American M & E Working Together Toward Profits

[TWU informer]

Agreed.
I found it significant though that for the first time (that I know) a 514 official actually went on record admitting
that an agreement is in place to outsource all, and that a defined timetable is also in place.
Up to now all I heard was management/union official’s threats
about it.
Having a formal agreement in place is a whole different ballgame, and something that should finally convince
even the most ......innocent minds around, that it is time for these Union crooks to go.
At this point and after this what do we have to loose anyway?

Could be that Local 514 Officials have now learned to control the masses with fear based information.

Go to the Union Meeting with Bill and ask for a copy of the agreement.

They will provide a copy if such agreement does exist, right Bill?

 

[Wretched Wrench]

burchette will be voted out at which time he will secure a cushy job with management, and the cycle will continue.

Or he will be given a cushy job with the International with an expense account that is more than his salary.

 

[limit]

Could be that Local 514 Officials have now learned to control the masses with fear based information.

Go to the Union Meeting with Bill and ask for a copy of the agreement.

They will provide a copy if such agreement does exist, right Bill?

Nah.
After all, Bill has to work extra hard to cover up for all you slackers.
You see,he is involved.
He does not not know in what,.... but he is involved.

 

[Bill]

Agreed.
I found it significant though that for the first time (that I know) a 514 official actually went on record admitting
that an agreement is in place to outsource all, and that a defined timetable is also in place.
Up to now all I heard was management/union official’s threats
about it.
Having a formal agreement in place is a whole different ballgame, and something that should finally convince
even the most ......innocent minds around, that it is time for these Union crooks to go.
At this point and after this what do we have to loose anyway?

Union crooks??? And who is it you are referring? All the hard working members trying to make this work or are you putting blame on one or two. Please clarify limit!

And if I can ask, where did the quote come from?

 

[Bill]

".....Burchette explained the union's change in thinking thusly:
"At one time we wanted all the work in-house, and we didn't care if it was profitable or not. Now we make a case to have the work in-house. In fact, we have an agreement that if we're not profitable [performing a maintenance service] within two years and we can't fix it so it will be, then we let the work go outside....""

Is this a verbal agreement, or a letter of "understanding"?
Because I can not find it in the contract.
Dennis, you cant keep your mouth shut ,can you?

It just hit me what this quote is about. And as always you spin doctors are hard at work.

I'll take this real slow so even you can understand it. Dennis is not referring to all maintenance when he says "we let the work go outside". What he is referring to is that this work will be work that is already being outsourced. The work will be brought back in and we will have a certain time period to show that we can be competetive enough to keep the work in-house. If not, then we let it go back out and bring something else in. No loss!

Is that clear enough???? So drop the fear mongering and get your story straight. We are trying to get our current outsourced work back in-house. Anyone want to step up and say this is wrong?

 

[Bill]

What???? No replies???? Plenty of readers, just noone wanting to comment. Go figure............

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

What???? No replies???? Plenty of readers, just noone wanting to comment. Go figure............

Heres one bill.

When do we get compensated for doing all this extra work.
When do the guys on lay off start replacing the ones who die leave or retire.
Competitive enough to keep the work in-house.
Who is the twu trying to beat to the bottom of the payscale in order to be competitive.
Tell the twu to come up with some incentives other than the 30 dollar AIP. After all Arpey got his 23 percent what did you get bill. More work for less pay. Now thats something to be proud of.

Maybe another union could come up with some answers because the twu cant. The be lucky you have a job mantra is getting old.

Reading your pro company bend over backwards BS makes me laugh at the twu and all the rhetoric you preach.
Is another union the answer... Probably not but I for one am tired of getting raped by the twu and would gladly like a new someone to stick it in me.

 

[Hopeful]

What???? No replies???? Plenty of readers, just noone wanting to comment. Go figure............

Bill, some people have some things to do other than wait for you to post so they can respond. IT WAS TWENTY FIVE MINUTES BETWEEN YOUR POSTS, no one responded and you think you stumped everyone!

Now, I would like to ask you:

What do we get OTHER than the "lucky to have a job and at least we are not outsourcing" mantra?

 

[limit]

".....Burchette explained the union's change in thinking thusly:
"At one time we wanted all the work in-house , and we didn't care if it was profitable or not. Now we make a case to have the work in-house. In fact, we have an agreement that if we're not profitable [performing a maintenance service] within two years and we can't fix it so it will be, then we let the work go outside...." "




His words not mine.
And nice try but .....since all of us that work in AO have been told repeatedly by Dennis and Carmine
that we must get our heavy checks costs down to our competitors levels or else ......
That is also a quote.
What happened did you miss those base meetings?
How about the pulse line meetings?
Was it not said there also?
Over and over,meeting after meeting?
What did they mean by " or else"?
That the would give us flowers and chocholate, and maybe an atta boy for trying?
I do not try;I DO my job every day.

Spare us pal.
Clear enough?

 

[Bill]

As the saying goes, to a man with a hammer, everything is an anvil. No matter what occurs, even a positive event like the commitment to third party maintenance, it will be used as a bat to pound on the TWU. There is no obligation in the TWU contract or any other mechanic contract to secure third party work. In fact, in the old AMFA/NWA contract any third party work insourced allowed the Company to outsource more of its own work. It is obvious from the story itself, which is about insourcing work that was traditionally outsourced as well as third party work, that when Burchette was talking about giving up on work if it wasn't profitable he was talking about work that had always been outsourced that he had persuaded management to bring in or third party work. But, why speculate. Go to a meeting and ask.

As for the other blather, American is the only carrier which performs all of its heavy checks in house. No other major performs even half of its heavy overhaul in house. Even so the fleet size of all the majors is shrinking. Without performing work for other carriers or companies it will be difficult over the long term to keep three bases operating or provide for significant recalls or hiring. The same is true at other carriers (at least the ones which still have any heavy overhaul left). That is why all unions representing aircraft mechanics are trying to push for third party work. UAL even has a brochure circulating through the industry advertising its services, although not a whole lot in actual work. But, no contract provides for automatic pay increases (beyond the same profit sharing and stock option deals that exist at all the legacy carriers) in the event that the maintenance work turns out to be profitable or makes the maintenance operation profitable. But, that doesn't matter. Lets not deal with the Company to bring the work in because the TWU can't make a deal that doesn't exist anywhere else. Then when the work goes to lower cost providers like Timco, Pemco, Sasco, or even UAL, the same folks can beat on the TWU for not having the foresight to persuade management to compete for the work.

 

[limit]

As the saying goes, ..........................................................quote]


Trying to Slip and slide away fella?
Did you write all this so that you could avoid answering?


Did Dennis and Carmine say those things to AO mechanics or not?

 

[Hopeful]

But, no contract provides for automatic pay increases (beyond the same profit sharing and stock option deals that exist at all the legacy carriers) in the event that the maintenance work turns out to be profitable or makes the maintenance operation profitable.

Then it needs to be put in the contract (since we can re-open the current concessionary contract)
You know Bill, like what they do with executives in this company, they get a wide array of goodies.

Some stock options which are performance based, some stock options based on a certain date/price and the guaranteed bonuses regardless of performance.

It's not too much to ask for since the company wants us to keep doing more with less and less,

 

[TWU informer]

But, that doesn't matter. Lets not deal with the Company to bring the work in because the TWU can't make a deal that doesn't exist anywhere else. Then when the work goes to lower cost providers like Timco, Pemco, Sasco, or even UAL, the same folks can beat on the TWU for not having the foresight to persuade management to compete for the work.

The TWU has made several "deals" in the past that didn't exist anywhere else.

The "B" Scale
The "C" Scale
The "D" Scale
The "Flex Benefits"
The SRP Program
The Union Held Long Term Disability
The Union Held Short Term Disability
Pre Funding of Retirement Medical

That is just to name a few.

Tell us Bill, why can the TWU negotiate a company advantage "DEAL" that doesn't exist anywhere else, but when it comes to WORKER favorable deal then "IT CANNOT BE DONE"?

That is exactly why this "working together" should not be considered anything "NEW"! The TWU has been "WORKING TOGETHER" and providing company advantage concessions in this industry for 20 plus years.

Give me one reason why I should trust a single one of the corporate greed bonus recipients to do anything in my favor without a contractual obligation to do so?

 

[Hackman]

What???? No replies???? Plenty of readers, just noone wanting to comment. Go figure............

Here's one for you Mr. twu Wanna-believer. Did you swallow this load stated by Conman Romano?;
"We are meeting with you and opening these discussions, because you are not a number. You are people and our employees, and critical to the process."

Jeezus Billy, you can't tell us your swallowing this load of bullsh*t??? Are you???

More from the Conman ...."The Working Together process is allowing discussion, where as before, it was dictated by management without any discussion" It still is!!! Management might gladhand the twu fools more, but they still are doing as they please!!! Are they not Billy??

Why did management move the 757 reversers from AFW to Tulsa only to outsource them to Nordam? I know two mechanics at AFW that won a grieved 10 weeks of pay because of this. What happened Billdo??? Your management buddies didn't try to pull a fast one on us did they???

Why are the pilots stating in the Star Telegram 9/17/2006; "Employees are suspicious because American has a long history of saying one thing to unions and then turning around and doing another". "No ones forgotten that, (except the twu) and a lot of pilots are going to be resentful of what looks like a double standard."

Why is the APA saying this Billy??? Are they just not seeing the "big picture" like the twu Wanna-believers are??? Do they need some Dennis Burdchette edition Rosy Glasses?? No spin here Billy, just the truth. If you what to suck-up the goo management is spewing, you go right ahead smart guy. Others that remember the recent management bone-us program and the 20 year history of twu concessions will choose to think differently. Your a complete fool. They got you. :blink: :blink:

 

[Bill]

Here's one for you Mr. twu Wanna-believer. Did you swallow this load stated by Conman Romano?;
"We are meeting with you and opening these discussions, because you are not a number. You are people and our employees, and critical to the process."
Jeezus Billy, you can't tell us your swallowing this load of bullsh*t??? Are you???

More from the Conman ...."The Working Together process is allowing discussion, where as before, it was dictated by management without any discussion" It still is!!! Management might gladhand the twu fools more, but they still are doing as they please!!! Are they not Billy??

Why did managment move the 757 reversers from AFW to Tulsa only to outsource them to Nordam? I know two mechanics at AFW that won a grieved 10 weeks of pay because of this. What happened Billdo??? Your management buddies didn't try to pull a fast one on us did they Billy???

Why are the pilots stating in the Star Telegram 9/17/2006; "Employees are suspicious because American has a long history of saying one thing to unions and then turning around and doing another". "No ones forgotten that, (except the twu) and alot of pilots are going to be resentful of what looks like a double standard."

Why is the APA saying this Billy??? Are they just not seeing the "big picture" like the twu Wanna-believers are??? Do they need some Dennis Burdchette edition Rosy Glasses?? No spin here Billy, just the truth. If you what to suck-up the goo management is spewing, you go right ahead smart guy. Others that remember the recent management bone-us program and the 20 year history of twu concessions will choose to think differently. Your a complete fool. :blink: :blink:

You know Hackman, I don't really like even debating anything with you. Your crude and juvenile responses are useless and your true colors come out with responses like the one you just made.

I don't have all the answers. But you good ole boys want these programs to produce you more pay and benefits stat....and like I said it's just not going to happen as fast as you would like. What progress that has been made, you shoot right down because it doesn't meet YOUR specifications. Well, TOUGH SH*T!

Informer can preach all he wants about the past but these programs that are in place is all new territory for the TWU as well as the company. You don't have a clue as to what goes on during these meetings......none of you do because you choose not to be involved. And that is certainly your perrogative. But don't b*tch and moan and spin thins you know nothing about. Most of the folks on these committees are hard working union members who are trying to better our situation. What we are doing is effective. Deny all you want but it is working.

And as for Dennis' comments...Dennis says a lot of things. And like it or not he does hold a lot of power in his position. But the members voted him in. And you know what, I could care less if you like him or not. If you ahe a problem wiht him go tell him about it. Oh but wait, it's much easier to do it on a public forum beind his back.



Oh, and Hackman...you mentioned some fellas winning grievances.....who was it that won it for them????????