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[jimntx]

Jim,
You amaze me. It seems to me that you are bitter at where you are at in life. This flight attendant who has 36 years has put in her time. As she flys so very little she doesn't collect benefits. And stop saying they sell their trips as they pay to get rid of them (usually).
I understand you would like the opportunity to hold better trips, I have been flying for 16 years and I would like to be off reserve, but do I begrudge those who are ahead of me? No. I would like some to retire, but it is well within their rights to drop as many trips as they want. I suggest if you don't like the system, leave. Or maybe you should have started when you were young and no so crochety!

First off, don't make judgements when you don't have a clue what you are talking about. The 36 year f/a incident happened over 4 years ago. She was drawing full benefits from AA, but not flying. This was pre-RPA.

I am so very tired of f/as who think that working at a job for 36 years (or even less) somehow or another entitles them to keep the job, but not actually show up to work except when they want to. That is not the way the world works. Be grateful you are a f/a. With your apparent attitude, you wouldn't last very long in the real world. First off, you wouldn't be still working at the same job 16 years after you started, doing exactly the same duties you performed when you started, working the same amount (or less) than when you started, but getting paid 2 to 3 times as much.

There ain't no such job except for flight attendant. What we do is basically an entry level job--requires a minimum of education and training. Name another job in any industry where you perform an entry level job for 30-40 years, but still get raises (I'm not talking about statutory increases in the minimum wage) and increased benefits (such as vacation).

I love the job. I have no illusions about holding better trips. At AA, you need at least 20 years to have any assurance of holding what you want. I won't be here that long. What I have a real problem with are the "entitled" f/as. They are a financial drag on the company.

By the way, I know for a FACT that there are senior f/as at certain bases who sell their trips to a trip trade service. One bragged to me that she did it on months she didn't want to fly.
Her comment was "Why shouldn't I make some money on these trips, too? I can bid just about anything I want; so, it's not like the trip trade service has to work to get rid of the trips."

 

[jersey777]

I'm glad you're not a union rep. Every time you write something you have something negative towards flight attendants. Why do you dislike your co-workers so much?



quote name='jimntx' date='Jul 1 2007, 06:56 PM' post='500377']
First off, don't make judgements when you don't have a clue what you are talking about. The 36 year f/a incident happened over 4 years ago. She was drawing full benefits from AA, but not flying. This was pre-RPA.

I am so very tired of f/as who think that working at a job for 36 years (or even less) somehow or another entitles them to keep the job, but not actually show up to work except when they want to. That is not the way the world works. Be grateful you are a f/a. With your apparent attitude, you wouldn't last very long in the real world. First off, you wouldn't be still working at the same job 16 years after you started, doing exactly the same duties you performed when you started, working the same amount (or less) than when you started, but getting paid 2 to 3 times as much.

There ain't no such job except for flight attendant. What we do is basically an entry level job--requires a minimum of education and training. Name another job in any industry where you perform an entry level job for 30-40 years, but still get raises (I'm not talking about statutory increases in the minimum wage) and increased benefits (such as vacation).

I love the job. I have no illusions about holding better trips. At AA, you need at least 20 years to have any assurance of holding what you want. I won't be here that long. What I have a real problem with are the "entitled" f/as. They are a financial drag on the company.

By the way, I know for a FACT that there are senior f/as at certain bases who sell their trips to a trip trade service. One bragged to me that she did it on months she didn't want to fly.
Her comment was "Why shouldn't I make some money on these trips, too? I can bid just about anything I want; so, it's not like the trip trade service has to work to get rid of the trips."
[/quote]

 

[nbmcg01]

First off, don't make judgement when you don't have a clue what you are talking about. The 36 year f/a incident happened over 4 years ago. She was drawing full benefits from AA, but not flying. This was pre-RPA.

I am so very tired of f/as who think that working at a job for 36 years (or even less) somehow or another entitles them to keep the job, but not actually show up to work except when they want to. That is not the way the world works. Be grateful you are a f/a. With your apparent attitude, you wouldn't last very long in the real world. First off, you wouldn't be still working at the same job 16 years after you started, doing exactly the same duties you performed when you started, working the same amount (or less) than when you started, but getting paid 2 to 3 times as much.

There ain't no such job except for flight attendant. What we do is basically an entry level job--requires a minimum of education and training. Name another job in any industry where you perform an entry level job for 30-40 years, but still get raises (I'm not talking about statutory increases in the minimum wage) and increased benefits (such as vacation).

I love the job. I have no illusions about holding better trips. At AA, you need at least 20 years to have any assurance of holding what you want. I won't be here that long. What I have a real problem with are the "entitled" f/as. They are a financial drag on the company.

By the way, I know for a FACT that there are senior f/as at certain bases who sell their trips to a trip trade service. One bragged to me that she did it on months she didn't want to fly.
Her comment was "Why shouldn't I make some money on these trips, too? I can bid just about anything I want; so, it's not like the trip trade service has to work to get rid of the trips."
[/quote}






It all comes down to negotiations. The very examples you give are all negotiated items. Why shouldn't someone expect longevity raises. Remember the pay tops out and then you can be on a plane until you die and you'll still be making the same base salary.

Garfield, you seem to forget that flying poses unique problems when it comes to being ill. I always had perfect attendance when I was at the training center. Sinus infection, I came to work. Pneumonia, I came to work. Broken ankle, I came to work. Had I been flying, I would not have been able to come to work. I used to lose my voice every Sept. around Labor day. Training Center, I came to work. On the line, I was pulled off my flight by mangt. If someone had looked at my "history" they could have perceived a pattern. You use Christmas as an example. I'm sure there are some that feel they have a special "right" to be home but please remember that many are scheduled to fly Christmas year after year, and if they get sick, it appears that they are constant offenders. The Co has the right to request Drs. notes over holidays so I would say it is incumbent upon mangt. to investigate any suspected abuse. Whether it was requested/required I would certainly have a Drs note to be on the safe side. In all my years of union representation, I never lost a f/a to abuse of sick leave. Am I that good? Not hardly, it just wasn't a valid issue. Perception can play funny tricks on those sitting in judgement.

 

[Skymess]

The company would do better to define what constitutes a full-time job in each job category--one of the legal problems in the past has been that the courts have a hard time understanding that someone (a f/a) who is "guaranteed" 70 hours a month is a full-time employee. Then withdraw any non-contractual benefits--such as, non-rev travel benefits to anyone not flying full-time, or at least 35 hours/month. There would be some f/as who would either retire or start flying again. You would eliminate the f/as like the one I flew with a DFW once. She had 36 years at the time, and informed me that she never flew unless she wanted to get away from her husband for a few days or Nordstrom's in Seattle was having a sale.

I feel your frustration with the senior people whose trips get locked up with the trip trade services forcing people to buy them. I don't think they should be forced out, whether falling into the part time or full time parameter. I don't think the company feels it is in their best interest to force them out either because they are getting all of us to work a lot of overtime that other airlines don't allow. This saves them a lot of money in the long run because they don't have to hire and vest new employees.

IF it comes down to getting more money back into the hands of the employees who don't have the luxury of being part time, I do think the options on the table should be to force people to fly higher time to get medical. I will keep stating that I do not want to fund other people's part time lifestyle with my full time work and by giving any of my money toward that. If you are a part time employee you should understand that it might mean you don't get the same benefits and compensation as a full time one. I don't think it should effect their non rev travel or seniority, just their medical and retirement compensation.

It's not necessarily a senior or junior thing with me. I understand I am junior. I am just hoping the best possible scenario is looked at for all full time employees trying to make a living across the board. I think junior people at each base, whether that means you are 7 years or 20, need to understand that reserve means you are not going to have the same benefits as a line holding flight attendant. If you are on reserve you should be qualified on all the planes your base flies. That might actually lower the count needed because scheduling wouldn't have to weed through who is qualified on what if we all had the same quals.

 

[Skymess]

"I am not sure why we dont hire more back."

"Base managers are asking for more staffing. Hopefully more recalls are in the near future. The training center is geared up and in full swing. Seems silly not to continue."

Again, I ask, why is APFA not clammering at this opportunity to get the 2000+ furloughed flight attendants back to work?

POOR REPRESENTATION!

:down:

Did you guys NOT get the new Skyword Express? It was filled with Resolution number 8 which was unanimously passed by the board about doing anything necessary to bring back furloughs. The whole thing was about how they were all empowered to fight for the furloughs to come back to work. Kind of scared the Bejeezus out of me because the last time they decided to do anything necessary to help a cause I lost a third of my salary.

 

[boxer]

About FA's going to work sick. From an outsider looking in, you all miss a most important reason not working sick.

I don't want to be cooped up in a tube with recirculated air and have a FA hack, sneeze and sniffle while serving me a meal. Oh, I forgot.

Spreading virus' and bacterial infections are not good for the flying public.

 

[nbmcg01]

About FA's going to work sick. From an outsider looking in, you all miss a most important reason not working sick.

I don't want to be cooped up in a tube with recirculated air and have a FA hack, sneeze and sniffle while serving me a meal. Oh, I forgot.

Spreading virus' and bacterial infections are not good for the flying public.

Now if only our customers would remember not to fly sick...TB, measles, mumps, and chicken pox are not nice to "bring with you". And please, dispose of those used tissues yourself, instead of handing them to the f/a.

Chris, the furloughed have "bought" their recall to the tune of over $600,000,000 in shared sacrifice. I don't think the Co. or the Union is about to put a price tag on any recall. Besides, training is a "cost" of doing business and is tax deductible. And knowing how savvy AA's bean counters are, I'm certain there are Federal "incentives" for returning employees in the age brackets we're seeing now.

 

[jimntx]

Did you guys NOT get the new Skyword Express? It was filled with Resolution number 8 which was unanimously passed by the board about doing anything necessary to bring back furloughs. The whole thing was about how they were all empowered to fight for the furloughs to come back to work. Kind of scared the Bejeezus out of me because the last time they decided to do anything necessary to help a cause I lost a third of my salary.

I feel your fear!

As far as their Resolution, it seems to come 3 days late, and $20 short considering that they have done next to nothing for the last 4 years to encourage the company to recall furloughees. Now that we are less than a year from 2000+ f/as losing their recall rights, the Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed (Mother House on Useless Blvd) is all concerned about the furloughees.

So, they pass a Resolution! (They must be exhausted.
Perhaps they should all go lie down in a dark room with cold towels on their foreheads.)

 

[nbmcg01]

I feel your fear!

As far as their Resolution, it seems to come 3 days late, and $20 short considering that they have done next to nothing for the last 4 years to encourage the company to recall furloughees. Now that we are less than a year from 2000+ f/as losing their recall rights, the Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed (Mother House on Useless Blvd) is all concerned about the furloughees.

So, they pass a Resolution! (They must be exhausted.
Perhaps they should all go lie down in a dark room with cold towels on their foreheads.)

Jim, you ARE the best!

 

[Skymess]

I feel your fear!

Now that we are less than a year from 2000+ f/as losing their recall rights, the Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed (Mother House on Useless Blvd) is all concerned about the furloughees.

So, they pass a Resolution! (They must be exhausted.
Perhaps they should all go lie down in a dark room with cold towels on their foreheads.)

lol. right on.

 

[Bear96]

I feel your fear!

As far as their Resolution, it seems to come 3 days late, and $20 short considering that they have done next to nothing for the last 4 years to encourage the company to recall furloughees. Now that we are less than a year from 2000+ f/as losing their recall rights, the Blessed Order of the Perpetually Trip-Removed (Mother House on Useless Blvd) is all concerned about the furloughees.

So, they pass a Resolution! (They must be exhausted.
Perhaps they should all go lie down in a dark room with cold towels on their foreheads.)

Good thing you're not bitter or anything (as you claim not to be).

 

[nbmcg01]

Good thing you're not bitter or anything (as you claim not to be).

Oh for heavens sake..Humor, satire, the truth..lol

 

[USCREW]

First off, you wouldn't be still working at the same job 16 years after you started, doing exactly the same duties you performed when you started, working the same amount (or less) than when you started, but getting paid 2 to 3 times as much.

There ain't no such job except for flight attendant. What we do is basically an entry level job--requires a minimum of education and training. Name another job in any industry where you perform an entry level job for 30-40 years, but still get raises (I'm not talking about statutory increases in the minimum wage) and increased benefits (such as vacation).

Postal worker
delivery person--FedEx/UPS
Techs in healthcare

 

[Garfield1966]

Postal worker
delivery person--FedEx/UPS
Techs in healthcare

So you are equating FA=s with delevery people and health techs? Damn this is going to be good. I'm going to have to book mark this one.

nbmcg01

Why is it that the health problems always occur the same time each year and not in Jan/Feb/March or the for the rest of the year on the same dates each year? People fly in Feb don't they? Do people just not get sick in Feb? How about March? Sep?

I guess if the laws/rules are written poorly anything can be made to look like something it is not. OJ proved that.

 

[nbmcg01]

So you are equating FA=s with delevery people and health techs? Damn this is going to be good. I'm going to have to book mark this one.

nbmcg01

Why is it that the health problems always occur the same time each year and not in Jan/Feb/March or the for the rest of the year on the same dates each year? People fly in Feb don't they? Do people just not get sick in Feb? How about March? Sep?

I guess if the laws/rules are written poorly anything can be made to look like something it is not. OJ proved that.

I just gave you the example of Sept...every year. I'm certain if you ran the proper stats you could find some of the same off every year during different months. Garfield, it is what it is...If mangt. thinks it is abuse, then they should act on it...Like I said, 30 plus years as a iunion rep and I never lost an attendance grievance.