Cutting Flights In Pit

[USA320Pilot]

According to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, "the 911th at Pittsburgh International Airport is an Air Force Reserve wing that flies the C-130 tactical airlifter. The 911th has been based in Moon since 1942 but didn't begin flying the C-130 until 1980."

"Currently, 1,220 Air Force reservists are assigned to the base, at which 320 civilians also work. The Air Force expects that closing the base will eliminate 44 military and 278 civilian jobs, at a cost to the local economy of about $93.6 million each year," the newspaper reported.

The local cuts "are not welcome news for a region already hit hard" by US Airways layoffs, Rep. Tim Murphy, R-Upper St. Clair, said at a news conference yesterday with Rep. Melissa Hart, R-Bradford Woods.

See Story

USA320Pilot comments: It is not helpful for PIT, the ACAA, and Western PA to lose the base, about 1,500 jobs, and almost $100 million per year to the local economy.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[delldude]

well you know we're getting used to getting porked around here by other famous named corporations...so uncle sam is just another nome de plume on the resume for the greater pittsburgh area.

 

[calibrator]

According to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, "the 911th at Pittsburgh International Airport is an Air Force Reserve wing that flies the C-130 tactical airlifter. The 911th has been based in Moon since 1942 but didn't begin flying the C-130 until 1980."

"Currently, 1,220 Air Force reservists are assigned to the base, at which 320 civilians also work. The Air Force expects that closing the base will eliminate 44 military and 278 civilian jobs, at a cost to the local economy of about $93.6 million each year," the newspaper reported.

The local cuts "are not welcome news for a region already hit hard" by US Airways layoffs, Rep. Tim Murphy, R-Upper St. Clair, said at a news conference yesterday with Rep. Melissa Hart, R-Bradford Woods.

See Story

USA320Pilot comments: It is not helpful for PIT, the ACAA, and Western PA to lose the base, about 1,500 jobs, and almost $100 million per year to the local economy.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

[post="269487"][/post]​

No way in hell will it be 100 million!!!

I think it asinine the way the politicians are clamoring about the base closings when years past thousand upon thousands lost their jobs when just about the entire manufacturing sector and then many others followed leaving the Pittsburgh region decimated in debt with drive by's and drug dealing becoming the norm. Then you have Ricky the moron and Miss north hills coming on the radio telling everyone it will be ok. It’s a long way from ok around the Burgh and has been for a long time, I know I lived it out and saw the story.

Pilot man you love to throw fuel to the fires calling yourself the messenger when all you are really doing is filling some sick need to be noticed and loved or some such weird thing. Pittsburgh will go on like all the other cities in the nation that have been raped by corporate America and the only thing that will change is changing everywhere, the once middle class vanishing. Welcome to the Hood Bro and pray it doesn't invade your space the way it's growing thanks to the Jerry Glasses of the world.

 

[MarkMyWords]

Curt -

Why are you getting all up in A320's face about this. Those are the figures being reported in the news here locally. That is not A320's estimated local economy impact.

Wasn't your last post supposed to be a few days ago.....

 

[BoeingBoy]

Here's what the official 911th site says....

"ECONOMIC IMPACT: The wing budget for salaries and operating expenses exceeds $34 million annually, including $16 million in civilian salaries, $7 million in operating expenses, and $11 million in reservists payroll and travel. Facilities construction has added $30 million in recent years to the area economy. The 911th overall economic impact is estimated at $64 million annually."

Now you'd think that someone who "spent 13 years in the 911th AW" would understand that not all that economic impact is on the local community.

For example:
"Over 90 percent of the organization is made up of Air Force Reserve volunteers from Pennsylvania, Ohio and West Virginia." So how much of the out of state reservists pay is spent locally? Flight crews, especially, are famous for commuting to their reserve base.

Don't get me wrong. Potential loss of jobs is not a good thing for any community. I just wonder if the loss, if it ever occurs, won't be more than offset by something else - like WN's buildup in PIT for example.

Instead of worrying about the loss of the 911th, I suspect of more concern to those who participate here is whether US will have a presence in PIT in a couple of years. Even with all the cutbacks, that could have a bigger impact locally.

Jim

 

[MarkMyWords]

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05134/504652.stm

The 911th at Pittsburgh International Airport is an Air Force Reserve wing that flies the C-130 tactical airlifter. The 911th has been based in Moon since 1942 but didn't begin flying the C-130 until 1980.

Currently, 1,220 Air Force reservists are assigned to the base, at which 320 civilians also work. The Air Force expects that closing the base will eliminate 44 military and 278 civilian jobs, at a cost to the local economy of about $93.6 million each year.

 

[calibrator]

Curt -

Why are you getting all up in A320's face about this. Those are the figures being reported in the news here locally. That is not A320's estimated local economy impact.

Wasn't your last post supposed to be a few days ago.....

[post="269504"][/post]​

You want my phone number? Are you gay? Do you have feelings for me?

My Love---Curtis

 

[MarkMyWords]

I'm just saying......you've had at least 7 final postings already, but you keep coming back for more. What do you feel you really contribute to the conversations here?

 

[BoeingBoy]

Ok, let's really get into the data (since newspapers always get it right, don't they?)....

From the official Base Realignment and Closure 2005 documents:

Direct job losses in the Pittsburgh MSA due to the 911th closure:
44 military/278 civilian - all others will be reassigned within the Pittsburgh MSA.

Indirect job losses in the Pittsburgh MSA due to the 911th closure:
258* civilian

Total expected job losses in the Pittsburgh MSA due to the 911th closure:
580* jobs

Not quite the 1500 or so that the Post-Gazette reported.

Now for the narrative of the effect of closing the 911th and relocating the planes to Pope AFB.

"Assuming no economic recovery, this recommendation could result in a maximum potential reduction of 581* jobs (322 direct jobs and 259* indirect jobs) over the 2006-2011 period in the Pittsburgh, PA, Metropolitan Statistical economic area, which is less than 0.1 percent of economic area employment."

*Notice that there is a 1 job difference in the "indirect job losses" catagory between the chart of job loses (258) and the narrative of changes (259), resulting in a 1 job difference in the total job loses(580 vs 581)

So what does "assuming no economic recovery" mean? Simply that if no use is made of the facilities/land currently occupied by the 911th, the closing will cost the local economy 580 (or 581) jobs. However, if the facilities/land are put to a new use, the result could be a loss of less jobs, or even a gain in jobs.

Now, to be perfectly fair, maybe the media got confused. If you look at all four military facilities that will be affected in the Pittsburgh MSA, the worst case is a loss of over 1400 jobs (both direct and indirect) - 0.1% of the workforce in the MSA. Of course, that assuming that "no economic recovery" takes place, i.e. that no future job-creating use is made of the facilities/land currently used by these facilities.

Finally, one last thing about "economic recovery" from the historical perspective:

"In the case of downsizing, civilian reuse of a former military installation is often one of the greatest challenges a community will face. Communities have capably responded to this challenge over the most recent rounds of base closure from 1988 through 1995. In fact, for the more than 70 local redevelopment efforts that report on their progress annually, redevelopment activity through October 31, 2004 resulted in the creation of 110,000 jobs, or 85% of the 130,000 civilian jobs lost as a result of the BRAC actions."

Jim

 

[calibrator]

I'm just saying......you've had at least 7 final postings already, but you keep coming back for more. What do you feel you really contribute to the conversations here?

[post="269521"][/post]​

http://users.cis.net/sammy/horse.htm

 

[pitflyer]

Losing hundreds if not thousands of job is never good for a local economy. But we'll perservere. Going back to the topic at hand, if there is only going to be 38 mainline flights, what is the mix going to be?

PHL 4
CLT 4
LGA 3
ORD 2 (maybe cede this to AA, UA and WN)
BOS 3
DCA 2
FLL 2
MCO 2 (maybe cede this to Southwest and Airtran)

22 I can think of the top of my head. Any other thoughts for what would be the few remaining mainline destinations (note I would expect, as we have now, there would be additional express and E-170 flights to most of these destinations)

 

[jimcfs]

I thought the LAX, SFO and LAS transcons did well... so 2X or 3X a day brings the total to either 28 or 31. Where's the other 7-10 come from?

Maybe an extra 1X to DCA and ORD bringing 3X. That would be 30 or 32. The others could go to extra PHL and CLT frequency. That would get it close to 38.

 

[burghlaw1]

I have this argument with USA320Pilot every time he brings in that statistic about PIT population.

 

[MAH4546]

San Francisco, Los Angeles, Tampa, Miami, and Fort Myers will most definitley keep at least one daily each.