Rumor has it DL PHL-LHR

[eolesen]

Essentially, a three year track record while both of their largest competitors across the North Atlantic were caught up in either a bankruptcy or a merger (or both)?

OK...

 

[topDawg]

Essentially, a three year track record while both of their largest competitors across the North Atlantic were caught up in either a bankruptcy or a merger (or both)?

OK...

and one airline has been slashing its TATL network to outsource it to AF/KL 
 
and FWIW E, AA and UA should completely be on Delta level. Yes Delta did its merger 8 years ago, but AA should already be done. Only Delta gets time to get things done. 
We learned this when we also learned that AA is overstaffed. 

 

[WorldTraveler]

Essentially, a three year track record while both of their largest competitors across the North Atlantic were caught up in either a bankruptcy or a merger (or both)?

OK...

 
and that is the first mover advantage that I have repeatedly said that DL had with its BK....

tell us where AA is successfully growing its network? UA ?

both have added a lot of flying that is at best seasonal now - and well below average fares for other carriers- while DL has significantly closed the average fare gap in major markets like LHR that are major parts of AA and UA"s network strengths.

you can look back in a few years but the chances that AA or UA will gain as much of DL's key markets as DL gains of theirs is very, very small.

and, dawg, DL is NOT outsourcing more of its flying. the facts are very clear that DL is growing its network more than AF/KL - and yet you keep clinging to your ideas even though they are false - but they sure do provide the justification for you to think you are being picked on.

 

[topDawg]

 and, dawg, DL is NOT outsourcing more of its flying. the facts are very clear that DL is growing its network more than AF/KL - and yet you keep clinging to your ideas even though they are false - but they sure do provide the justification for you to think you are being picked on.

According to DALPA they Delta is still not at its share of EASKs..... 
 
I know you know more than they do though......even though you don't even have the smallest idea of how the JV agreement works. 

 

[eolesen]

So, the only real area of growth you can point to for DL is catching up to AA and UA at LHR?

 

[jcw]

Yes that is correct - DL is the only airline growing it's network
 
Glad to see DL is last to the LHR
 
I know when DL adds a route and it loses money it's strategic - if anyone other airline adds routes and it's losing money it's trashed
 
So there is no way any other airline can win or do anything right

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

DFW-LHR is next

 
Oh my!
Looks like somebody is becoming unhinged. 
Again.
 
I thought that DL is coming to operate MIA-Latin America.  Wasn't that your long-time narrative?  What happened to those plans?
 
 

I'm seeing net losses (some of them very large) for Delta in the Atlantic region for each and every year other than 2007, 2012, 2013 and so far in 2014. That's the "track record of profitability to Europe that DL has?"
 

 
Oh great, there you go ruining a fine narrative with facts and numbers and such.  Bummer.

 

[topDawg]

So, the only real area of growth you can point to for DL is catching up to AA and UA at LHR?

I am trying to really figure out this quote "growth" WT keeps talking about. 
 
You notice how he never compares peak season to peak season. So far his comparisons have been of months where Delta added an extra week to a few of the Europe seasonal flights. 
 
and even in LHR Delta has been, for the most part this year, swapping flights with Virgin. LAX-LHR for ATL-LHR. EWR-LHR for DTW-LHR. 

 

[topDawg]

 
Oh my!
Looks like somebody is becoming unhinged. 
Again.
 
I thought that DL is coming to operate MIA-Latin America.  Wasn't that your long-time narrative?  What happened to those plans?
 
 
 
Oh great, there you go ruining a fine narrative with facts and numbers and such.  Bummer.

they were and are WT pipe dreams. 
 
DFW-LHR has a much much much better chance of happening that any real growth in MIA. 

 

[WorldTraveler]

A whole lot longer? I'm seeing net losses (some of them very large) for Delta in the Atlantic region for each and every year other than 2007, 2012, 2013 and so far in 2014. That's the "track record of profitability to Europe that DL has?" Huh? Color me not very impressed with Delta's performance across the Atlantic.

The database is buggy for me right now so I can't access the AA or US numbers, but the DL net income figures aren't anything to write home about.

apparently the bugginess of the DOT database is with your system.

DL has had no losses on the Atlantic for two years including in 2014.

AA and US should have been so lucky.

According to DALPA they Delta is still not at its share of EASKs..... 
 
I know you know more than they do though......even though you don't even have the smallest idea of how the JV agreement works.

and yet you somehow push a union but don't think ALPA is capable of taking care of it on their own?

you do realize that ALPA just agreed to measurement for the DL-VS JV, don't you? if ALPA thought that DL had unfinished business with the AFKL JV, don't you think they would have help the company's feet to the fire on that?
 

So, the only real area of growth you can point to for DL is catching up to AA and UA at LHR?

 
 
where did you EVER come up with that?

no where did I ever say it was the ONLY area of growth? LHR is the biggest market that DL didn't have a large presence in so it is the most significant growth market for DL, but it is HARDLY the only.

given that DL has been growing its network - all mainline - far faster than any other of the big 4, there are clearly a whole lot of other markets where DL is growing, even if you miss it.

 

[topDawg]

and yet you somehow push a union but don't think ALPA is capable of taking care of it on their own?

you do realize that ALPA just agreed to measurement for the DL-VS JV, don't you? if ALPA thought that DL had unfinished business with the AFKL JV, don't you think they would have help the company's feet to the fire on that?
 
 
 

Uh......
duh? 
 
They could not sign an agreement and then Delta anything they want? 
 
 
you don't really understand how scope works do you? 

 

[WorldTraveler]

Since you wrote an incomplete statement, I'm not sure what you are saying but if ALPA didn't believe that DL was properly handling the AF-KL JV, ALPA wouldn't have signed an agreement regarding VS.

ALPA realizes that the AF strike on top of the capacity that DL had already put back into the market helped dramatically to put DL in compliance and that the growth that DL is adding to its network is far in excess of what AF-KL is doing.

but since that doesn't fit your narrative, it isn't surprising that you don't want to believe the facts that show that - or the obvious reality that ALPA doesn't agree with you.

 

[jcw]

Compliance - so DL has been out of compliance?  Is this another mistake at DL?

 

[WorldTraveler]

could be any number of things... most pilots believe it is the result of the addition of AZ to the AF/KL joint venture.

regardless of the reason, if ALPA didn't believe that DL could be trusted to protect the pilots' interests regarding the AF/KL/AZ joint venture, they sure wouldn't have signed an agreement regarding the VS JV - and there are some pilots who believe the language regarding the VS JV is even less rigid than for the DL/AF/KL/AZ JV

 

[FrugalFlyerv2.0]

ALPA realizes that the AF strike on top of the capacity that DL had already put back into the market helped dramatically to put DL in compliance and that the growth that DL is adding to its network is far in excess of what AF-KL is doing.
 

 
I thought that DL did not increase frequency across the Atlantic during the AF pilot strike?  Or is that incorrect?
 
BTW:  I'm no business major, but relying on your JV partner to have a strike in order for you to be in compliance with your pilots agreement is not a very sound business strategy (i.e. I know the French love strikes, but one can't count on AF pilots striking every year ... ... ...)