the findings of the coroner's jury looking into the crash at Midway Airport. The findings coincided with those of the National Transportation Safety Board: pilot error.

Flight 533 left Washington D.C. for Omaha, Nebraska stopping in Chicago. Approaching Midway the pilot was instructed by the control tower to execute a "missed approach" pattern. The pilot applied full power to go around for another landing attempt. At 2:27 p.m., 1.5 miles from the airport, Flight 533 hit the branches of trees on the south side of 71st Street. It then hit the roofs of a number of neighborhood bungalows before plowing into the home of Mrs. Veronica Kuculich at 3722 70th Place, demolishing the home and killing her and a daughter, Theresa. The plane burst into flames killing a total of 45 persons, 43 of them on the plane, including the pilot and first and second officers. Eighteen passengers survived.

Among the passengers killed were U.S. Representative George Collins (7th), a former 24th Ward Alderman, and Mrs. Dorothy Hunt. Her husband, E. Howard Hunt, had been indicted on charges of conspiring to break into the Democratic National Committee Headquarters in the Watergate Hotel. Found in the debris was a purse belonging to Mrs. Hunt containing $10,585 in cash. There was immediate concern that the money might be linked to the financial dealings surrounding the Nixon "slush fund" to which defendants in the Watergate case had access and that the crash therefore might be linked to sabotage. In the end sabotage was ruled out, but the mystery surrounding the money and the deaths of such prominent, politically connected individuals insured a very thorough investigation.

The NTSB issued its report after recreating the last minutes of the flight based on the flight and voice recording instruments, interviews with survivors and eyewitnesses on the ground, and physical evidence. According to the report, when Midway's control tower directed the crew to abort the landing and try again, they became distracted and failed to prepare a proper landing. As they attempted to pull the jet from the landing descent, the crew forgot to deactivate the wing spoilers. The plane stalled. And then it crashed.

 

[traderjake]

I believe that Southwest has yet to kill a passenger (well, there was ONE, but he was killed by other passengers) in its entire history

Does the fact that the person killed in this accident was not a passenger make any difference?

If anything being an innocent bystander makes it a bigger tragedy.

 

[Busdrvr]

My condolences to all those involved. Just for information sake, is the autothrottles and autobrakes disabled on the 700's? Handflying a 737 to a runway in a snowstorm with 200 ft VV is not where I'd want to be. As to the "legality", just because the metar was showing weather below limits doesn't mean it was. They may have gotten a report from the tower before the FAF that showed it to be above mins. I highly doubt they would have done the approach if it were not legal. Let's just pray the reports of deaths will turn out to be premature and false.

 

[WNrforlife]

And the hip shooters come out before the last ambulance has even left the scene...literally.

My heart goes out to all impacted/involved. It also has to go out to those who seem to think that this is an "opportunity" (to sling mud) rather than a tragedy. One slight diff between MDW and BUR incidents...there was a little thing called snow and another complication such as collapsed nose gear that were involved at MDW. Two incidents over 30+ years is a damn good record and I commend all at WN for a remarkable record. FAR better than any other carrier.

My best to all.

It's actually 3 accidents - don't forget about the flight to LBB that ran off the runway back in '85 or '86 during a thunderstorm. Buried both engines in the mud.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Prayers and thoughts of comfort to the crash victims in Chicago, especially to the family of the child killed in his car.

Those of us at competing carriers have always been in awe of how SWA has managed to lead such a charmed existence while operating their aircraft like cowboys of days gone by. Complaints about some of the things we've all witness fall on deaf ears at the FAA. Being a tombstone agency, the FAA only reacts when forced to. Well, it appears that the FAA has their tombstone. SWA is about to undergo the incredibly detailed scrutiny of every aspect of their operation which, IMHO, has been overdue for decades. The traveling public will be better for it.

I'm so sorry that someone had to die first. But that is our FAA's way. Look for a "new" SWA operation in the very near future. My carrier has been on the FAA examination table before. Think of a colonoscopy without the valium.

Good luck to the folks at SWA, and welcome to the real world of airline operations.

 

[phl/yyz]

maybe its time to realise that low cost carriers such as southwest arent so safe with their go go go take off take off speed threw the runways and be so go go just too make the company money not looking at safety

TRUE!

 

[x15]

My brother flies for SWA. As far as minimums go, as someone else said, the wx can go up and down with a temporary opening. Another thing - SWA often has lower minimums than other carriers because of the capabilites of their heads up displays. He said they even have special lower CAT I minimums (1800 instead of 2400)at some airports than other carriers with coupled equipment due to the characteristics of the heads up guidance system. he also told me that SWA has lower mins at MDW because of their heads up display. He laughs when other people think SWA is "cheating" on an approach and say something on the radio such as "we're telling the Feds" while they are holding for THEIR minimums. No SWA pilot would risk a fine and purposely make an approach with weather below mins. He let me in a SWA sim and I used the system. After a few minutes they had me do an approach AND landing with it down to zero-zero just to show me it's capabilities. It has idle command and flare command, all done with hand flying. I stopped after landing, they brought the weather up, and I was right on centerline. It's a marvelous and easy to use sytem with a totally different philosophy than coupled approaches.

As far as the FAA coming in and making changes - that was done after the BUR incident. Actually SWA made the changes with FAA approval. He said much tighter restrictions and procedures have been written for them. This accident will not be attributed to SWA procedures or manuals at all contrary to what some of you know it alls think. It was just an accident just as your airlines have had.

This accident will simply boil down to a runway that had poorer braking action than what was reported. I've seen it at MDW before.

 

[robbedagain]

my HEARTFELT PRAYERS and THOUGHTS are to everyone involved. ANd especially to the family of the 6 yr old boy who died.

One passenger said that the he couldnt tell if the plane landed on the grass or the runway. it will be interesting to see the final report on this accident

 

[eolesen]

Just for information sake, is the autothrottles and autobrakes disabled on the 700's? Handflying a 737 to a runway in a snowstorm with 200 ft VV is not where I'd want to be.

Don't know about autoland, but Gary Kelly was quoted earlier on the local CBS affiliate as saying that as a policy, WN does not allow its pilots to use autobrakes.

It also appear this will be recorded as a fatal accident.

 

[Busdrvr]

My brother flies for SWA. As far as minimums go, as someone else said, the wx can go up and down with a temporary opening. Another thing - SWA often has lower minimums than other carriers because of the capabilites of their heads up displays. He said they even have special lower CAT I minimums (1800 instead of 2400)at some airports than other carriers with coupled equipment due to the characteristics of the heads up guidance system. he also told me that SWA has lower mins at MDW because of their heads up display. He laughs when other people think SWA is "cheating" on an approach and say something on the radio such as "we're telling the Feds" while they are holding for THEIR minimums. No SWA pilot would risk a fine and purposely make an approach with weather below mins. He let me in a SWA sim and I used the system. After a few minutes they had me do an approach AND landing with it down to zero-zero just to show me it's capabilities. It has idle command and flare command, all done with hand flying. I stopped after landing, they brought the weather up, and I was right on centerline. It's a marvelous and easy to use sytem with a totally different philosophy than coupled approaches.

As far as the FAA coming in and making changes - that was done after the BUR incident. Actually SWA made the changes with FAA approval. He said much tighter restrictions and procedures have been written for them. This accident will not be attributed to SWA procedures or manuals at all contrary to what some of you know it alls think. It was just an accident just as your airlines have had.

This accident will simply boil down to a runway that had poorer braking action than what was reported. I've seen it at MDW before.

just to clear up some misconceptions on your part...

The HUD may allow lower mins than other GUPPIES, but it doesn't result in lower mins than an A320, 777 or other jet with a 3 axis AP. The guppy has been limited by the fact that the rudder does not have an autopilot channel, therefore, it can and does land in a crab when doing an autoland. Having approx 1500 hours of HUD time, I can say they are WONDERFULL, however, they have their deficiencies. First, they can facilitate channelized attention, AKA HUD Head. The second big problem with a HUD, specifically with hand flying a CAT III approach off one, is that a HUMAN then must control airspeed, as well as the three axis' that an autoland function would usually control, while fighting some really wicked weather, with the added bonus of fighting the "invisible hand" of Spatial D. carrying 5 knots of extra speed on a 6500 ft snow covered runway can result in a HUGE increase in landing distance. Other factors such as a slightly long aimpoint or any delay in applying MAXIMUM braking would also have dramatic affects. Personally, despite being "God's gift to aviation" (aren't we all? ), This is not an approach I'd have a lot of "fun" doing. Legal? Probably. An accident waiting to happen? I'd say so. I'd take autoland, autothrottles and autobrakes over Chuck Yeager every day of the week with those conditions.