Oil prices going to the century mark

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

We'll know in about 24 hours, but I suspect one reason why the Dems are leading in the polls is because the DNC made a conscious effort to make this election a referendum on George Bush, and not about any other issue.

That's a great short term strategy which may swing the election in more than a few races, but it's going to eventually backfire on them in two years because as soon as Bush isn't there as a whipping horse, people will start to see that the Dem's really don't have a plan for addressing most of the issues they're blasting Bush for.

Still, polls showed John Kerry and Al Gore winning the past two elections in a lot of states which eventually voted for Bush, so I'd hold off on celebrating too early.

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

FM,
I like my(democrat) party's chances, BETTER than the GOP, in 2008.

Bill Frist("Stay the Course"), president ???..."HARDLY"
John McCain(Who is hated by his OWN party)....."No Way"
Jack Abramoff(OOPS I forgot he's in the CAN)..ID# xxxxxx
Mark Foley("send me a PICTURE of yourself")
Ted Haggard("I bought Meth, BUT I NEVER "snorted")
Denny Hastert("I Don't recall/Where's the door OUTTA' here"


NH/BB's

 

[MCI transplant]

//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

FM,
I like my(democrat) party's chances, BETTER than the GOP, in 2008.

Bill Frist("Stay the Course"), president ???..."HARDLY"
John McCain(Who is hated by his OWN party)....."No Way"
Jack Abramoff(OOPS I forgot he's in the CAN)..ID# xxxxxx
Mark Foley("send me a PICTURE of yourself")
Ted Haggard("I bought Meth, BUT I NEVER "snorted")
Denny Hastert("I Don't recall/Where's the door OUTTA' here"
NH/BB's

<_< ------ Bear, you forgot Hillery!!! Shame on you! ---Go Chiefs!!!!!

 

[Vortilon]

The statement shows your complete lack of understanding about this countrys formation and religons in general.

On the contrary people who fight for the separation of religion are fighting for its protection and for the stability of the political process. This country was not founded on Christianity and the founding fathers who were mainly free masons made great effort in writing to point that out. Take The Constitution a secular document, nowhere does it appeal to God, Christianity, Jesus, or any supreme being. The first amendment states that Congress shall make NO law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

The founding fathers time and again went to great lengths to make certain that people knew and had reference to that this country was again Not founded on the Christian religion or in fact any other. This written in the Treaty with Tripoli read before the congress in 1797 and signed by president Adams, one of the original founding fathers of this great country. As stated in the Constitution, Article, VI, Sect. 2: "This Constitution, and the laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof, and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every State shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any State to the contrary notwithstanding."

The only people making arguments as to the US being founded on Christianity and the religious fanatical who want control of people politics and this country. Truly right minded and truly religious people would not want the government in their religion or place of worship.

Last time I checked, our founding fathers were Christians - end of story....

 

[eolesen]

Yep. Anyone who thinks our current government wasn't founded on Judeo/Christian values is simply in denial.

That's OK -- they're entitled to believe what they want for now, but God will get even later.

 

[Vortilon]

I didnt realize that the native americans where Christians...hum

Here's a tip, indians didn't found this country. They were roaming inhabitants of north america. They just lost out to the evil European immigrants - who then formed a country.

 

[Ed Norton]

Democrat, Republican? Two sides of the same coin. I think Thomas Jefferson gave us an alternative:

"...We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,– That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness..."
Of course if Jefferson was around to write those words today, he would be labeled an enemy combatant under the Military Commisions Act.,
I can picture it now. Thomas Jefferson held without trial, with no right of habeas chorpus, wearing an orange jumpsuit in Guantanamo Bay. :down: :down:

 

[FA Mikey]

Last time I checked, our founding fathers were Christians - end of story....

Check again!

Benjamin Franklin, said: As to Jesus of Nazareth, my Opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the System of Morals and his Religion...has received various corrupting Changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his Divinity; tho' it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble." He died a month later, and historians consider him, like so many great Americans of his time, to be a Deist, not a Christian.

Ethan Allen, whose capture of Fort Ticonderoga while commanding the Green Mountain Boys helped inspire Congress and the country to pursue the War of Independence, said, "That Jesus Christ was not God is evidence from his own words." In the same book, Allen noted that he was generally "denominated a Deist, the reality of which I never disputed, being conscious that I am no Christian." When Allen married Fanny Buchanan, he stopped his own wedding ceremony when the judge asked him if he promised "to live with Fanny Buchanan agreeable to the laws of God." Allen refused to answer until the judge agreed that the God referred to was the God of Nature, and the laws those "written in the great book of nature."

Thomas Jefferson, third president and author of the Declaration of Independence, said:"I trust that there is not a young man now living in the United States who will not die a Unitarian." He referred to the Revelation of St. John as "the ravings of a maniac" and wrote:
The Christian priesthood, finding the doctrines of Christ levelled to every understanding and too plain to need explanation, saw, in the mysticisms of Plato, materials with which they might build up an artificial system which might, from its indistinctness, admit everlasting controversy, give employment for their order, and introduce it to profit, power, and pre-eminence. The doctrines which flowed from the lips of Jesus himself are within the comprehension of a child; but thousands of volumes have not yet explained the Platonisms engrafted on them: and for this obvious reason that nonsense can never be explained."

James Madison, fourth president and father of the Constitution, was not religious in any conventional sense. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."

George Washington, the first president of the United States, never declared himself a Christian according to contemporary reports or in any of his voluminous correspondence. Washington Championed the cause of freedom from religious intolerance and compulsion. When John Murray (a universalist who denied the existence of hell) was invited to become an army chaplain, the other chaplains petitioned Washington for his dismissal. Instead, Washington gave him the appointment. On his deathbed, Washinton uttered no words of a religious nature and did not call for a clergyman to be in attendance.

Thomas Paine was a pamphleteer whose manifestos encouraged the faltering spirits of the country and aided materially in winning the war of Independence:
I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of...Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."

These statements and writings help show they were not Christian. Yet somehow their beliefs of openness and tolerance to people and religions are more Christian than those who claim to be today.

George Washington served as a master Mason and remained a Mason until he died. Benjamin Franklin served as the head of the fraternity in Pennsylvania, as did Paul Revere and Joseph Warren in Massachusetts. John Hancock, John Sullivan, Lafayette, Baron Fredrick von Stuben, Nathanael Greene, and John Paul Jones.

Yep. Anyone who thinks our current government wasn't founded on Judeo/Christian values is simply in denial.

That's OK -- they're entitled to believe what they want for now, but God will get even later.

Happily my God is not a vengeful hateful one like yours

 

[keezy44]

If there is only one true religion then 90% of this world is in real trouble. Hopefully God doesn't believe in hell or most of us are in trouble. Maybe we made all of this up and he didn't. Then I could be wrong but I don't think so.

 

[local 12 proud]

If there is only one true religion then 90% of this world is in real trouble. Hopefully God doesn't believe in hell or most of us are in trouble. Maybe we made all of this up and he didn't. Then I could be wrong but I don't think so.

Then Convert!

 

[MCI transplant]

Yep. Anyone who thinks our current government wasn't founded on Judeo/Christian values is simply in denial.

That's OK -- they're entitled to believe what they want for now, but God will get even later.

<_< ----Amen!!!!

 

[kirkpatrick]

Happily my God is not a vengeful hateful one like yours

Thanks, Mikey, for taking the trouble to research that. I've often wondered why the history books continue to idolize "the Pilgrims," who must have been one of the most obnoxious groups who ever lived. They came over here so they could continue to burn witches, which was frowned upon in the Old Country.

The vast, overwhelming majority of American immigrants came here for non-religious reasons. That's why I value my freedom of religion so much. It enables me to be free from religion.

MK

 

[AMFAMAN]

Democrat, Republican? Two sides of the same coin. I think Thomas Jefferson gave us an alternative:

"...We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,– That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness..."
Of course if Jefferson was around to write those words today, he would be labeled an enemy combatant under the Military Commisions Act.,
I can picture it now. Thomas Jefferson held without trial, with no right of habeas chorpus, wearing an orange jumpsuit in Guantanamo Bay. :down: :down:

Well said racoon brother...well said

 

[Garfield1966]

PS: Don't count your chickens before they're hatched. Remember, Dems win polls, Republicans win elections.

Guess now we win both elections and polls. Geez, when is the last time anyone lost 26 seats in the house? I'm to tired to look it up.

I am thinking that the republican morality BS from 2000/2004 came back and bit you boys in the arse. I love poetic justice.

 

[Vortilon]

Check again!

Benjamin Franklin, said: As to Jesus of Nazareth, my Opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the System of Morals and his Religion...has received various corrupting Changes, and I have, with most of the present dissenters in England, some doubts as to his Divinity; tho' it is a question I do not dogmatize upon, having never studied it, and think it needless to busy myself with it now, when I expect soon an opportunity of knowing the Truth with less trouble." He died a month later, and historians consider him, like so many great Americans of his time, to be a Deist, not a Christian.

Ethan Allen, whose capture of Fort Ticonderoga while commanding the Green Mountain Boys helped inspire Congress and the country to pursue the War of Independence, said, "That Jesus Christ was not God is evidence from his own words." In the same book, Allen noted that he was generally "denominated a Deist, the reality of which I never disputed, being conscious that I am no Christian." When Allen married Fanny Buchanan, he stopped his own wedding ceremony when the judge asked him if he promised "to live with Fanny Buchanan agreeable to the laws of God." Allen refused to answer until the judge agreed that the God referred to was the God of Nature, and the laws those "written in the great book of nature."

Thomas Jefferson, third president and author of the Declaration of Independence, said:"I trust that there is not a young man now living in the United States who will not die a Unitarian." He referred to the Revelation of St. John as "the ravings of a maniac" and wrote:
The Christian priesthood, finding the doctrines of Christ levelled to every understanding and too plain to need explanation, saw, in the mysticisms of Plato, materials with which they might build up an artificial system which might, from its indistinctness, admit everlasting controversy, give employment for their order, and introduce it to profit, power, and pre-eminence. The doctrines which flowed from the lips of Jesus himself are within the comprehension of a child; but thousands of volumes have not yet explained the Platonisms engrafted on them: and for this obvious reason that nonsense can never be explained."

James Madison, fourth president and father of the Constitution, was not religious in any conventional sense. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."

George Washington, the first president of the United States, never declared himself a Christian according to contemporary reports or in any of his voluminous correspondence. Washington Championed the cause of freedom from religious intolerance and compulsion. When John Murray (a universalist who denied the existence of hell) was invited to become an army chaplain, the other chaplains petitioned Washington for his dismissal. Instead, Washington gave him the appointment. On his deathbed, Washinton uttered no words of a religious nature and did not call for a clergyman to be in attendance.

Thomas Paine was a pamphleteer whose manifestos encouraged the faltering spirits of the country and aided materially in winning the war of Independence:
I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of...Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."

These statements and writings help show they were not Christian. Yet somehow their beliefs of openness and tolerance to people and religions are more Christian than those who claim to be today.

George Washington served as a master Mason and remained a Mason until he died. Benjamin Franklin served as the head of the fraternity in Pennsylvania, as did Paul Revere and Joseph Warren in Massachusetts. John Hancock, John Sullivan, Lafayette, Baron Fredrick von Stuben, Nathanael Greene, and John Paul Jones.

Happily my God is not a vengeful hateful one like yours

Yeah Mikey, they were all atheists. The problem you have with religion is so single agenda driven that you're trying rewrite history to suit your needs. Where did you dig all this tripe up from the Micheal Moore book of US History?

Look, you can dig up all the quotes you want. Point is, they were more Christian than they were any other religion. Also, they didn't have to deal with things like abortion and gay marriage.

If you honestly think having some happy go lucky limp wrists running this country, is going to make things all better for you and everybody will be happy - you're in for a big surprise.

 

[Hopeful]

And here I thought this topic was about oil prices!