Profit Sharing Almost Definite..

[Travelpro72]

As far as showing a profit east or west, what has the merger done to honestly show a HUGE difference? The profits you see on the east side of the operation are NOT from the merger synergies but from concessions and more people taking to the skies. So, if we take only what we made on the east side of the operation and divied it out amongst the east I'd STILL probably get a bigger chunk in my check. Now, if we did NOT merge and we did not share against our will our profit sharing what kind of profit sharing check would YOU get out west?

 

[Itestwell]

Ah, that the East and West should be treated differently! Combined contracts, senority list and all request that both sides be treated the same except for... $ . You can't have it both ways.

I think you need to reinvent you thought process.

Once again, you have missed it. We want to be treated the same with regards to $. Reread the posts, it's not that difficult to grasp.

 

[Whatnow?]

Please keep in mind that you came down from your lofty perch and settled where we always were. As a westie, I have never had a chance to make the good money you easties did. If I was able to make what you guys were making in the 90's and early 00's, I would certainly be in a much better financial situation right now....That being said, I would like to say that you all have made sacrificies on the east, and you do deserve better.

Believe it or not back in the early 80's I was interviewing with AWA at the same time I interviewed with USAir.....I was offered a CSR position with AWA in PHX but turned it down because the starting pay was ridiculous! Being from the west it would have been nice to live out there and work for a brand new AWA......but reality set in and I turned down the offer much to the suprise of the interviewer. I made a good choice coming to USAir because at the time USAir was one of the best paid in the Industry. We all make choices in where we want to be employed and the salaries we accept. Again, it's not East vs West right now.....it's a fulfillment of a promise made in dire times to the East employees for all their sacrifices.

 

[N109UW]

I'm a little bit confused. As a west employee, what I'm hearing is East employes had a contract for profit sharing, while west did not. The contract was made before the merger but East employees are expecting to not only profit from the old US Airways, but the old HP too?

It would seem to me, that if you do not include the west employees in the sharing, then you should calculate the amount to be shared from what the old US Airways would have made had their not been a merger. Which would have been zero. Granted, the east operations created a profit but it would not have been possible w/o the synergies created by the merger.

Or, you could look at east operational profit and share that with east employees and west operational profit and share that with west employees. But as it stands now, I don't buy the claim that west is taking part of the east profit sharing because part of that profit came from the west.

Piney hit it on the head. We only wanted profit sharing from what we earned, on our side. Take my cut out of the 241 million, and that was just the 2Q, generated on the east side of the operation. We are good with that. It would not be tough to seperate the profits to each side.

 

[BeenThereDoneThat]

No one is arguing that. You're completely missing the point.

The points are:(1) your EAST side sold you out by agreeing to "share" with the WEST.(2)the west did not ask for your profit sharing.(3)Both EAST and WEST will take "ANY" monies that the airline will give to them. Which is human nature for beings that have been shafted out of their pay and benefits previously. It is "THEM" (management and the union) not the "employee".

 

[gaucho99]

Look at this example, and granted it is an exaggeration but it makes my point. Suppose you work for PoDunk Airlines with 50 employees. You give up part of your pay to help the company survive in exchange for future profit sharing of 10 percent, should there be any. PoDunk merges with American Airlines and decides to name the new company PoDunk because it has a better ring to it. The new PoDunk makes 1 Billion dollars the next year and because of the concessions, you get to share 100 million dollars between the 50 employees because AA did not have a profit sharing agreement in place.

While the above example is ridiculous, in a way, it is the same. When US Airways promised future profit sharing, they were not taking into acount combined profits from two merged carriers still operating seperatly. Just as it would not be right for Podunk to exclude AA, neither would it be right for East to exclude west entirely. So I think the decision is the right one and IIRC isn't the East getting a bigger piece of the pie anyway?

 

[Itestwell]

The points are:(1) your EAST side sold you out by agreeing to "share" with the WEST.(2)the west did not ask for your profit sharing.(3)Both EAST and WEST will take "ANY" monies that the airline will give to them. Which is human nature for beings that have been shafted out of their pay and benefits previously. It is "THEM" (management and the union) not the "employee".

Which is pretty much what I said in post #48. Agreed.

 

[Travelpro72]

The east and west profits could very easily be divided up to see what side made what amount. Use the east profit for their profit sharing and the west for their profit sharing. That should keep everyone happy. A NEW profit sharing agreement should be had for all in a new negotiated contract. Until that time we can't start sharing/imposing contractually agreed upon items between either side. One agreement for all. This was in OUR agreement. Again, Mike is to blame. As far as that transition agreement went......please. Thats been another thread in itself. A JOKE.

 

[Itestwell]

Look at this example, and granted it is an exaggeration but it makes my point. Suppose you work for PoDunk Airlines with 50 employees. You give up part of your pay to help the company survive in exchange for future profit sharing of 10 percent, should there be any. PoDunk merges with American Airlines and decides to name the new company PoDunk because it has a better ring to it. The new PoDunk makes 1 Billion dollars the next year and because of the concessions, you get to share 100 million dollars between the 50 employees because AA did not have a profit sharing agreement in place.

While the above example is ridiculous, in a way, it is the same. When US Airways promised future profit sharing, they were not taking into acount combined profits from two merged carriers still operating seperatly. Just as it would not be right for Podunk to exclude AA, neither would it be right for East to exclude west entirely. So I think the decision is the right one and IIRC isn't the East getting a bigger piece of the pie anyway?

I am assuming PoDunk negotiated to give up the $$$ in the pre- merger concessions, correct? Now, was the profit sharing simply given to the AA employees, or was it negotiated in a transition agreement? Could the Union have negotiated something even better with AA mgmt. during the transition talks that would have required mgmt to pony up some $$$ for future success (read good faith mgmt.), or did PODunks union simply hand over the concessionary rewards without trying to negotiate first?

 

[ClueByFour]

It would seem to me, that if you do not include the west employees in the sharing, then you should calculate the amount to be shared from what the old US Airways would have made had their not been a merger. Which would have been zero. Granted, the east operations created a profit but it would not have been possible w/o the synergies created by the merger.

While I agree that East would probably have been a goner without the merger, it is worth noting that something on the order of 3/4 of the profit was generated by "east" when they still broke it out that way.

 

[EricLv2Fish]

Granted the West Non-union folks are in the minority here, but prior to the merger...it was either grade 22 or 23 and above, received bonus checks based on the amount of profit (Grades 23 or 22 and below recieved guarenteed raises). I had received 2 really nice bonus checks in 2002 and 2004. Today the picture is this for the Tech-Ops folks: The non-union Tech-Ops folks have been creted into the IAM and pay IAM dues, but yet are not represented by them as of yet. The IAM is refusing any profit sharing. Talk about getting the SHAFT. What the HELL is the IAM thinking! ARE THEY STUPID. What a friggin travesty. IAM glad IAM no longer there to be screwed by the IAM!

 

[N109UW]

The points are:[/color2)the west did not ask for your profit sharing.(3)Both EAST and WEST will take "ANY" monies that the airline will give to them. Which is human nature for beings that have been shafted out of their pay and benefits previously. It is "THEM" (management and the union) not the "employee".

I thought your MECP approached ours about giving you are profit sharing. That was stated earlier. Also, I don't want any money that is due YOU or at anyone elses expense. Your statement speaks volumes about your character. I truly hope most do not follow your sentiment. I have already had some great RON's with Westies, front and back, and look forward to more. They did not share your values, and that was refreshing.

 

[700UW]

Eric,

Let me explain this one more time.

Did any of the West Employees give concessions in the last US Chapter 11 case?

HP employees did not participate in the concessions, therefore they are not entilted to the profit sharing.

It says alot how they want something for nothing and take money out of the East Employees wallets and food off their table.

 

[luvn737s]

The continuing sacrifices made by AWA employees for many, many years allowed an AWA to exist with which to merge and without which U would have vanished. The fat paychecks that U employees from top to bottom enjoyed should have been socked away for a rainy day. It's the ant and the grasshopper story all over again. Only now the grasshopper is accusing the ant of stealing HIS food!

People are all too ready to sympathise with those who have lost much, yet ignore those who never had any to begin with.

 

[beachboy]

Piney-

No one asked the line flight attendants. Mike Flores and the MEC gang handed it over. And PITBull is right, it will come back to bite him in the a**. They think we are asleep but we are taking notes.