ME3 vs US3

KEG.

for someone that types as much as you do, you should be able to recognize the proximity of the G and Y keys and if you read the topic it would make plenty of sense.
 
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  • #20
Back to topic - it's great seeing others want AA to speak for the industry over DL
 
LD3 said:
Here we go, spinning it into a labor thread.... Just take your ball and go....
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As they say, some people lack the 'mental horsepower' to properly 'grasp' and discuss the issues, especially those that may adversely affect a certain ATL-based airline.  Deny, deflect, and lie is all they can muster.
 
 
WorldTraveler said:
It would be nice if AA spoke up IN ADDITION to DL and IN ADDITION to UA about issues that affect the industry instead of stumbling over the name of the city where AA is headquartered.
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Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps the reason why AA management isn't whining in public is that they are not the USA based carrier that stands to lose the most? Afterall, one of the ME3 - QR - is an alliance partner and another ME3 carrier - EY - is part-owner of alliance member AB.  (I'm actually willing to bet that if the situation were reversed, that DL had business relationships with the ME3, a certain DL fankid / cheerleader would be lecturing us on the strategic brilliance emanating from DL headquarters - but I digress).
 
It seems to me that DL must be really scared of the competition from the ME3  - but this is for good reason. 
 
And the competition from the ME3 is not the only strategic challenge facing DL these early days of 2015 - more on that later - but let's get back to the ME3.
 
Sooner or later, one of the ME3 will start service to ATL and possibly to DTW.  They're already present in JFK.  Combine that with the fact that one of the ME3 owns AZ, and the hurt that AF/KL is experiencing in Europe, and mighty DL could be in for some difficulties.  As has been preached to us on here numerous occasions, any #3 carrier in any market is doomed, destined to be a niche player.  Well in Europe, AF/KL is now #3 among its peers (LH and IAG) and worse still, they haven't figured out their niche yet.
 
Luckily, I don't see any of the ME3 itching to serve SLC, so it's only a matter of time before a certain DL fankid / cheerleader will be on here proclaiming how great of a job DL has done at defending it's hubs against the ME3.  (This will be analogous to what the DL fankid / cheerleader is spewing about DL fiercely protecting its hubs from LCCs, while FL and B6 flourished right under their noses).  Also, I don't see the ME3 starting service to CVG or MEM - but DL doesn't see the point in maintaining too much of a presence there either - but I digress.
 
So you see, it is only natural for the DL CEO to be scared and clutching his pearls - sort of similar to the way World Fraudster is doing on here spewing his venom.  I guess Anderson has finally caught up with World Fraudster.
 
WorldTraveler said:
yes, Parker got drunk again.
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What was the name of the poster that went on and on and on about 'character assassinations'?
There wouldn't be any double standards here, would there?
 
WorldTraveler said:
btw, what is happening with that HND slot? if AA's win was such a slam dunk, why hasn't the slot been reallocated?
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In a way I'm glad that you brought up SEA.
That is yet another strategic challenge that DL faces in addition to the ME3.
Seeing that it has no possibility to be anything but a #3 carrier at LAX (remember, the #3 carrier is destined to failure or niche role at best), DL had no choice but to take a hike up the coast to the #3 west-coast gateway to Asia. In doing so it peeved of AS - but that's par for the course, just ask KE. I wonder how much $ the SEA hub is bleeding if even flights to HND cannot work on a B767!!!
 
WorldTraveler said:
also ran in the transcons? I don't think so if you are talking about DL who is the number one carrier in the JFK transcon market.
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Yes. DL is an also-ran in the transcon market especially when you compare average fares.
Wasn't it you World Fraudster that used to write diatribes about how the most important thing that matters is average fares? Now that it doesn't fit your narrative you're being a weasel and going by # of seats? Talk about narratives and double standards!
 
Futhermore, DL is not only an also-ran in the transcon market it is also #3 in the USA-Mexico market (behind UA and AA), so it was forced to hook up with AM so that it isn't a complete failure. 
 
Speaking of strategic problems and the southwest USA, another challenge DL faces is losing in N. TX.  There's been too much written about this by a certain DL cheerleader / fankid, but the overall message, if you manage to read the 100's of posts and 10000s of words is 'fear, fear, fear'.
 
And just so that somebody doesn't have to be taken away into a white padded room, I won't expand on:  the problems DL faces in DTW (look at the massive RJ presence even on concourse A - tied specifically to the wonderful economy of the region), the assault by LCCs on ATL, DL's #3 rank in South America (although I think they found their niche - as the only USA based airline that files to ATL - we'll see how long that lasts if/when WN starts service to the region from ATL), fuel hedge losses, refinery operating losses, possible labor strife (unions) and resulting increase in labor costs, the dying NRT hub, etc. etc. etc.
 
Actually, compared to some of the other strategic challenges mentioned, the ME3 might be one of the least of DL's problems.
 
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  • #23
Oh so creating an international incident is the same as fumbling a name - you will go to any length in disparaging AA
 
As they say, some people lack the 'mental horsepower' to properly 'grasp' and discuss the issues, especially those that may adversely affect a certain ATL-based airline.  Deny, deflect, and lie is all they can muster.
 
 
 
Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps the reason why AA management isn't whining in public is that they are not the USA based carrier that stands to lose the most? Afterall, one of the ME3 - QR - is an alliance partner and another ME3 carrier - EY - is part-owner of alliance member AB.  (I'm actually willing to bet that if the situation were reversed, that DL had business relationships with the ME3, a certain DL fankid / cheerleader would be lecturing us on the strategic brilliance emanating from DL headquarters - but I digress).
 
It seems to me that DL must be really scared of the competition from the ME3  - but this is for good reason. 
 
And the competition from the ME3 is not the only strategic challenge facing DL these early days of 2015 - more on that later - but let's get back to the ME3.
 
Sooner or later, one of the ME3 will start service to ATL and possibly to DTW.  They're already present in JFK.  Combine that with the fact that one of the ME3 owns AZ, and the hurt that AF/KL is experiencing in Europe, and mighty DL could be in for some difficulties.  As has been preached to us on here numerous occasions, any #3 carrier in any market is doomed, destined to be a niche player.  Well in Europe, AF/KL is now #3 among its peers (LH and IAG) and worse still, they haven't figured out their niche yet.
 
Luckily, I don't see any of the ME3 itching to serve SLC, so it's only a matter of time before a certain DL fankid / cheerleader will be on here proclaiming how great of a job DL has done at defending it's hubs against the ME3.  (This will be analogous to what the DL fankid / cheerleader is spewing about DL fiercely protecting its hubs from LCCs, while FL and B6 flourished right under their noses).  Also, I don't see the ME3 starting service to CVG or MEM - but DL doesn't see the point in maintaining too much of a presence there either - but I digress.
 
So you see, it is only natural for the DL CEO to be scared and clutching his pearls - sort of similar to the way World Fraudster is doing on here spewing his venom.  I guess Anderson has finally caught up with World Fraudster.
 

What was the name of the poster that went on and on and on about 'character assassinations'?
There wouldn't be any double standards here, would there?
 

In a way I'm glad that you brought up SEA.
That is yet another strategic challenge that DL faces in addition to the ME3.
Seeing that it has no possibility to be anything but a #3 carrier at LAX (remember, the #3 carrier is destined to failure or niche role at best), DL had no choice but to take a hike up the coast to the #3 west-coast gateway to Asia. In doing so it peeved of AS - but that's par for the course, just ask KE. I wonder how much $ the SEA hub is bleeding if even flights to HND cannot work on a B767!!!
 

Yes. DL is an also-ran in the transcon market especially when you compare average fares.
Wasn't it you World Fraudster that used to write diatribes about how the most important thing that matters is average fares? Now that it doesn't fit your narrative you're being a weasel and going by # of seats? Talk about narratives and double standards!
 
Futhermore, DL is not only an also-ran in the transcon market it is also #3 in the USA-Mexico market (behind UA and AA), so it was forced to hook up with AM so that it isn't a complete failure. 
 
Speaking of strategic problems and the southwest USA, another challenge DL faces is losing in N. TX.  There's been too much written about this by a certain DL cheerleader / fankid, but the overall message, if you manage to read the 100's of posts and 10000s of words is 'fear, fear, fear'.
 
And just so that somebody doesn't have to be taken away into a white padded room, I won't expand on:  the problems DL faces in DTW (look at the massive RJ presence even on concourse A - tied specifically to the wonderful economy of the region), the assault by LCCs on ATL, DL's #3 rank in South America (although I think they found their niche - as the only USA based airline that files to ATL - we'll see how long that lasts if/when WN starts service to the region from ATL), fuel hedge losses, refinery operating losses, possible labor strife (unions) and resulting increase in labor costs, the dying NRT hub, etc. etc. etc.
 
Actually, compared to some of the other strategic challenges mentioned, the ME3 might be one of the least of DL's problems.
Click to expand...
instead of realizing you are vastly outclassed in your knowledge of the industry, you keep trying to throw manufactured dirt.

First of all, let's deal with the transcons; if you think that forcing up average fares by reducing the number of seats in the market and dramatically decreasing revenue is a good idea, then you should be showing us the economics that support your contention.

I have repeatedly posted - which you can't debate - that AA added back via increased frequencies most of the costs it cut by getting rid of the 762s. Then they lost nearly all of the cargo revenue... then they also have lost share in the local market. When you can show us that revenue decreased less than the decrease in costs which probably didn't go down much if any at all, then you can tell us how AA has improved in the transcon markets and not actually strategically shot itself in the foot again.

your laundry list of manufactured dirt belies reality - again. to start, WN isn't going to fly Latin America to ATL; DTW has a higher share of revenue and substantially higher average fares as well as total revenue than AA has at ORD and DL is REMOVING 50 seaters and overall RJ flying from DTW; and DL has added more than enough non-Tokyo seats to Asia to offset the cut in CONNECTING capacity - and some of that capacity is being added in LAX-PVG where AA will take back seat to DL in yet another market - and the first to China.

If you want to track performance of that route and prove me wrong, go right ahead but I don't think there is any doubt that AA will be marginalized in yet another route to Asia at DL's hands.


as for the ME3, you only show your ignorance by thinking this is a DL only issue or that DL is worse affected. In case you missed it, AA flies MXP-JFK, is the weakest carrier in Italy and has no JV or alliance partners, as evidenced by AA's reduction in frequencies during the winter to levels that are not sustainable.

Tell us when AA ends up pulling MXP=JFK that this is a DL only problem.

and while you are add it, tell us why Parker said they would love to return to India but can't because the economics are not there.

Unlike you, Parker does realize the stakes that are involved with the ME3. It just happens that DL is the one in Europe talking to EU leaders while AA and UA's leaders sit on the sidelines.
 
WorldTraveler said:
First of all, let's deal with the transcons; if you think that forcing up average fares by reducing the number of seats in the market and dramatically decreasing revenue is a good idea, then you should be showing us the economics that support your contention.
Click to expand...
Nice deflection, World Fraudster.
With respect to average fares, I’m only regurgitating your own words from your theories that you have posted multiple times and that is that high average fares is all that matters. Not seats. So, again, going by your own definition, it looks like AA wins and DL is the loser.

Or if this is not the case, then perhaps it is you that is demonstrating how vastly outclassed you are in your knowledge of the industry.

Spin away.

WorldTraveler said:
I have repeatedly posted - …….. Then they lost nearly all of the cargo revenue...
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It certainly is true that you have repeatedly posted diatribes about how allegedly AA lost massive amounts of cargo revenue. However, when challenged with providing facts, you lost the challenge because you could not back up your made-up statement. By using your own cargo numbers, AA walked away from a grand total of 1 full B767 of cargo.

But hey, when you’re the World Fraudster, it is easy to make up statements, nay fairy tales, that paint DL as the best of the best while at the same time denigrate every other carrier.

Spin away.

WorldTraveler said:
your laundry list of manufactured dirt belies reality - again. to start, WN isn't going to fly Latin America to ATL; DTW has a higher share of revenue and substantially higher average fares as well as total revenue than AA has at ORD and DL is REMOVING 50 seaters and overall RJ flying from DTW; and DL has added more than enough non-Tokyo seats to Asia to offset the cut in CONNECTING capacity - and some of that capacity is being added in LAX-PVG where AA will take back seat to DL in yet another market - and the first to China.
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Let’s wait to see what WN does at ATL in the long term before you do your widget victory dance.

DTW and MI in general have not fully recovered from their economic woes. No amount of RJ up-gauging will make that fact go away.

Yes, DL has addedflights that by-pass NRT to Asia, basically confirming that NRT is now almost just another ‘spoke’ in the DL route map.







WorldTraveler said:
as for the ME3, you only show your ignorance by thinking this is a DL only issue or that DL is worse affected. In case you missed it, AA flies MXP-JFK, is the weakest carrier in Italy and has no JV or alliance partners, as evidenced by AA's reduction in frequencies during the winter to levels that are not sustainable.

Tell us when AA ends up pulling MXP=JFK that this is a DL only problem.
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Somebody that claims to possess so much ‘mental horsepower’, you should be able to ‘grasp’ the fact that there is actually real seasonality (not made up as in DLs SEA-HND route) in many US-Europe markets and frequencies are reduced in the winter.

The facts are, as evidenced by your refusal to even acknowledge that DL faces numerous strategic challenges, that you truly are a fraudster whose purpose is to paint a certain narrative (DL wins, all other carriers suck). It is obvious to anybody reading your posts that when you are challenged with facts that potentially affect your favorite carrier in even a slightly negative manner, you can’t handle it and here you demonstrate for everyone to see just how outclassed in your knowledge of the industry and the issues you are.

Spin away.
 
And looks like someone is firing back:
 
http://www.arabianaerospace.aero/emirates-chief-hints-at-legal-action-against-us-subsidy-critics.html
 
In a hard-hitting interview with global financial news service Reuters, Emirates Airline president, Sir Tim Clark, has called for the right of reply to the 55-page dossier prepared by three American airlines claiming unfair subsidies and presented to the US government. - See more at: http://www.arabianaerospace.aero/emirates-chief-hints-at-legal-action-against-us-subsidy-critics.html#sthash.xKMaq6PH.dpuf
 
are you going to post here that DL is not a US citizen?

Tim Clark all he wants.

DL is free to communicate with who it wants in the US government - and in the EU as well - without Tim Clark or EK being a part of the conversation.

He is clearly worried about what they are saying if he can't stand to be left out..
 
Of course it does because you are the one who opened your mouth and made an incorrect statement.

AA, DL, and UA are all US citizens while EK is not.

and even as US citizens, AA, DL, and UA can all talk with non-US governments including the EU without EK knowing what is said.

US carriers are fighting back and I suspect they will find plenty of support from the EU3; EK might find that the best times are behind them.
 
U.S.-U.A.E. Business Council March 5, 2015 2:42 PM
 
“Stop Complaining and Start Competing” says U.S. – U.A.E. Business Council
 
“Before claiming government support for international competitors, the Big 3 may first want to check their own balance sheets. Since 2006, the Big 3 transferred billions of dollars of pension liabilities directly to Uncle Sam while leaving creditors holding the bag for billions more through multiple bankruptcies. They received billions in cash payments and guaranteed loans in a direct government bailout while enjoying the advantages of antitrust immunity to fix transatlantic fares with their European partners. If that weren’t enough, as a result of Fly America, the Big 3 also benefit from the exclusion of any international competition in the U.S. government market - the world’s largest,” Sebright noted. “The Big 3 missed the biggest shift in global travel trends with the rapid growth of travel to, in, and between emerging markets in Asia, Africa, and the Middle East, and now, on account of mistakes of their own doing, the Big 3 are looking to blame Gulf carriers.”
 
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/stop-complaining-start-competing-says-194200700.html
 
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