NONREV RUN-A-ROUND

[echoe1]

I just don't get WN and their nonrev information they give out to oal employees. They will tell you how many seats are "left to sell." But they won't tell you if a flight is on an overbooked status? Why not? This game becomes very frustrating. Especially if you have someone in your family you have to get home, and you are getting creative by taking them into other cities that perhaps your own airline doesnt fly to. Then, they get there, after being told 4 and 5 times by the res agent the flt looks good, and then the pax is adv flt is oversold when they are in this other city. THis is plain mean! Cruel! And such a horrific game! This happened to a family member of mine 2x last week. We ended up buying 2 tickets totalling over $400 because of this pathetic game.

Why is it such a crime to let a nonrever know at least that the flight is on an overbooked status? I was told by a supervisor they can't give that information out. These games the airlines play with each other and employees has to stop! It is especially disgruntling if your flying a child of yours somewhere.

I generally love WN and fly nonrev on them often. But this experience this past week has left a very bad taste in my mouth. True PBT's are never given. OK, I can handle that...but there is no reason the agent can't tell us if the flight is on an oversold status. Especially if you call them just 2 hours prior to flight time and are still told there are "20 seats left to sell." Which is what happened to us.

My airline can at least let nonrevers know if the flight is over booked. We can give percentages...like 10% seats left of the flight. Or, "no sir, it's not overbooked." Or there are approx 10 nonrevs listed for the flight. Why such a big deal anyway? Don't give me the "competition" answer, cuz when you are calling day of travel...at that time it's too late to "compete" with oal. Just my 2cents worth.

 

[Flufdriver]

There just letting you feel the "LUV"!

 

[swflyer]

Truly sorry for your experience, but it's not Res' fault, either.

Marketing sets the lids on a flight, and on some it's HUGELY over the a/c capacity. Before the flamers get their lighters out, this is based on the same traffic numbers all carriers decide to use (except jetBlue) when setting levels for each flight.

Sometimes we get caught, like the episode of "Airline" where a FLL flight was oversold by 50 (I was a f/a on that flight). Mostly, the system works well for what it's designed to do, sell seats on the airline.

When a Res agent says, "I have 20 seats to sell" they aren't lying, but they also don't necessarily know if there's 117 seats sold, or more. No one is deliberately trying to make anyone else's life hell, regardless of your employer. They're only allowed to give you the info they did.

IMHO, I've been buying tickets on OAL for awhile, just 'cuz I could find a low enough fare, early enough, that I decided "dressing and stressing" wasn't worth it.

Again, I'm sorry you and your family had a rough time.

 

[scuba]

When I worked rez for HP I worked hard on clueing in the poor NRSA who was calling in to obtain load numbers. I would use phrases like, 'The flight has twenty seats until capacity is reached.' Notice I didn't say twenty seats left to sell. I would say, 'If I were sending my family for that flight, I would ensure they had a backup plan,' or 'there is no way since the flight is over capacity and almost booked to authorized oversell levels.' While I never broke the rules, I told the person what to expect.

Now that being said, after I left rez and went to UA at the counter, I was on the other side when I needed to know flight loads I would call over to the other airline and ask, they would tell. However, when I couldn't talk to the local agents at the airport, I called rez and watched the way I worded the questions, and 99.999% of the time I could get a WN agent to tell me the exact numbers. I knew how many seats the flight would hold, then ask leading questions and most would cave. I found their rez agents to be the most courteous, kind, cheerful, helpful agents to speak to on the phone. The rez agents for WN were true professionals. Then 99.999999% of the time by the time I got to the airport to check in at the gate, I got a numbered boarding pass. Maybe it was due to luck, but I think it was good planning on my behalf. I never traveled during spring break, Christmas holiday, or Thanksgiving.

If all WN Rez agents are as professional as the ones I spoke to, I understand why they are successful!

Bottom line however, I agree with swflyer, with fares the way they are, buy a ticket.

 

[swflyer]

Interesting that this article should come out while we're talking about this very thing.

New York Times
Airline Workers Are Left at Gate, Mourning a Perk
March 21, 2006 - By JEFF BAILEY
Through deep pay cuts, shrunken pensions and longer hours, airline employees who survived the endless rounds of layoffs knew they could still count on one thing: free flights. But that perk, a touch of jet-setting glamour in an increasingly dreary line of work, is now much harder to use because so many flights are full.

"This system is now just ripping at the seams," said Patricia Haddon, an American Airlines flight attendant for 29 years who often enjoyed flying in first class. "We all came to work here because we value the benefit. We are middle-class people but this allows us to have upper-class experiences."

Airline employees and many of their family members can fly standby, taking unsold seats. But after post-9/11 problems prompted airlines to reduce the size of their fleets, a strong economy has revived demand for business and leisure travel.

Planes now fly on average with only about 22 percent of seats unsold. While that still sounds like a lot, quite a few are on unpopular routes or at inconvenient times. Many popular routes in prime hours are packed.

Thus, nonrevenue flying, as the benefit is known, is increasingly competitive. "It's really not quite the benefit it used to be," Chris Bagley, a Web site developer for Delta Air Lines, said.

Adding a bit of insult to injury, airline employees more frequently end up in coach seats on domestic flights, a grim prospect for many of them. That is because first-class cabins are full of frequent fliers who have been upgraded from coach and business travelers actually paying recently reduced first-class fares.

And employees are not alone in the scramble: travelers using frequent-flier miles often find themselves struggling to find seats.

Employees recognize that the more crowded flights are good for business. "That's what pays my salary," said Liz Mitchell, an American Airlines flight attendant for 25 years.

But Ms. Mitchell, who lives in Dallas, had to use some of that salary to buy airline tickets for herself and her boyfriend to attend a Caribbean wedding in November and a graduation last spring in Memphis. "I haven't non-rev'ed in a long time," she said.

The popularity of employee flight benefits contributes to the logjam at the gate, with retirees, families and some friends also eligible. Airlines report as many as five people are eligible for free travel for each active employee. With about 400,000 currently working for domestic airlines, that suggests a population approaching two million scrambling for a dwindling number of seats.

Still, for indiscriminate travelers willing to go almost anywhere at a moment's notice, the free flights remain a great benefit. B. J. and Tony Morris, both computer programmers using employee travel benefits from Delta, say they have racked up 2.3 million miles of air travel since 1983 on more than 450 trips. At full price, they estimate that the flights would have cost them $1.7 million. Their actual cost in fees and taxes was about $14,000, or $31 a trip.

"It makes us more interesting people, if nothing else," Mr. Morris, 53, said. Childless and petless, they regularly head to Atlanta's airport with a half-dozen foreign cities in mind and hop aboard the first flight with available seats — preferably in first or business class.

Airlines have also issued millions of one-time buddy passes that workers can hand out to friends for free travel. And as carriers have sold or spun off non-airline operations, employees in those businesses often retain travel benefits. B. J. Morris, for example, left Delta in 1995 and now works for Worldspan, a technology company that serves airlines. She retains full Delta travel benefits.

As available seats have declined, workers have paid more attention to how the line forms to fill them. American and Southwest employees board on a first-come-first-served basis. Delta and United employees board by seniority. Each method produces resentment.

US Airways, seniority-based, merged last year with America West Airlines, which was first come first served. The combined company, known as US Airways, has gone through an internal debate on which approach to adopt. The e-mail address for workers' comments suggests the scraps they are fighting over: [email protected].

Emotions are running high, with more than 7,500 e-mail messages so far. "Picture me at my age (old) with 32 years of dedicated service," a seniority advocate wrote, "running down the concourse trying to beat that new hire with barely six months on the payroll. Well, I guess he won, beating me and my wife (who just had her left hip replaced)."

An advocate of the first-come-first-served approach responded: "Many times over the years I have been sitting in the boarding area 60-90 minutes before departure, only to be bumped by a 'senior' employee with his wife and four children, who showed up 15 minutes before departure."

W. Douglas Parker, chief executive of US Airways, is in no hurry to make a decision. He is asking employees to board former US Airways flights by seniority and former America West flights first come first served — to experience the difference — and is hoping that everyone calms down by the end of the year.

"We're taking it very seriously," he said. Flight benefits "loom large in our ability to attract and retain employees."

A sympathetic worker e-mailed this message to the boss: "Avoiding a tar & feather during the process will be miraculous."

Whatever their stance on that debate, most airline employees would certainly agree with Mr. Morris, the computer programmer, about the benefits of the travel perk. Faced with a 25 percent pay cut at Delta a few years ago, he said he and his wife "sat down over a pizza one night and decided what's important to us: flying free." He stayed at Delta until Aug. 1, 2004, "the first day I was eligible for retirement with unlimited pass benefits." He now works part time elsewhere.

Mrs. Morris, 47, keeps a record of their travel at www.bjandtony.com, which helps explain why many workers stay on at airlines despite their troubles. They flew in 1987 to St. Thomas in the Virgin Islands to shop for an engagement ring, finding the diamond solitaire she still wears. Mr. Morris once took an overnight trip to shop for gnome figurines in Ireland.

They often fly together, but not always. Mrs. Morris would rather try a new place than revisit a city. Mr. Morris says he thinks he wants to retire to Ireland, a frequent destination. "I'm not convinced," Mrs. Morris said.

One thing, Mr. Morris said, they completely agree: "Why would you work for an airline if you didn't fly?"

 

[WNjetdoc]

There just letting you feel the "LUV"!

Learn to spell numbnuts. Now get back over to the UseLessAir bb and take your buddies with you, lol.

BTW, the word you meant to use is, they're, not there.

There: At or in that place: sit over there.

They're: Contraction of they are.

Echoe, sorry to hear about your troubles. Non-rev can sometimes be a pain, I've been there before. I'm with the other posters on this thread, if you really need to get somewhere and its important then you may want to consider buying a ticket. I'm sure your next flight will be smooth, non-rev or paying.