Get Ready

[Wretched Wrench]

........ as soon as any policy is abused, it gets terminated.

Yeah, dang shame. Easy and cheap in the short run, but costs the company a lot in the long run. Irreparable damage.

.

 

[Garfield1966]

Yeah, dang shame. Easy and cheap in the short run, but costs the company a lot in the long run. Irreparable damage.

.

Not quite sure I understood your point. Could you explain?

 

[Bear96]

If your going on the ramp and seeing 3 people work and 10 play dominoes it is their 30 minute lunch which they are by law entitled to. I know, it's a shame they are allowed to sit for 30 minutes your non union job has forced you to go all these yrs without a lunch or break. Which I see resulted in to much kool aid drinking. I guess we must also blame the Department of Labor for setting some protection for the workers.

Some have gone to the DOL but to no luck, as they just look the other way.

BTW, it's the law that if you work for more then 6 hours straight you must have a break.

For the record, there is no federal law requiring that workers get breaks of any sort. It's a matter of employer policy and/or a contract.

 

[DFWCC]

For the record, there is no federal law requiring that workers get breaks of any sort. It's a matter of employer policy and/or a contract.

Although there may not be a federal law. I beleive many states have laws that require a min 15min break every 4 hrs.

 

[Bear96]

Other than -- maybe -- CA, I don't think that is the case either. But if you could provide some proof I will stand corrected.

 

[Skymess]

Other than -- maybe -- CA, I don't think that is the case either. But if you could provide some proof I will stand corrected.

New York state labor laws require a lunch break and an additional 15 minute break on an 8 hour day.

 

[AMFAMAN]

For the record, there is no federal law requiring that workers get breaks of any sort. It's a matter of employer policy and/or a contract.

Meal periods was one of the original arguments on this thread and they are not only federally required, but also have many addittion state rules.

http://www.dol.gov/dol/allcfr/Title_29/Par...29CFR785.19.htm

(a) Bona fide meal periods. Bona fide meal periods are not worktime.
Bona
fide meal periods do not include coffee breaks or time for snacks. These
are rest periods. The employee must be completely relieved from duty for
the purposes of eating regular meals. Ordinarily 30 minutes or more is
long enough for a bona fide meal period. A shorter period may be long
enough under special conditions. The employee is not relieved if he is
required to perform any duties, whether active or inactive, while
eating. For example, an office employee who is required to eat at his
desk or a factory worker who is required to be at his machine is working
while eating. (Culkin v. Glenn L. Martin, Nebraska Co., 97 F. Supp. 661
(D. Neb. 1951), aff'd 197 F. 2d 981 (C.A. 8, 1952), cert. denied 344
U.S. 888 (1952); Thompson v. Stock & Sons, Inc., 93 F. Supp. 213 (E.D.
Mich 1950), aff'd 194 F. 2d 493 (C.A. 6, 1952); Biggs v. Joshua Hendy
Corp., 183 F. 2d 515 (C. A. 9, 1950), 187 F. 2d 447 (C.A. 9, 1951);
Walling v. Dunbar Transfer & Storage Co., 3 W.H. Cases 284; 7 Labor
Cases para. 61.565 (W.D. Tenn. 1943); Lofton v. Seneca Coal and Coke
Co., 2 W.H. Cases 669; 6 Labor Cases para. 61,271 (N.D. Okla. 1942);
aff'd 136 F. 2d 359 (C.A. 10, 1943); cert. denied 320 U.S. 772 (1943);
Mitchell v. Tampa Cigar Co., 36 Labor Cases para. 65, 198, 14 W.H. Cases
38 (S.D. Fla. 1959); Douglass v. Hurwitz Co., 145 F. Supp. 29, 13 W.H.
Cases (E.D. Pa. 1956))
(B) Where no permission to leave premises. It is not necessary that
an employee be permitted to leave the premises if he is otherwise
completely freed from duties during the meal period.

States rules...Texas for this example. Breaks not required but meal period refer to the DOL. C.F.R. 785.19 posted above.

http://www.twc.state.tx.us/news/efte/d_breaks.html

Breaks are a common source of confusion for employers. As noted toward the beginning of this paper, the FLSA does not require employers to give breaks during the workday, but if breaks are given, certain rules apply. Rest or coffee breaks, defined as 20 minutes or less, are compensable hours worked under 29 C.F.R. 785.18, since they are regarded as being for the benefit of both the employer and the employee. Meal breaks, on the other hand, are not compensable, as long as they are at least 30 minutes in length and the employee is "completely relieved from duty for the purpose of eating a regular meal" (see 29 C.F.R. 785.19). Shorter meal breaks may be considered valid under special circumstances. The most frequent pitfall for employers is thinking that employees have true meal breaks if they are allowed to eat at their desks while answering phones, opening mail, sorting files, and so on. Such duties performed while trying to eat will render the time spent during the meal break compensable. Employers may control unauthorized work during meal breaks by the disciplinary process.

For other states --check this link...

http://www.boli.state.or.us/BOLI/WHD/W_Links.shtml

 

[Bear96]

Your interpretation is not correct. You are citing regs that DEFINE "bona fide meal periods," NOT saying that they are required. In fact, the TX regs you cite specifically state that "the FLSA [Fair Labor Standards Act -- the legislation that covers such topics] does NOT require employers to give breaks during the work day" (emphasis added).

One of the most confusing aspects of FLSA compliance is what counts as "compensable time" -- i.e, when is the employee "on the clock" even though she is not actually doing the specific task she was hired to do. A confusing area is the area of breaks. This is what the TX regs you quoted are explaining. Some types of breaks count as compensable time; some do not. The regs are saying only that a bona fide meal period is not compensable time.

What is NOT confusing is whether breaks are required or not (they are not). The confusion comes in as to whether an employee must be paid for being on a "break." That is governed by what exactly is going on during the break period. The reg you cite simply says that in order for an employer to not have to pay the employee for a meal break period, it must be a "bona fide" meal period. That is, "The employee must be completely relieved from duty for the purposes of eating regular meals" in order to not be paid.

The employer is NOT required to provide a bona fide meal period, that is, to "completely relieve [the employee] from duty for the purpose of eating regular meals." The rules only require that IF the employee is not "completely relieved from duty," she must be paid for that time.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

Then why not work an 8 hour day with no lunch period.
AArogant Airlines doesnt pay us for the lunch any way so why not just do 8 and leave.
I recall the 8 hour day being a strike issue 2 contracts back.

 

[Garfield1966]

Then why not work an 8 hour day with no lunch period.
AArogant Airlines doesnt pay us for the lunch any way so why not just do 8 and leave.
I recall the 8 hour day being a strike issue 2 contracts back.

That's what we do at Crew Skd. But our shifts are set for that. We have 3 hour shifts, no specified lunch breaks or rest breaks. We eat at our desk and run to the rest room when call loads are light or get our partner to cover our desk when we are gone. During OSO or other high call volume periods, we sometimes do not get a chance to eat.

 

[Skymess]

That's what we do at Crew Skd. But our shifts are set for that. We have 3 hour shifts, no specified lunch breaks or rest breaks. We eat at our desk and run to the rest room when call loads are light or get our partner to cover our desk when we are gone. During OSO or other high call volume periods, we sometimes do not get a chance to eat.

Garfield. What are the shift periods? I called yesterday between 610 and 710 your time and the schedulers were grumpy and harried. Is that typically the end or the beginning of a shift?

 

[operaations]

0600-1400
0700-1500
1400-2200
1500-2300

these are the start times...yes it is busy first thing with the numbers being counted to see if the operation can handle PVD'S and Mini Leave

to see if option II will be needed . But no one should ever be rude it is our job to answer the phone and to be professional at all times.

 

[jimntx]

Your interpretation is not correct. You are citing regs that DEFINE "bona fide meal periods," NOT saying that they are required. In fact, the TX regs you cite specifically state that "the FLSA [Fair Labor Standards Act -- the legislation that covers such topics] does NOT require employers to give breaks during the work day" (emphasis added).

Now you are misinterpreting, Bear. FLSA defines breaks--rest or coffee breaks as being a respite from work of 20 minutes or less. And, it says that those breaks because they are to the benefit of both the employer and the employee must be compensed. It goes on to say that a meal break which the regs say should be at least 30 minutes long to be so considered are not compensable if the employee is not required to do any work during the period and is not required to take said break while sitting at the work station. The section quoted is simply drawing a distinction between "coffee" breaks and meal breaks and the conditions under which an employer could choose not to compense that time.

THE FLSA has been around a long time. I dealt with it frequently when I worked for the Texas Employment Commission. And, once again before anyone starts saying that it is different in Texas, the state employment services are state agencies in name, payscales, and benefits alone. They are mandated under Federal law passed during the Depression and are operated primarily under Federal law and regulations. States can ADD to the benefits or services, but they can not take away or fail to provide any service mandated under Federal law. For that matter, in most states--Texas included--the state does not even fund the agency. The funding comes from the Federal government.

The airline management's "gotcha" that you are all missing is the fact that we are not generally covered under the FLSA. As airline employees we are covered under the Railway Labor Act. Part of that act specifically states that other Federal/state labor laws do not apply to companies covered under this act if they contradict anything in the RLA. IIRC, the RLA does not require a meal break of any kind for anyone.

A lot o the impetus of the RLA was to squash the budding unions among railway Pullman workers who were all black. It's why flight attendants and pilots are not paid while the plane sits at the gate with the door open. Many years ago, the railroads got the courts to agree that Pullman porters were not really working while the train was in the station, and therefore did not have to be paid during that time. Somewhere along the way, airlines got the courts to apply this rule to flight attendants and pilots.

Now, go back and re-read Chapters 7-11. The quiz will be on Monday.

 

[Skymess]

0600-1400
0700-1500
1400-2200
1500-2300

these are the start times...yes it is busy first thing with the numbers being counted to see if the operation can handle PVD'S and Mini Leave

to see if option II will be needed . But no one should ever be rude it is our job to answer the phone and to be professional at all times.

Not quite rude. Just not very helpful.

I can understand to a certain extent the annoyance when the pursers call and ask to do trip trades that should be automatically red in open time.

It is kind of annoying that I have to call scheduling to assist with a trip trade so I can understand if you are busy doing all of the other tasks that assisting with trip trades is a little irritating.

The problem is when I have a legitimate problem and am told that it is a computer glitch. I understand that the computer has glitches but overrides are possible when the computer doesn't recognize something that is erroneous.

 

[Garfield1966]

Garfield. What are the shift periods? I called yesterday between 610 and 710 your time and the schedulers were grumpy and harried. Is that typically the end or the beginning of a shift?

Depends on the base. MIA/DCA and LGA/BOS today desks start at 5a The futue deask start 1 hour later. DFW and ORD start at 6a/7a for today/future IMA, IDF, JFK and IOR start at 6a/7a. STL is a 7a/8a start. In the AM for the future desk they are running numbers and trying tofigure out where they stand. The today desk are clearing out all the stuff the midnights are not able to do. I did morning s for several years and never cared for it (I'm not a mornig person).

If you are calling on a non critical item, best to call around 9a or so. If you call at 12n local base time or 4p local base time, it's not a good time. We are running make up. Other than that it's hit an miss. Then again, you might have just caught a skd who was just pissed off. Who knows.