Five escorted out in TUL

[TWU informer]

So these guys had a meeting about AMP and then were terminated later in the shift?

 

[Tex-Mech]

So these guys had a meeting about AMP and then were terminated later in the shift?

So the union busting campaign begins by AA as it once again tries to protect its toy union.

 

[Large Grey]

Word has it five guys were walked out from hangar 6A (July 29th@ 3:15am) for nodding off while on standby until their plane arrived.
Word also has it two of the crew chiefs were written up the night before because management said the crew took to long to complete an aircraft.
Anyone confirm this ?

This too shall pass. The CO. maggot who walked them out will end up losing his bonus and the accused will have several days off with pay.

 

[Tex-Mech]

FYI...Hearing this is a bunch of BS about it being AMP related. Talked to a few in a Tulsa and they said it was cleaners sleeping.

 

[Big Bear]

Been on the phone most the day and I talked with all 5 involved.
Barfbag, for your information 4 of the 5 have second jobs and the 5th has three.
They all feel this was in retaliation from a vengeful supervisor.
The previous day they were told they weren't allowed to take their breaks (Sup said breaks were up to AA discretion) and management kept changing their lunch times.
I know per contract management can change lunch no sooner than 3hrs before beginning of shift and no later than 5hrs.
They said the Sup. was changing lunches on a daily basis, telling the crew before their start time what their assignments were, and was cussing the day before because they all turned down overtime. They were also told that if they didn't start working the minute their shift started that their clock in and out times would change to benefit management. I have talked with this sup. and he is a wack job that previously held an A/C cleaner position w/ no A&P.
They also said they tried to call an e-board member to no avail.
A couple months ago it was voted in that e-board members were to man the grievance hall (on base) 24/7. Unfortunately some e-boarders have took it upon themselves to use call forwarding to their personal phones at the house therefore no e-board was present or available.
All these men have families and are obviously hard working professionals. Considering the heat, working two & three jobs and no aircraft in the hangar, it was 3am..how could a sane Sup walk 5 out for accidentally nodding off on standby ?
They all were upright in their chairs and not nesting as the rules explain.

were the 5 walked out AMT's or Aircraft Cleaners?

 

[Duke787]

People are human, if someone is standing by and they nod off its no big deal , I've been told the FAA, in thier efforts to address fatigue, has information that indicates its benificial towards safety. We may see the company back off on this, it only makes sense, they only started cracking down on this recently, probably due to the fact that despite FAA regulations other departments are having more and more of a say in how maintenence is run. For decades it has been a widely, although not explicitely, accepted practice throughout most of the industry, union and non-union alike.

If two guys are standing by, and one is reading the newspaper or watching TV and the other nods off who is more productive? A short nap has benifits, namely a recharged individual. Fire Departmnets recognized this years ago.

The policy is for management to wake the person and give them a CR1 advising them that Nodding off is a violation of company policy.

The fact is that all of us have taken a hit, granted we didnt have much of a cushion but from what Ive heard mechanics in places like DFW and TUL have also resorted to taking second jobs as well in order to maintain the standard they were used to. Fatigue is becoming more and more of an issue as real wages decline.

Hopefully common sense will prevail if what has been said here is true.

What dream world do you live in where sleeping at work is OK, it's people like you that give union's a bad name! Times are tough, but if you can't make it in Texas or OK, on $75+ a year, you don't know how to manage your money.

 

[Duke787]

I remember being in the hospital maternity ward waiting for my children to be born. We were there overnight each time with children born in the morning. I remember passing the doctors' lounge throughout the night and seeing several doctors in a dead sleep. They were on call waiting to be called into action at a moments' notice.
I didn't know what each of their specialties were, but guess what??????????? WHO CARES? LET THEM SLEEP IF THEY HAD NOTHING TO DO.....
And guess what? they were sleeping with the TV on all night...You think they should've be disciplined? Or don't you consider the AMA a union?


It's one thing if a person was in a hiding spot with his pajamas on and wearing eye shades holding his favorite teddy bear...There should be discipline in that case.
But it is another thing to be sitting in a chair in a room full of people and nodding off at 3 am.

Let me ask you this, FACTS....
When you are done with your job assignment, do you go running to your superior and ask for something else to do?

Congrats on your children, but you are NOT a doctor. You are a mechanic who works 8 hr shifts. If Big mac is correct I don't see why they won't get their jobs back. Those guys need to decide which job is more important to them and keep that one. If you can't live in TUL on 75k+ you don't know how to manage your money.

 

[Hopeful]

Congrats on your children, but you are NOT a doctor. You are a mechanic who works 8 hr shifts. If Big mac is correct I don't see why they won't get their jobs back. Those guys need to decide which job is more important to them and keep that one. If you can't live in TUL on 75k+ you don't know how to manage your money.

Thanks for the well wishes, but my kids were born a looooong time ago.
You missed my point about using the doctor as an example.

Although I am not comparing a mechanic to a doctor, the argument is similar.
At a line station during the course of the DAY, mechanics are staffed mainly to address crew complaints, inbound pireps, FA calls, line cargo calls, cabin service calls, fueler calls....CALLS CALLS CALLS...
Guess what? if there are no CALLS, we wait until there is a CALL...

YOU KNOW, LIKE A DOCTOR AT A HOSPITAL ON CALL!

And also during the course of the day, they might schedule work and there are MPMs to be accomplished. Either way, the mechanic is doing the work that is required of him/her during the course of the shift.

If you would like to beg for work after finishing your assignments, go right ahead and maybe you can load bags, clean toilets, and sweep floors.
More power to you.

 

[BigMac]

These 5 were A/C cleaners making an average of 12 dollars an hour.
Not near the $75+ I seen in an earlier post.
So how does one determine which job is more important..mowing lawns for 50 bucks a lawn but no insurance, making 10 an hour at McDonald's part time w/ no insurance or working for AA as an A/C cleaner for 12 an hour with high cost insurance?
Can anyone live with one job @ 12 an hour? This is the reason they had two and three jobs. Some of these guys have A&P's that were affected by 9/11 and are awaiting recalls making no license premiums like the affected A&P's in the OSM position.

 

[Just the facts]

"So how does one determine which job is more important?"... Umm... Let me think... I would choose the one which will pay me while sleeping.

Cry me a river. Times are tough all over. We've all been hammered after 9/11. The union which is so frequently bad mouthed on these board will likely get their jobs back and all will be back to normal.

 

[737823]

The company shouldn't tolerate non-sense like this and I applaud their efforts. Union members seem to think they are better than everyone else and should be graced by the company for the menial work they perform. Just because you have scope and clauses in your contract doesn't mean you can't be held accountable for your actions, but I realize that is tough for union members to fathom. They'll be able to replace these jokers in no time.

Josh

 

[Hopeful]

The company shouldn't tolerate non-sense like this and I applaud their efforts. Union members seem to think they are better than everyone else and should be graced by the company for the menial work they perform. Just because you have scope and clauses in your contract doesn't mean you can't be held accountable for your actions, but I realize that is tough for union members to fathom. They'll be able to replace these jokers in no time.

Josh

Explain "menial" work!

Not sure what you do, but people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

No one is justifying sleeping on the job, but any medical professional will tell you that human beings are not nocturnal creatures.
If a person dozes off at 3 am while sitting at a break table after he had his DINNER AT 3AM, DOES NOT MEAN HIS INTENT WAS TO GO TO SLEEP.

No matter how much coffee and other caffeine drinks you ingest into your body, biology determines when it is sleep time.
Having said that, like I already stated, if someone goes out of their way to find a sleeping area, puts the PJs on along with sleeping shades....THAT IS INTENTIONAL AND THEREFORE BREACH OF THE RULES.

But stop your holier than though attitude where all union people think it is their GOD given rights to sleep.

Don't you think pilots "doze" off on long hauls? Flight Attendants?

How about managers who are lucky enough to have private offices with doors who tell their secretaries they are not to be disturbed....You think they sneak a nap in here and there????????????

OF COURSE NOT, ONLY UNION WORKERS!

 

[737823]

As stated upthread it appears they were cleaners.
Straight from Merriam Webster dictionary: (adjective) b : lacking interest or dignity <a menial task>

If the subject workers were mechanics (please pardon me if I'm not using the politically correct term) I wouldn't have made that reference. Besides sowing off on the job is the single biggest testament to how little interest and pride they take in the work they perform!

And yes, your "brothers and sisters" DO sleep while on-duty whether on contractually permissible flights with designated crewrest areas or like several weeks ago on AA 276 LAX-MIA.

Josh




People in the professional world (I work in financial services) do not dose off while working and our duties are work hours are less defined and provide a greater degree of variance than typically found in a union shop.

 

[The Goose]

As stated upthread it appears they were cleaners.
Straight from Merriam Webster dictionary: (adjective) b : lacking interest or dignity <a menial task>

If the subject workers were mechanics (please pardon me if I'm not using the politically correct term) I wouldn't have made that reference. Besides sowing off on the job is the single biggest testament to how little interest and pride they take in the work they perform!

And yes, your "brothers and sisters" DO sleep while on-duty whether on contractually permissible flights with designated crewrest areas or like several weeks ago on AA 276 LAX-MIA.

Josh




People in the professional world (I work in financial services) do not dose off while working and our duties are work hours are less defined and provide a greater degree of variance than typically found in a union shop.

I'm happy to hear the worthless Yuppies and other cubicle-dwelling business types are so perfect in all respects. Perhaps you should consider finding other entertainment than mixing it up with we Helots and others of those who actually get their hands dirty in the course of a day - then again, I'm sure you get a feeling of superiority with each of your keystrokes as you post here proclaiming your supposed perfection.

You and your type should be rather grateful that we who actually work for a living aren't in charge of lightning bolts.

Talk down to someone else - try your boss.

 

[The Goose]

These 5 were A/C cleaners making an average of 12 dollars an hour.
Not near the $75+ I'd seen in an earlier post.
... snip

{extreme sarcasm}
Didn't you know, Mac? All of we nasty union boys make more than the top executives and drive our respective companies to financial ruin. What the hell is wrong with you today? Are you intentionally omitting these facts?

I'm really surprised at you, not knowing this "fact" and all. I'm sure those cleaners actually make over $200/hour but the office boys are being lied to about that, also.
{/extreme sarcasm}