How about this. Any AWA employee that comes east gets stapled to the bottom. Any U employee that goes west gets stapled to the bottom. Any new bases get date of hire. Does that sound fair to you. We never get to live in sunny PHX and u never get to go to Europe (unless they do it out of PHX). I could live with this but I hope it does'nt come to that. In a few years with what growth i think will happen and with the amt of U employees that are leaving with the buyouts and retirement it will not matter much. Please tell me what your relative seniorty should be. Say you were to come to PHL and you have 10 years with AWA how many years would you expect to have at the new carrier? Is it that you think you should have date of hire on the east coast but any U employee that goes west should loose some seniority as to not effect what you can fly? give me an example please of a 10 year AWA employee one the east coast and a 10 year U employee in PHX. By the way AWA isn't saving anyone. If this merger doesn't happen and AA or NW come after AWA you will go on the bottom. If you don't merge with U who else would you like to merge with?hp_fa said:
Hp Workers Fear Us's Unions
- Thread starter etops1
- Start date
hp_fa
Veteran
- Feb 19, 2004
- 3,290
- 178
Us/boston said:
You can stop right there because at least for me that is acceptable and I suspect it is with our FA workforce. See, I told you I wasn't trying to be unreasonable.
The remaining problems will be with employees at outstations where both HP and U have operations. They need to be considered.
My 2 cents.....We need each other. U needs AWA more right now, because I think that in about a year, AWA would not be doing so well standing alone. Yes, AWA has money, but, they are burning through it. So, we need each other at this point. And do not forget that there are other players in this game right now (investing alot of money) that will pull this whole thing together. I hope that AWA managment will be running the show. We all have seen what U's managment team has accomplished in the past 5 years or more. I hope this all works out and AFA and ALPA is fair (abides by the contracts).
MY 2 CENTS
MY 2 CENTS
Light Years
Veteran
- Aug 27, 2002
- 2,878
- 0
US Airways is an airline made up of multiple mergers, and EVERY F/A has thier hire date. Just think if HP or US merged with someone else:
UA- AFA, but throws fits at the DOH rule when merger talk happens. Not to mention they are about twice the size of U.
CO, NW- Different union, not good
DL- Non-union
AA- We all know they don't know how to act.
Here's two relatively small airlines that are both AFA. HP only has, what, 2500 F/As? US has 10,000 on the list, but in the next year or so it will look more like 8000.
There are commuters from the west coast as PSA/US had bases in LAX, SFO, and SAN, but alot of them are gone or going. There would not be a mass exodus to the desert as people predict. And surely there are HP people who would like to come to the northeast or the south, or just do different types of flying.
UA- AFA, but throws fits at the DOH rule when merger talk happens. Not to mention they are about twice the size of U.
CO, NW- Different union, not good
DL- Non-union
AA- We all know they don't know how to act.
Here's two relatively small airlines that are both AFA. HP only has, what, 2500 F/As? US has 10,000 on the list, but in the next year or so it will look more like 8000.
There are commuters from the west coast as PSA/US had bases in LAX, SFO, and SAN, but alot of them are gone or going. There would not be a mass exodus to the desert as people predict. And surely there are HP people who would like to come to the northeast or the south, or just do different types of flying.
WestCoastGuy
Veteran
- Jun 27, 2004
- 813
- 0
Light Years said:
Surely your joking......
....... 
Travelpro72
Veteran
- Jan 30, 2005
- 4,964
- 455
This is all incredibly stupid. Regardless of what HP's ceo has said the contract you ratified there is done. The contract we ratified or should I say was forced on us is done. Date of hire is going to be how this works. When you work in an industry for a company that lives by seniority that is the risk you take. Someone mentioned above that there will not be a mad exodus to the the west. Can we not turn this into a West Coast - East Coast war like the rap music business did in the past. Although HP has a dollar or two more than US (not actual for the smart a**es), they are NEVER going to stand alone without US and US will not stand alone without HP. As stated above by someone, who would HP prefer to merge with? It's scary to think of either carrier merging with any other carrier. This marriage of the two is going to take some time. When it starts to gain momentum this company will be tough to ignore. It is LIGHT YEARS ahead in restructuring and realizing the face of the new industry on the horizon. The other so called World players like AA, UA, DL, CO and NW will be drowning using the cup to get rid of the water from their boats. NW is getting a really good crew from US. God help you all with those dandies. We are going to be a really great airline filled with great employees. Corny?, maybe but it's true. The afa group here at US has ALWAYS been fair with seniority and it will STAY that way. NO other way will happen that is for sure.
hp_fa
Veteran
- Feb 19, 2004
- 3,290
- 178
Us/boston said:
We don't need to merge. We can continue running a very happy airline that is putting out the third best quarterly statment of any of the majors. We trail WN ans JetBlue. That's it. Everyone else is worse off then we are.
If things don't change, U will be out of business in less then three years. America West will still be there.
BTW, go tell GE, Air Canada, Airbus and the unsequred creditors that you don't want to deal with America West because they do think that straight DOH provides them unfairness considering their current job expectincies as compared to those of U. See how much your partners like you then.
The America West team has done much right and they should not be expected to just hand over their work to outsiders who claim the work is theirs because of seniority.
I'm standing with Doug Parker on this and I believe he is standing with me. Who are you standing with?
(Sorry if this rambled, I need to be asleep, but sleep isn't coming right now.)
EyeInTheSky
Veteran
I think everyone just needs to chill. This thing is far from done and there's a lot of work to be done if it does indeed come to fruition. Believe me, there are a lot of people hoping both these airlines fail -- you don't want to contribute to that thought, do you?
EyeInTheSky
Veteran
aafsc said:
Why are you on the US Airways board? I find it AAmAAzing how AArogAAnt some AAirline employees AAre.
xoxo said:My 2 cents.....We need each other. U needs AWA more right now, because I think that in about a year, AWA would not be doing so well standing alone. Yes, AWA has money, but, they are burning through it. . We all have seen what U's managment team has accomplished in the past 5 years or more. I hope this all works out and AFA and ALPA is fair (abides by the contracts).
MY 2 CENTS
[post="270768"][/post]
i see now...how ignorant of me...........the real reason is acutely clear.....two loser airlines merge , both with high cash burn rates......obviously they both have cost structure problems......get some idiot to back their loss's up with a float....merge....some drastic cost reductions are needed by both parties......anyone say outsource???
the distant glow of light at the end of the tunnel has most blinded.....the train will run us over shortly i guarantee you.
Travelpro72
Veteran
- Jan 30, 2005
- 4,964
- 455
This whole AA/TW thing comes up all too often. When you read replies from them you can always tell who the AA people are and who the TW people are. One thing if anything we can say here at US is that the f/a group has NEVER been unfair with seniority. E V E R ! ! ! ! As for not merging, HP may be doing "OK" but not great. US is definately not doing well with trying to get out of BK. Does HP honestly think that they are going to last without a merger. If you don't want this merger with US then you definately should listen to the ex TW folks because thats what will happen to you if another carrier comes after your tiny airline. Tiny in respect to the size of the other majors. HP may have held their own against SW but how much longer will that last? HONESTLY? Everyone is worried about the senior mommas at US. Well, I just started my 8th year and there are many at HP that are senior to me. If anyone at HP is not happy about the seniority thing then why did HP f/a's agree to DOH in your own contract? Surely the f/a group didn't assume that if a merger ever happened that all negotiated on both sides would be thrown out the window. We on both sides have negotiated protections for a reason. I can honestly say that each month my seniority number has climbed over 100 people. The senior ones are leaving. They just offered the 500 to leave in Jun, Sept and dec. 852 applied. Proof enough? When the lists are put together by both sides then you will see where you fall. IF the HP f/a group thinks its unfair then do they think it is fair to disregard the US f/a's seniority then? Nobody is saving anyone but merging to be stronger. There is alot of unanswered questions on both sides. Relax. We US f/a's are in bk don't you think WE are a little unnerved? You guys have been there and should know. We'll all be one big family soon regardless of what we all think so..... Happy flying to all.
