JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[charlie Brown]

CB. Correct me if I'm wrong, but according to the latest update, there are 7 outstanding Articles, where there have been no exchange of proposals. If I read this right; the membership should expect the process to take awhile IMO. I expect my committee, acting on my behalf, to stand up and not accept what is perceived to be a concession to the membership. Haste makes waste. Let's strive to get the best JCBA possible. Let's get it right. The JCBA will be the starting point for future contract negotiations. Important to build a solid foundation.

Ograc
Yes it is right at that number. Can't say exactly how many because we could split some of them into another article or two. But we have made it clear that we won't bring back a concessionary contract to our members.

 

[charlie Brown]

thanks bro! hopefully they'll make more progress

We are making progress. Granted it's frustrating and slow. But if anyone thought it was going to be anything different with this company and Parker, then you are just speaking out of not being knowledgeable of how Parker and his staff works. For the AA folks that read this and are used to quicker negotiations, all I can say is welcome to US Airways. Yes I know we kept the AA name, but not the AA management team. Sure we could have had an agreement by now if you like a contract like CS agents recieved. But we can't accept some of those things. We expect better and so should all of you. I can only speak for the IAM side in that we will be picky on what we agree to. I agree with ograc in that we have to get this right.

 

[charlie Brown]

Another thing we have to maybe deal with coming up is maybe the TWU side of the team changing somewhat. Some of their members on the team are up for election. I'm not a fan of changing the negotiating team this far into the issues. But that's not my call.

 

[robbedagain]

cb and all the nego team good luck best of luck in the up coming talks and don't bring back a concessionary deal I'm all to familiar with our slow mgmt. team at US and AA

 

[Rogallo]

We are making progress. Granted it's frustrating and slow. But if anyone thought it was going to be anything different with this company and Parker, then you are just speaking out of not being knowledgeable of how Parker and his staff works. For the AA folks that read this and are used to quicker negotiations, all I can say is welcome to US Airways. Yes I know we kept the AA name, but not the AA management team. Sure we could have had an agreement by now if you like a contract like CS agents recieved. But we can't accept some of those things. We expect better and so should all of you. I can only speak for the IAM side in that we will be picky on what we agree to. I agree with ograc in that we have to get this right.

The IAM is slower than the TWU in negotiations? Didn't know molasses could get any slower in January. Oy Vey!

 

[WeAAsles]

ograc, according to the update, you are correct, looks like seven that have not been brought to the table at all. You include those with the ones that AA refuses to even respond to along with the proposals from AA that the Association can't even agree upon between the TWU and IAM (and yes, they do exist) then the reality is we are a long long way off. While I agree, we are not in the mood to give anything up, I'm also here to say many of us are on the down side of our career, you included I believe. I would like to see a contract before I die or am put out to pasture before I worry about those yet to walk on the face of the earth. Don't anyone twist or spin what I'm saying either. I'm not saying don't look out for future workers, and I'm not saying take a concession or two to get this deal done. What I am saying is how about this powerful strength in number Association start acting like a strong representative and put a ton of pressure on the company. Every time I see Parker explain the hold up in our negotiations, I swear I see him smirking at the Association. I for one am tired of hearing the "combining to contracts excuse". All that tells me is the TWU and IAM cannot work things out. With the Holidays coming up, I think we all can agree that negotiations will slow even more. So why can't they meet every week until then, it is absurd. I see the last negotiation scheduled is the week of December 7th-12th. When would they meet again, sometime in Jan or Feb.
None of us old folks are getting any younger, we would like to enjoy a decent contract or two, we deserve it! Put pressure on the company Association and take care of your damn members.

One thing I have to say I find to be a little disconcerting is that it looks like the Maintenance talks are beginning to pull ahead of our talks? Are they or have they offered better improvements to their Articles over ours or is there something else that is holding back our progress?

For the longest time guaging the progress by the TA'd articles they pretty much ran in tandem with each other?

 

[WeAAsles]

We are making progress. Granted it's frustrating and slow. But if anyone thought it was going to be anything different with this company and Parker, then you are just speaking out of not being knowledgeable of how Parker and his staff works. For the AA folks that read this and are used to quicker negotiations, all I can say is welcome to US Airways. Yes I know we kept the AA name, but not the AA management team. Sure we could have had an agreement by now if you like a contract like CS agents recieved. But we can't accept some of those things. We expect better and so should all of you. I can only speak for the IAM side in that we will be picky on what we agree to. I agree with ograc in that we have to get this right.

I have to ask the question here CB. What is it exactly that you would consider concessionary? At this moment in many areas it appears (Not all) that the IAM AA contract is superior to what we have on our side currently. On a strictly monetary basis you have lower insurance, more Holliday's at Double Time, and Double Time under certain OT scenarios. You also have the granddaddy of Station Staffing language on your side.

On our side we're not enjoying those benefits you have. Maybe the biggest disparity to me being how many members we have commuting who would really like to find their way home if at all possible.

It's being said on many Social Media pages that your side just has no motivation to secure a deal and get this done? If I was in your position I may feel that way? What do you feel is missing that would motivate you to send us out a JCBA for us to vote on? What do you feel needs to be secured for the members you represent to say yes to passing?

Are you guys all on the same page in those rooms? Are you realizing that this is supposed to be an Association where the concerns of the whole should be considered over the concerns of one side or the other? Are you guys co mingling or is it like the School dance where the boys sit on one side and the girls on the other? Essentially are you thinking and acting collectively? I really DO NOT want to believe what those managers have been alluding to in those roadshows.

I said this awhile back and I'm still flying with it. If you guys aren't working together 100% then the Association has to be called a failure and that would really be a shame. Hope that's not the case?

(On a personal note I just bought a new Mustang this weekend so it's not exactly as if I'm hurting financially and am in a hurry for anything to be rushed)

 

[WeAAsles]

Another thing we have to maybe deal with coming up is maybe the TWU side of the team changing somewhat. Some of their members on the team are up for election. I'm not a fan of changing the negotiating team this far into the issues. But that's not my call.

We might have the answer to that question on DFW and Brian tonight or tomorrow? I support Brian remaining with you to finish the work you guys have progressed with but I've been gone from DFW for 6 years now so can't say how it might go?

I think it's going to come down to Brian or William Fa? JMO but I'm not sure former President Darrin Pierce will get the votes? (The 4th guy running is a Loony Toon)

If I hear anything tonight and it's ok by whoever tells me, I'll pop back in and let you know who won?

 

[WeAAsles]

We are making progress. Granted it's frustrating and slow. But if anyone thought it was going to be anything different with this company and Parker, then you are just speaking out of not being knowledgeable of how Parker and his staff works. For the AA folks that read this and are used to quicker negotiations, all I can say is welcome to US Airways. Yes I know we kept the AA name, but not the AA management team. Sure we could have had an agreement by now if you like a contract like CS agents recieved. But we can't accept some of those things. We expect better and so should all of you. I can only speak for the IAM side in that we will be picky on what we agree to. I agree with ograc in that we have to get this right.

The management team is irrelevant. Every management team has to answer to their shareholders, the BOD and the financial conditions surrounding the business.

In my career at AA the only negotiations that I can recall going quickly were concessionary in nature. Every other full blown session was also long and drawn out unless it was an ask for a contract extension.

I'd really like to see this:

"We're AA, We're US"
We're bigger than you, we have the numbers"
"Our management team, your old management team"
"We're TWU, We're IAM"

Schtick, fall by the wayside were it belongs.(Trashheap)

Very counterproductive. Management 101, divide and conquer.

 

[bob@las-AA]

I have to ask the question here CB. What is it exactly that you would consider concessionary? At this moment in many areas it appears (Not all) that the IAM AA contract is superior to what we have on our side currently. On a strictly monetary basis you have lower insurance, more Holliday's at Double Time, and Double Time under certain OT scenarios. You also have the granddaddy of Station Staffing language on your side.

On our side we're not enjoying those benefits you have. Maybe the biggest disparity to me being how many members we have commuting who would really like to find their way home if at all possible.

It's being said on many Social Media pages that your side just has no motivation to secure a deal and get this done? If I was in your position I may feel that way? What do you feel is missing that would motivate you to send us out a JCBA for us to vote on? What do you feel needs to be secured for the members you represent to say yes to passing?

Are you guys all on the same page in those rooms? Are you realizing that this is supposed to be an Association where the concerns of the whole should be considered over the concerns of one side or the other? Are you guys co mingling or is it like the School dance where the boys sit on one side and the girls on the other? Essentially are you thinking and acting collectively? I really DO NOT want to believe what those managers have been alluding to in those roadshows.

I said this awhile back and I'm still flying with it. If you guys aren't working together 100% then the Association has to be called a failure and that would really be a shame. Hope that's not the case?

(On a personal note I just bought a new Mustang this weekend so it's not exactly as if I'm hurting financially and am in a hurry for anything to be rushed)

Nice post weez! I think the slow pace is from the US side not willing to give up any holidays, stations, and others.

 

[Albert]

Nice post weez! I think the slow pace is from the US side not willing to give up any holidays, stations, and others.

Why should we give up anything? Go back to blowing fuses and tripping circuit breakers. I missed you Bob. Weez I got a PM a couple of months ago that really trashed you, a fellow MIA guy I guess

 

[bob@las-AA]

Why should we give up anything? Go back to blowing fuses and tripping circuit breakers. I missed you Bob. Weez I got a PM a couple of months ago that really trashed you, a fellow MIA guy I guess

Is this WP, who is now "Albert"?

 

[WeAAsles]

Nice post weez! I think the slow pace is from the US side not willing to give up any holidays, stations, and others.

I don't think "we" should have to be shortchanged on Holliday's Bob? Even though they're a much smaller group and may have off, the TWU Flight Sims just secured language for 10 Holliday's at Double and a half. I'd like to see that be the new bar?

Station staffing is another matter entirely and I don't think they've even gotten up to that part yet? The IAM language showed that it was never the intention of the company to keep the one flight Staffing language since they made a point to mention until a JCBA is secured. So that tells me that it was only a courtesy placemat.

The Agents have a methodology for 5 flights per day and I'd like to honestly expect that for us as well. But yes the IAM negotiators do currently hold the keys to the car or hold the gun to keep the company hostage to making that change (Just being honest here)

I also have to wonder if there is an endgame attached to that raise? Both the IAM and TWU leaders in the past have a history of walking in and finishing the deal when movement comes to a standstill. If that does happen (and we know about it) I guess it will be left to debate if that was the right move or not?

And personally I do feel having 12 people negotiating for us is a bit ridiculous. It does come across as very political in nature.

 

[Albert]

Is this WP, who is now "Albert"?

It it is one of my many aliases
[

 

[WeAAsles]

Why should we give up anything? Go back to blowing fuses and tripping circuit breakers. I missed you Bob. Weez I got a PM a couple of months ago that really trashed you, a fellow MIA guy I guess

Never could give a rats arse what anyone says about me unless they're the ones paying my bills. And I don't like anyone else but me paying my own way in life.

Keeps me unfettered and not having to answer to anyone for some extra comforts. But most people will suck a, for an extra couple of bucks over their personal pride.