JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[Albert]

exactly. 2 non-aa airlines merged and he kept his seniority. today, that legacy us air clerk's non-us air seniority is included amongst aa fsc's, some who worked for aa here or there or reno air, or a sky chef, etc..etc.

i don't think javits was hired to tell the us air PTers that he can't help them with their seniority. there's more pain on the aa side. i said i have a problem with this and i explained why, but i can lump it. as far as taking years to sort out, i don't believe that from the aa side- the company knows everyone's company seniority date.



i hope so. aa's bk was so ridiculous the govt. actually pushed back. aa had nearly $4 billion in cash when they filed. it was a pension move, pure and simple. aa's pilots used to get $1 million lump sum pension payout. aa's mistake is that they should have filed in the early 2000's, ala you, 2xs and everyone else. they allowed everyone to accrue an additional 8 years on that frozen pension.



that isn't any kind of theory. i'm talking about co-workers that helped push aa to the top of the chain - from mid 80's expansion til 9-11. guys getting paychecks (when they were paper), that had a huge AMR on it. unfortunately for them, maybe they should have pumped fuel into piedmont planes or catered allegheny airlines to get a rightful place in line. this is what i'm talking about, never saying that former legacy us air have no rights or nothing to carry over.

as far as the aa vs. us air, i'm not in that fight. we all got killed by 9-11, everything changed. prior to that, aa was the best and paid the best. maybe that's why aa had too much money not to file in 2002 and flopped on it's attempt to terminate our pensions in 2011. they should have filed under a republican administration.

Wasn't a lot of that 4 billion raised by borrowing on the company's fleet of new A/C? The company was probably headed into bankruptcy eventually anyway just to be competitive with the other airlines

 

[CremaDiLimone]

ok...you just told me that the ex piedmont employee hired in 1986 by piedmont, now has 1986 seniority blended with aa....while aa people who worked for simmons (eagle) from 1985-1990, has only 1990 seniority on today's blended list. do you understand my argument?

as far as the 'b' scale, i'm sure it was 1983. aa and the twu used to do 6 year deals. '89, '95 and 2001 were the next contracts, pre 9-11.

when i first started working in 1984, i had to rethink this. ua starting pay was $9.06 an hour and max rate was in the $19 range.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Wasn't a lot of that 4 billion raised by borrowing on the company's fleet of new A/C? The company was probably headed into bankruptcy eventually anyway just to be competitive with the other airlines

i'm sure it was because aa was flying some 12-14 flts a day to lhr from jfk/ord/mia/dfw/lax. if we had the coveted clt-lhr route, maybe we never file.

no one got smart with you. if you feel the need to crap on aa to make you feel better about us air, be my guest. you were the competiton and us air filed twice in the early 2000s.

why would aa pull an accounting scam to make it appear they had fake money, when they are trying to convince a bk judge and govt. that they had no money to pay pensions??? that made zero sense.

 

[Albert]

ok...you just told me that the ex piedmont employee hired in 1986 by piedmont, now has 1986 seniority blended with aa....while aa people who worked for simmons (eagle) from 1985-1990, has only 1990 seniority on today's blended list. do you understand my argument?

as far as the 'b' scale, i'm sure it was 1983. aa and the twu used to do 6 year deals. '89, '95 and 2001 were the next contracts, pre 9-11.

when i first started working in 1984, ua was making $19.06 an hour, only 5 years to top out.

No I don't understand what you are saying. You do realize Piedmont was a regular mainline airline with 737s and 767s. After the merger of USand PI we kept the US name still owned the rights to PI and started calling one of our wholly owned commuters Piedmont.

 

[WeAAsles]

Wasn't a lot of that 4 billion raised by borrowing on the company's fleet of new A/C? The company was probably headed into bankruptcy eventually anyway just to be competitive with the other airlines

AA was going to go into BK irregardless of the 4 Bil in the bank.

(Balloon debt payment and Pilots bailing)

So no you're not crapping on anyone, you are stating fact.

 

[WeAAsles]

Yeah he sounds like he could be one of those "restore and more" dudes. Thickheaded people abound in these ranks don't they

The entire conversation comes off as more emotional rather than talking about legalities.

 

[Albert]

I'm not crapping on anyone all airlines have their faults it is just your idea you should be senior to me because you worked for the"better" airline is ridiculous and to me is what you are trying to say

 

[CremaDiLimone]

No I don't understand what you are saying. You do realize Piedmont was a regular mainline airline with 737s and 767s. After the merger of USand PI we kept the US name still owned the rights to PI and started calling one of our wholly owned commuters Piedmont.

sure. what kind of planes did reno air fly?

 

[Albert]

AA was going to go into BK irregardless of the 4 Bil in the bank.

(Balloon debt payment and Pilots bailing)

So no you're not crapping on anyone, you are stating fact.

Does this guy realize PI was a regular airline probably the same size Jetblue is today

 

[CremaDiLimone]

I'm not crapping on anyone all airlines have their faults it is just your idea you should be senior to me because you worked for the"better" airline is ridiculous and to me is what you are trying to say

that's not what i said.

one picks up real quick here that some posters only read their own posts and others don't read others' posts.

 

[Albert]

sure. what kind of planes did reno air fly?

Why didn't they get their time ? LUS also bought PSA back in the day, all got there time sounds like you should be pointing at your union not the arbitrator or IAM LUS

 

[CremaDiLimone]

as mentioned, some don't fully read others' posts.

i have posted a few times my beef is with the twu.

 

[Albert]

as mentioned, some don't fully read others' posts.

i have posted a few times my beef is with the twu.

guys who worked at aa in 1980s-90s as aa made money and our competition america west filed bk in the 90s and us air twice in early 2000s? so, now these former competitors at struggling companies jump ahead of legacy aa fscs?
Maybe your not reading what you are writing how else is this supposed to be interpreted

 

[WeAAsles]

I'm not crapping on anyone all airlines have their faults it is just your idea you should be senior to me because you worked for the"better" airline is ridiculous and to me is what you are trying to say

Ok he says that his beef is with the TWU but at the same time it seems to me at least in this conversation that he's trying to say that all LAA guys should gain back 100% time and whatever happened at your airline keeping you below him is ok? (Including of course TWA cause he wasn't with them)

The argument being as I see it that your entire airline was a hodgepodge stitching of tons of crappy airlines that smelled bad and you should now count your lucky stars that you have officially made it into Bushwood.

"Sir, sir. Excuse me sir"

 

[WeAAsles]

as mentioned, some don't fully read others' posts.

i have posted a few times my beef is with the twu.

Looks like you've been carrying that beef for a very long time now and I'm guessing on your tombstone will read the words of your beef?

Sad to live with a beef for so long I can only imagine.