Gun Threads - Merged
- Thread starter Kev3188
- Start date
- Banned
- #228
Dude said liberals didn't found the country
History says they did
Yes, I understand the difference, and that the current lexicon equates Republican with Conservative and Democrat with Liberal. That is obvious.
Fact is, the Republican Party and its candidates have not acted in accordqnce with the Conservatism they are selling, and the Liberals of today are not anymore the uninformed lazy unproductive immoral takers that you and others label them than your "conservative" buds are.
Fact is, almost certainly you and the rest of the gang are in fact and deed every bit the socialist that I or Tree or anyone else on this board is. If (any of...) you have ever accepted a dime of unemployment, disability, retraining, first-time homebuyer's, guranteed student loan or education grant, SBA, claimed EITC or received any other financial assistance then you are in deed more of a practicing socialist than I am.
So far...
Wanna' discuss positions?
Fine
Disagree?
Fine
Wanna' label liberals, progressives, free-thinkers, or anyone who doesn't follow your (collective...) right wing messagers' direction as libtards, weak, uninformed, lazy, unpatriotic or any of the other utter BS that is common here, and someone, possibly me, is going to throw it right back at ya'.
Mostly because it is entertaining, but partly because you deserve it.
Ueah, I do know who Alinsky is. No, never read his stuff.
History says they did
Yes, I understand the difference, and that the current lexicon equates Republican with Conservative and Democrat with Liberal. That is obvious.
Fact is, the Republican Party and its candidates have not acted in accordqnce with the Conservatism they are selling, and the Liberals of today are not anymore the uninformed lazy unproductive immoral takers that you and others label them than your "conservative" buds are.
Fact is, almost certainly you and the rest of the gang are in fact and deed every bit the socialist that I or Tree or anyone else on this board is. If (any of...) you have ever accepted a dime of unemployment, disability, retraining, first-time homebuyer's, guranteed student loan or education grant, SBA, claimed EITC or received any other financial assistance then you are in deed more of a practicing socialist than I am.
So far...
Wanna' discuss positions?
Fine
Disagree?
Fine
Wanna' label liberals, progressives, free-thinkers, or anyone who doesn't follow your (collective...) right wing messagers' direction as libtards, weak, uninformed, lazy, unpatriotic or any of the other utter BS that is common here, and someone, possibly me, is going to throw it right back at ya'.
Mostly because it is entertaining, but partly because you deserve it.
Ueah, I do know who Alinsky is. No, never read his stuff.
Indeed.Ifly2 said:
Not sure what happened to my post, but
Was sifting through this and I do agree with you,
The Republican Party , today, is not conservative, Ted Cruz is the most conservative, and that's the reason he has been under attack from all sides, including the establish,net republicans.
But back to the liberal, progressive thing, I don't recall you initially separating the founders ideas from modern day liberal progressives .
In fact, you seemed to lump them all together, couldn't be farther from what is real.
The article posted a few posts up lays it out about as well as you can.
- Banned
- #232
Thank you
I didn't seperate them
I also did not say they were the same
I said liberals founded the country on liberal ideas, and that a great many of the good thimgs we take for granted were the result of liberal thinking, struggle, effort, sacrifice and often death.
I am not a supporter of the "welfare state" realm of the modern liberal, and not heartless. I would buy a guy a line and hook and bait, but not just give him a fish everyday forever, to over-simplify. That said, sometimes, a dude just needs a fish.
I am aghast at the mindless name-calling, ignorance of history, and defense of ridiculous, narrow-minded and unAmerican ideas and ideals in the "name" of conservatism that is prevalent among the Right Wing Media Republican so-called "conservatives", and I call it out.
I didn't seperate them
I also did not say they were the same
I said liberals founded the country on liberal ideas, and that a great many of the good thimgs we take for granted were the result of liberal thinking, struggle, effort, sacrifice and often death.
I am not a supporter of the "welfare state" realm of the modern liberal, and not heartless. I would buy a guy a line and hook and bait, but not just give him a fish everyday forever, to over-simplify. That said, sometimes, a dude just needs a fish.
I am aghast at the mindless name-calling, ignorance of history, and defense of ridiculous, narrow-minded and unAmerican ideas and ideals in the "name" of conservatism that is prevalent among the Right Wing Media Republican so-called "conservatives", and I call it out.
Ok, so you say they are not the same, then , in the next sentence you attach struggle, effort and sacrifice to liberals of today?Ifly2 said:
What part of struggle, effort and sacrifice is involved with receiving welfare, food stamps and free healthcare while popping out illegitimate kids?
Our founders and framers were not called liberals and progressives back when they were writing the constitution , those labels came latter, but they have zero to do with liberals and progressives today.
I'm also aghast at the name calling, which you participated in, along with the revisionist history.
Maybe you'll now stop doing both.
You spoke of The Enlightenment, as if the liberals and Progressives of today have ownership of it.
The framers used it to build our government and the Constitution.
Your all time favorite Progressive, aside from BHO, Woodrow Wilson, Rejected The Enlightenment and gave birth to the idea that The Constitution is a "living breathing" document, meant to be changed.
Today's liberals and BHO agree and are actively re writing it right before our eyes.
The framers would turn in their grave to such an idea.
So no, you don't get to attach today's ultra liberals and Progressives to the framers and founders of the country.
https://online.hillsdale.edu/document.doc?id=313
- Banned
- #235
"What part of struggle, effort and sacrifice is involved with receiving welfare, food stamps and free healthcare while popping out illegitimate kids"
Plenty of "conservatives" and right wing republican voters do those things too
Maybe even more than "libs" and dem voters, in most southern states
Back then, the founders were called traitors
The ideas were lineral and progressive, and were referred to as such in the loyalist and Tory writings of the time, with disdain, and derogatory/perjorative connotations and the rest. Eerily like today's political "discourse".
Plenty of "conservatives" and right wing republican voters do those things too
Maybe even more than "libs" and dem voters, in most southern states
Back then, the founders were called traitors
The ideas were lineral and progressive, and were referred to as such in the loyalist and Tory writings of the time, with disdain, and derogatory/perjorative connotations and the rest. Eerily like today's political "discourse".
- Banned
- #237
If you do not believe that the constitution can be changed, I guess you missed the Amendment process it contains and all the subsequent amendmants.
If you do not believe thst its apolication can change to suit the times, I guess you support dismantling the large standi g federal army, and returning that finction to the states and control of the governors, as spelled out explicitly in the constitution.
Things do change.
The constitution, practically speaking, must allow for that
Most people support that, when they agree with it
When they don't, it is suddenly wrong
If you do not believe thst its apolication can change to suit the times, I guess you support dismantling the large standi g federal army, and returning that finction to the states and control of the governors, as spelled out explicitly in the constitution.
Things do change.
The constitution, practically speaking, must allow for that
Most people support that, when they agree with it
When they don't, it is suddenly wrong
- Banned
- #240
Traymark said:
That quite obviously didn't happen either.
Do you always believe such poopy cock, or are you just funnin' us?
Again
Sylvan can help with the whole reading comprehension thing
I never, as you claim, equated the struggles of past liberals with today's welfare state
Today's struggles for equality, equal treatment, etc are ntl real, though less bloody, mostly, and liberals are still at the forefront of effort to make positive change that benefits society, and the people, while conservatives still embrace the status quo and resist progress
