I have had enough of the Teamsters!

[ThirdSeatHero]

Zero doubt at least last year that yes AMFA spent more on Legal (One Law Firm) per issue than most other Airlines. Remembering of course that AMFA ONLY represents a small handful of Mechanics in the Industry. But I’m “only” pointing out the SSMP Lawfirm as I firmly believe they are nothing more than a scheme to bilk those AMT’s who are stupid enough to be represented by them. AMFA is SSMP and SSMP is AMFA.

... and you are entitled to believe whatever you wish, so knock yourself out ... you're beliefs however do not = FACTS - whenever you want to have a disscussion on legal spending per avg member, backed with verifiable reports, let me know.

The numbers may not be equal but having only 5 or 6 Stations is ridiculous. AA Mechanics have over 26 secured Stations and Fleet has 45. Personally I call that solid proof that the TWU and IAM are better Unions. Oh and in compensation AMT’s and related earn the same as their AMFA counterparts with just tons more members.

That argument is complete and utter nonsense - No union, AMFA or otherwise, can force a company to open a MX station where none existed before. Now if you want to talk about protecting existing MX stations thats fine - How many has SWA closed under AMFA? How many MX stations have AA closed under the TWU? Lets have that discussion.

No one is going for AMFA. Oh yes they do get real verifiable cards but since the NMB keeps declaring that they don’t have enough it’s obvious that they always file short and highly likely they also file with fake signatures. Unfortunately we all know the NMB doesn’t release that information though.

Wash - Rinse - Repeat ... sorry, I've heard it all before ... when we threw the IAM out - if you have fake signatures proof on AMFA post it - the ibt is known for that and I believe was caught at AA recently for doing just that. However, "if" the nmb doesn't release that info then I guess your statement is mere speculation at best

As far as Gary’s videos with the comments turned off you’re right. I’ll give you that one. He absolutely should open those videos up to comments (And Debate) as I’m 100% positive he’d wipe the floor against anyone who wants to compare those contracts.

Good to hear - I don't condone censorship for merely asking questions ... from any union. If the question is genuine, and stated civilly, then no holds barred. That said, I fully condone and support the banning of those who continually make unsubstantiated claims, and cannot/will not back up their assertions with verifiable FACTS.

Now as far as AMFA at UAL that’s nothing more than it being the season again. If the IBT is about to start negotiations that’s always when the AMFA bottom feeders come out to cause disruption. That’s the best time to conduct raids so SSMP can keep getting paid that yearly bread and butter to support their families and lifestyles. They don’t give a rats ass about those AMT’s. Just how much money they got in their wallets that they can take.

Now as far as AMFA at UAL that’s nothing more than it being the season again.??? - Do you work here - How would you know?

You're knee-jerked to anti AMFA regardless of the conversation - the OP was asking about "interest" currently there is no drive for AMFA or any other union. That said the interest for a change in representation is very real and the reason is quite valid.

Prior to the ibt take over AMFA had scope language that spelled out specifically the 3 heavy C chk lines that by contract had to be performed in SFO 1 A320, 1 B757, and 1 B777 If you know anything about MX numbers required for a heavy chk you will know this represents an enormous number of mechanics. In addition to this language AMFA also secured SFO maintenance shop work by specific sections as well.

The teamsters, in their mad rush to remove all AMFA language from our following agreement removed this specific language, and replaced it with their generic catch all vague language - now those chks and shops are gone.

This is just 1 example ... there are most certainly more.


BTW - I noticed you didn't answer my question on your interest - so Ill post it again ...

Now whats your angle in all of this? When last we engaged on the AA thread you were working in Ramp Service - Have you acquired your tickets? Are you in AA MX now? If not, why are you here? Why do you care if UAL MX goes AMFA, or even your own MX group for that matter?

 

[WeAAsles]

... and you are entitled to believe whatever you wish, so knock yourself out ... you're beliefs however do not = FACTS - whenever you want to have a disscussion on legal spending per avg member, backed with verifiable reports, let me know.



That argument is complete and utter nonsense - No union, AMFA or otherwise, can force a company to open a MX station where none existed before. Now if you want to talk about protecting existing MX stations thats fine - How many has SWA closed under AMFA? How many MX stations have AA closed under the TWU? Lets have that discussion.



Wash - Rinse - Repeat ... sorry, I've heard it all before ... when we threw the IAM out - if you have fake signatures proof on AMFA post it - the ibt is known for that and I believe was caught at AA recently for doing just that. However, "if" the nmb doesn't release that info then I guess your statement is mere speculation at best



Good to hear - I don't condone censorship for merely asking questions ... from any union. If the question is genuine, and stated civilly, then no holds barred. That said, I fully condone and support the banning of those who continually make unsubstantiated claims, and cannot/will not back up their assertions with verifiable FACTS.



Now as far as AMFA at UAL that’s nothing more than it being the season again.??? - Do you work here - How would you know?

You're knee-jerked to anti AMFA regardless of the conversation - the OP was asking about "interest" currently there is no drive for AMFA or any other union. That said the interest for a change in representation is very real and the reason is quite valid.

Prior to the ibt take over AMFA had scope language that spelled out specifically the 3 heavy C chk lines that by contract had to be performed in SFO 1 A320, 1 B757, and 1 B777 If you know anything about MX numbers required for a heavy chk you will know this represents an enormous number of mechanics. In addition to this language AMFA also secured SFO maintenance shop work by specific sections as well.

The teamsters, in their mad rush to remove all AMFA language from our following agreement removed this specific language, and replaced it with their generic catch all vague language - now those chks and shops are gone.

This is just 1 example ... there are most certainly more.


BTW - I noticed you didn't answer my question on your interest - so Ill post it again ...

My interest is simple. I think AMFA (SSMP) are a Cancer. I believe the body doesn’t necessarily need to die for that Cancer to be eradicated. Again and again I believe AMFA is nothing more than a Ponzi scheme/ Cash Cow for a Lawfirm that has their office in Westbury Long Island. I think that Cancer tries to weaken any Union it can so it can enrich itself at the expense of the uniformed. I’m in one of those Unions. And it doesn’t matter if I’m an AMT, Pilot, Flight Attendant, or Janitor that needs to clean toilet bowls with a toothbrush.

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[ThirdSeatHero]

My interest is simple. I think AMFA (SSMP) are a Cancer. I believe the body doesn’t necessarily need to die for that Cancer to be eradicated. Again and again I believe AMFA is nothing more than a Ponzi scheme/ Cash Cow for a Lawfirm that has their office in Westbury Long Island. I think that Cancer tries to weaken any Union it can so it can enrich itself at the expense of the uniformed. I’m in one of those Unions. And it doesn’t matter if I’m an AMT, Pilot, Flight Attendant, or Janitor that needs to clean toilet bowls with a toothbrush.

So the short version is you're NOT a mechanic - got it.

 

[WeAAsles]

Here’s another group that the Lawfirm tried to pass off as a “NEW” and improved Union for AMT’s. Not to mention let’s not forget about AMP (Aircraft Mechanics Professionals) too. All nothing more than scams.

 

[WeAAsles]

So the short version is you're NOT a mechanic - got it.

I’m also not a Shriner or Tap Dancer either. So what.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

I’m also not a Shriner or Tap Dancer either. So what.

It cannot be lost on even you, that as a union member you certainly have a right to voice your opinion on matters affecting your union. However, you shouldn't find your opinions are greeted with skepticism a shock when you are not currently even in the class and craft of the group that is/might be seeking representation.

You are not a UAL employee - You are not a member of the ibt - You are not an aircraft mechanic ... Here, your opinions don't carry much weight, anymore so than mine would commenting on Ramp Service at AA

 

[WeAAsles]

It cannot be lost on even you, that as a union member you certainly have a right to voice your opinion on matters affecting your union. However, you shouldn't find your opinions are greeted with skepticism a shock when you are not currently even in the class and craft of the group that is/might be seeking representation.

You are not a UAL employee - You are not a member of the ibt - You are not an aircraft mechanic ... Here, your opinions don't carry much weight, anymore so than mine would commenting on Ramp Service at AA

Facts matter/ Titles are the thing that are irrelevant. Facts are also threatening to those who don’t want others to hear them.

BTW I’m the one posting the items that I’ve read. These are not my opinions, they are coming from locations such as DOL LM2’s, the Airline Data Project, the TWU AMT Airline Division Director, the IBT, the AFA, the IAM, AMFA’s Website, random websites, Etc.

I don’t need to argue with anyone. People who might read can make up their own minds using their own intellectual prowess.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Facts matter/ Titles are the thing that are irrelevant

Facts do Matter - titles matter insofar as having the experiences that are driving those in the mechanics to seek better representation ... experiences you do not possess

 

[WeAAsles]

Facts do Matter - titles matter insofar as having the experiences that are driving those in the mechanics to seek better representation ... experiences you do not possess

Attempting to minimize my participation over a title is a very very old and frankly tiresome act. It’s been played as many times as certain boring old tunes are played on classic rock radio stations. It also never worked as today I made many friends who are AMT’s over the years from my participation on this site. Many of them you likely would be shocked to know still reach out to me in PM’s (On Facebook) for information.

Be that as it may. You should try to refute the information I’m providing rather than trying to make light of me if I wear a different color shirt than you. The main reason why SSMP (AMFA) never wins any of those representational disputes at the big carriers.

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Attempting to minimize my participation over a title is a very very old and frankly tiresome act. It’s been played as many times as certain boring old tunes are played on classic rock radio stations. It also never worked as today I made many friends who are AMT’s over the years from my participation on this site. Many of them you likely would be shocked to know still reach out to me in PM’s (On Facebook) for information.

Be that as it may. You should try to refute the information I’m providing rather than trying to make light of me if I wear a different color shirt than you. The main reason why SSMP (AMFA) never wins any of those representational disputes at the big carriers.

Not trying to minimize your participation ... just opining that you should curb your expectations when trying to come off credible to mechanics when you're not a mechanic yourself

As for your continued attacks on SSMP, they have won big representational disputes as well as the smaller ones ... UAL ... NWA ... and don't try now to deflect and say they aren't there anymore ... your critique was "winning" which they did, thereby refuting your "information"

 

[WeAAsles]

Not trying to minimize your participation ... just opining that you should curb your expectations when trying to come off credible to mechanics when you're not a mechanic yourself

As for your continued attacks on SSMP, they have won big representational disputes as well as the smaller ones ... UAL ... NWA ... and don't try now to deflect and say they aren't there anymore ... your critique was "winning" which they did, thereby refuting your "information"

Am I arguing anything about how to fix a Plane? If I did try to argue any of that you would have every right to put me in my place and slam me down for that


At the time AMFA was a shiny new penny. Who doesn’t want a shiny new penny over an old dirty one that someone may have pissed on.

They honestly though never did win because they no longer represent any of those carriers. UAL went back to the IBT years ago and NWA merged into Delta and AMFA quietly extinguished their certification. And at SWA they’ve only been able to capture cash but no work or stations. Don’t get me wrong I love cash too. But I’d “””HATE””” to be stuck back in LGA where I started no matter how much coin you threw at me.

 

[swamt]

A couple of answers to your questions;
NO! he is not a mechanic and he is employed at AA
AMFA @ SWA hasn't lost any maint stations while represented by AMFA. In fact AMFA won the full fledged onslaught of SWA fighting AMFA to get rid of the 4th line of heavy maint that AMFA nego into the contract after taking over from the teamsters that would have allowed them to outsource it if they were still here, as you already know. Also, SWA and AMFA has also successfully added or will add several maint positions and headcounts to new hangars around the country, Hou., Denver, Fla, Cali and mid west either Midway or BWI I forget. Way-Way more added positions, headcount and maint facilities in 15 years compared to the teamsters 3 decades and allowing not just outsourcing but overseas outsourcing, several of them.
Sorry for interruption but I know for a fact he will not report what is really going on in AMFA, especially when it is so positive.

 

[WeAAsles]

A couple of answers to your questions;
NO! he is not a mechanic and he is employed at AA
AMFA @ SWA hasn't lost any maint stations while represented by AMFA. In fact AMFA won the full fledged onslaught of SWA fighting AMFA to get rid of the 4th line of heavy maint that AMFA nego into the contract after taking over from the teamsters that would have allowed them to outsource it if they were still here, as you already know. Also, SWA and AMFA has also successfully added or will add several maint positions and headcounts to new hangars around the country, Hou., Denver, Fla, Cali and mid west either Midway or BWI I forget. Way-Way more added positions, headcount and maint facilities in 15 years compared to the teamsters 3 decades and allowing not just outsourcing but overseas outsourcing, several of them.
Sorry for interruption but I know for a fact he will not report what is really going on in AMFA, especially when it is so positive.

You see what I mean. Look at this guy. He’s STILL bringing up the Teamsters after almost 20 years. “Full fledged onslaught”? What kind of comment is this? So in other words something again for the SSMP Lawfirm to get their hands on to bilk more money from the AMT’s at SWA.

Anyone who goes back and reads all the History of AMFA at SWA is going to discover that it’s a History of constant fighting. They’ve never figured out how to work with their employer and negotiate.

It’s all here in this Video which you can then go and read their contract for yourself (If you can find it available)

 

[WeAAsles]

And BTW after 20 years this is no longer an IBT Contract, this is an AMFA contract. If after 20 years they haven’t been able to make improvements then that’s totally on them. And besides if their IBT Contract 20 years ago was so chitty who voted for it? Why did it exist at all? And here it is anyway so you can do your own comparisons to this deal and the contracts at AA and UAL.

http://www.amfanational.org/docs/contracts/AMFA_SWA_AMT_TA_20190401_print.pdf

 

[JimmyBop]

No whats obvious are the anti AMFA talking points haven't changed much.

I was part of 5 AMFA drives at UAL - 4 failed due to the same company/IAM type collusion seen at AA, until finally, after all the dead & retirees, all the last minute added work groups, we finally won on the 5th try and replaced the IAM.

We were successful, and if the membership at AA want change and are persistant in their efforts, they will get that change.



Okay, so you don't waste your time - this has been asked and answered in many other forums, and card drives - if you want to continue to beat the drum of legal spending you're not going to like the result - Go ahead and cite AMFA's small membership numbers - I'll cite the bloated bureaucracies of industrial unions like the TWU IAM and ibt ... You really think AMFA spends more Legal dollars per member on average than the industrials? Fine, pick a year, and run your numbers ... show your work through verifiable sources like you have LMs' or the OLMS site are fine ... and we will discuss FACTS not anti AMFA talking points.



More of your typical nonsense - MX vs Ramp stations comparisons mean NOTHING - there isn't an airline flying that has an equal number of MX and Ramp stations - nice try.



Yes, I've been on this site along time. Yes, my posts bash the ibt. I am currently "represented" by them and that representation is sorely lacking. I am not currently affiliated with AMFA, I am a member of the teamsters - Now whats your angle in all of this? When last we engaged on the AA thread you were working in Ramp Service - Have you acquired your tickets? Are you in AA MX now? If not, why are you here? Why do you care if UAL MX goes AMFA, or even your own MX group for that matter?




I haven't restricted anything - that said I do find your complaint a bit hypocritical when you post a youtube TWU/AMFA attack video that has the comment section turned off.

As you say ... "the information is going to get out there no matter how much they (maybe you too) try to restrict and censor it." ...

Successful? You were decertified! You call that successful? WOW!