Midatlantic Airways Negotiations

[repeet]

I'm curious...how are we going to lose 2500 mechanics when the heavy maintenance on the Buses hasn't even started yet? If we furloughed 2500 more, how could we keep up with what we are doing now?
Are you refering to a possible recall of mechanics to accomplish the AB heavy maintenance?

I just want to fully understand the issues.

Thanks

A320 Driver
The mechanics will be lost when all non airbus a/c are gone.
Per alpa iam agreement 279 a/c.

SmartestLoser
The question needs to be "What is the IAM doing to protect the mainline agreement..?? Being 'PROACTIVE". That agreement is the IAM's bread & butter

A320 Driver

Letting the AirBus work go is agreeing that our Class and Craft is no longer required for any future aircraft type. That when the current older aircraft are retired from the fleet, we and our jobs will leave to.

The answer is NO!!! The maintenance of all heavy aircraft types belong to the US Airways employees represented by the I.A.M. or its successor.


SmartestLoser,

I agree. They can start with the back shops componants, that they have had a blind eye towards for the last fifteen years!

 

[Dark Wrench]

The union has all ready prepared the legal response and formulated the plans, it was dicussed at the steward's meeting in CLT yesterday, we are ready to react, there is nothing we can do except solidify the membership and take the appropiate action when necessary.

ALPA, TWU, DL 141 IAM-Ramp, are onboard the AFA Is getting ready to join in, but once again, the company has not done anything, just talk about it, we can't do anything until they sign a contract or vendor out the first plane.

What have you done?

Lav
I agree dave must be stopped. (i would eventually like to come back to work)
Having other unions saying that they are behind us shouldn't give anyone any comfort. The AFA were forced to cross our line before. All it takes is a court order so its a moot point. Dave probably has those papers written already.
If it gets down to that.
All i know is at our last vote to exit bk alot of people said " I know if you vote yes you will vote yourself out of a job, but at least you will get severance". Seems pretty much like a defeated statement. ( I still voted no ) I lost my job
They still have thiers for the time being. I hope longer.

 

[Smartest Loser]

"What have you done?"...!!

Lav,

Your question is....'What have I done"..??

Answer: Absolutely NOTHING....!!! Thats what I pay UNION DUES FOR...!!!

I pay the IAM to look out after my best interest. I pay the IAM to file court papers. I pay the IAM for representation. I pay the IAM to keep me informed. I pay the IAM to fight to keep my work. And on and on and on....

I'm tired of lip service when I'm paying for ACTION...!!!! Time to grow a set.

BTW...Lets look at the big picture. Fact: U has 2 Billion in cash on hand. Fact: U has not made any major reinvestment in the company. Fact: Daves statement about taking/making a major charge off in 2004. Fact: 95% of all RJ's were financed by the maker. Fact: Airbus work requires a major investment...!!

Question: Why will U not make a major investment in the future of this company?

 

[LavMan]

Smartest loser, you are the union, look in the mirror, looks like you need to grow a set and become invovled, if the membership is weak, which I feel it is, Dave and his gang will mow us over.

And here is some history, back in 1992, the AFA honored our picket line, the company sought and got an injuction to order them back to work, but the judge also repremanded it back to arbitration.

The arbitor ruled (PITbull correct me if I am wrong), that the AFA had the right to honor a legal picket line.

Since then all union contracts on US Airways permits other union employees at US Airways the right not to cross a picket line and the company can take no legal or disciplinary action against those employees.

 

[AP Tech]

A320 Driver,

The 2500 mechanics is an estimate on my part of the number of mechanics that will be lost if the Airbus work is contracted out. If Dave wins and get to farmout the Airbus work, first to go will be the S and in my opinion the C's will follow. Then you will see a rapid accceleration of 737 retirements replacing them with Airbus's to keep within the 279 ac as required in the ALPA contract. Unless of course he finds a way to get away replace mainline with large RJ's. When all the Boing are gone all that will be left are the Airbus's thus eliminateing all heavy maintenance and a majority of support shops. We become something like Jet Blue and Southwest with all maintence except line contracted out.

This is my opinion of course!!!!

 

[AP Tech]

Lavman,

I don't quite believe this "you are the union stuff". We the union, voted no and were told we did not understand and had to vote again by "THE UNION"?. 'We" spoke and were overuled!!!! So I really don't wish to hear all this broken record stuff. I have listened for months with the union defending their actions and to be quite honest I think they are lying!!!! The company paid them a few $$$$ to change the vote!!!

 

[PITbull]

LavMan states: The arbitor ruled (PITbull correct me if I am wrong), that the AFA had the right to honor a legal picket line.

Since then all union contracts on US Airways permits other union employees at US Airways the right not to cross a picket line and the company can take no legal or disciplinary action against those employees.

PITbull responds: You are correct LavMan. AFA had the legal right to honor the picket lines. By then the strike was over.

However, I do believe that the union that still has the "no strike clause" is ALPA. I could be wrong on that. You guys need to find that out. Probably IAM already know for sure.

The State Reps and local politicians and the local communities of Pittsburgh feel so sorry for us, that I believe they will support the IAM as well. Roddey has stated publically last week on the news he feels very sorry for what the employees at U are suffering.

There is much empathy out there. You would be surprised. This, I surely know to be true.

Regardless what management overt statements are on this...deep down they know that this "farm out" work is egregious, and I believe Bronner thinks so too. As you notice, for once, he won't comment when asked.

 

[PITbull]

AP Tech,

Don't want to tell you how to feel about your union. You only know from being on that end and through that door.

However, I remember last August when the revote occured. I was in those summer negotiations as well. One of your union leaders had told me that your leaders were taken behind closed doors and were told by mangement that "we are in BK now" and if you don't bring that vote out again to your members, we will take the "scope" clause away and no severance as well. They would abrogate the entire agreement. If you can recall, your leaders brought the vote out again for you to choose again, AND specifically stated in the letter, NO MATTER HOW THIS VOTE TURNS OUT, WE WILL DEFEND OUR CONTRACT EVEN IN BANKRUPTCY with a judge.

Please pull these letter out and reread them. Rehash the summer. Your disqust is misapplied. Your union tries to defend, management TAKES.

For those who state "that is why I pay union dues". The reality is that unions are set up to be a very true democratic orgnaization. You have more power than you think and their is so MUCH strength in numbers NOT with 18 leaders of IAM.

The union dues that are collected are collected from every member on the property including the leadership. No one is exempt.

THE DUES ARE ONLY FOR A PULLING OF ALL THE RESOURCES IN ORDER TO PROVIDE YOU ALL SERVICES, including but not limited to, attorneys, benefit specialists, pension acturies, grievances, court letigations, and those representatives in your districts that represent your collective voices. They don't work FOR you, they work for USAirways just as you do. The leadership's SOLE purpose is to REPRESENT THE WISHES AND NEEDS OF THE MAJORITY.

YOU MUST SPEAK AND GET INVOLVED IN THIS ISSUE! This is THE issue for you and the lives of your families. This is the fight of the century for this IAM.

Set the example for the industry! We here at U started this, we need to take care of it for the industry. The Domino Effect IS HERE AND CONTINUES, and the "pandora box" remains opened.

IMO, the Government "bail outs" for this industry including the ATSB loan started this mess. They need to "reap what they have sown". Its all about Corporate welfare and every airline has their hand out. U is still not finished with bailouts. They are after the state of PA as you all can attest.

 

[jetmechline]

MDA and Mainline are two seperate contracts and nothing is being done to change the mainline agreement, in fact MDA is going to arbitration to be settled, nothing to do with Mainline, so keep grasping at straws till you can actually come up with something factual and truthful.

Robert Roach was in CLT yesterday and he informed us we are prepared to defend our airbus work with all legal means under the RLA.

SO try again.

Machinist, US AIRWAYS DISCUSS MECHANIC’S REJECTION
OF RESTRUCTURING PROPOSAL.

Washington D.C. August 30,2002- At the request of US Airways CEO David Siegel, IAM General Vice President Robert Roach, Jr. and Airline Coordinator Jim Varsel met briefly with Siegel and the carrier’s Vice President of Labor Relations Doug Mckeen yesterday at the company’s headquarters in Arlington, VA ………………

[Roach] “We informed US Airways that the Machinist Union is well aware of our obligation to discuss these issues under Section 1113 of the U.S. Bankruptcy law, “ said Roach. “ ____________________________________________________________________

Less than 48 hours after making this statement, Roach, ordered a revote to be held on Sept. 17. This guy is in Siegel’s pocket. :angry:

 

[LavMan]

Post the whole truth!

September 6, 2002 - IAM representatives and advisors met at the request of US Airways today at the carrier’s headquarters in Arlington, VA. US Airways acknowledges that perhaps some confusion developed while the company was meeting with employees prior to the August 28, 2002 restructuring proposal vote over what the consequences would be if their proposal was not ratified by the Mechanical and Related membership.

In a letter that US Airways is mailing to each member’s home, CEO David Siegel asks the Mechanical and Related employees to reconsider the Company’s proposal.

In today’s meeting, the IAM was informed of the following:

1. If the members reject the company’s proposal, US Airways will not ask the bankruptcy court judge to just partially modify your agreement, but will have to ask the bankruptcy court to reject, terminate, abrogate the agreement in full.

2. Once the collective bargaining agreement has been rejected/terminated, US Airways will impose terms for wages, benefits, and work rules as it deems necessary, and will be able to change those terms as it deems necessary.

The IAM is prepared to defend your agreement. However, you must understand that the judge only has the authority to rule on the motion before him, and that motion will not be for modification, but for rejection of the total agreement. The bankruptcy court cannot craft a “compromise deal.â€￾

Based on these facts, District 141-M will hold a second vote on September 17, 2002. The bankruptcy court hearing to reject the Mechanical and Related agreement will be postponed until after the membership has had an opportunity to vote.

The IAM is only asking you to vote based on accurate facts, and not misleading statements and rumor. There should be no confusion going forward. The decision is yours, and the IAM will continue to vigorously represent you, whatever your choice may be.

Sincerely and fraternally,

Scotty Ford
President
IAM District 141-M

 

[E-TRONS]

Hey LAVMAN, So the IAM meeting with the company over MDA is cool in your eyes?? :blink:

It's like this.....I told you outright that I was going to kill your lawn because it costs too much to water it......Then we have dinner together later that evening. No objections....right??

If you can dispute the scenario at hand then you are blind to all reason. The company (US/MDA)has announced it's intentions of breaching the contract which the IAM feels is a MAJOR DISPUTE. I agree. It is a major dispute.
So why the heck are they still acting like nothing is wrong and continue to meet over MDA??******TO SECURE DUES MONEY******* and if you think this is not accurate then you are both a SUCKER and a FOOL!! :down:

It's actions such as this that has turned the membership off.......get it now???

E-TRONS OUT.

 

[Smartest Loser]

"What have you done?"...!!

Question: Why will U not make a major investment in the future of this company?

Possible answer is that US is looking to conserve as much cash as they can. I think they might be feeling that the climate for travel may not improve enough for them to make a profit for 2 years instead of one year that was originally predicted. That would be my number 1 answer.

Could they be sprucing it up for a sale? To whom? Who has the cash? or Credit? Why not wait until the company tanks and pick it up at a fire sale price? Heck Bronner did that already.

Could they be conserving cash in case opportunities arise? RSA has stated that they would invest in the right opportunities.

Not investing in the hardware to do Airbus heavy maintenance in-house strengthens both their cash position and their negotiating position.

PB,

I understand but ...at what point to do start is my question...??

Somewhere, Somehow, Someday they need to start. Its like buying a car, at what point are you willing to say....That old car needs to be replaced and you go out and buy a new one. When the transmission falls out, waterpump fails, the tires wear out...??

Seems this Mgt. team is gonna wait and use some of their money to call the tow truck...!!! :blink: :blink:

 

[diogenes]

AP Tech,

Don't want to tell you how to feel about your union. You only know from being on that end and through that door.

However, I remember last August when the revote occured. I was in those summer negotiations as well. One of your union leaders had told me that your leaders were taken behind closed doors and were told by mangement that "we are in BK now" and if you don't bring that vote out again to your members, we will take the "scope" clause away and no severance as well. They would abrogate the entire agreement. If you can recall, your leaders brought the vote out again for you to choose again, AND specifically stated in the letter, NO MATTER HOW THIS VOTE TURNS OUT, WE WILL DEFEND OUR CONTRACT EVEN IN BANKRUPTCY with a judge.

Please pull these letter out and reread them. Rehash the summer. Your disqust is misapplied. Your union tries to defend, management TAKES.

For those who state "that is why I pay union dues". The reality is that unions are set up to be a very true democratic orgnaization. You have more power than you think and their is so MUCH strength in numbers NOT with 18 leaders of IAM.

The union dues that are collected are collected from every member on the property including the leadership. No one is exempt.

THE DUES ARE ONLY FOR A PULLING OF ALL THE RESOURCES IN ORDER TO PROVIDE YOU ALL SERVICES, including but not limited to, attorneys, benefit specialists, pension acturies, grievances, court letigations, and those representatives in your districts that represent your collective voices. They don't work FOR you, they work for USAirways just as you do. The leadership's SOLE purpose is to REPRESENT THE WISHES AND NEEDS OF THE MAJORITY.

YOU MUST SPEAK AND GET INVOLVED IN THIS ISSUE! This is THE issue for you and the lives of your families. This is the fight of the century for this IAM.

Set the example for the industry! We here at U started this, we need to take care of it for the industry. The Domino Effect IS HERE AND CONTINUES, and the "pandora box" remains opened.

IMO, the Government "bail outs" for this industry including the ATSB loan started this mess. They need to "reap what they have sown". Its all about Corporate welfare and every airline has their hand out. U is still not finished with bailouts. They are after the state of PA as you all can attest.

I think the IAM should request AFA for PITBull on TDY. She could teach a lesson to the powers that be, and the rank and file.

Girl, you done told it like it is!