American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[WeAAsles]

If he got that vote,not that he has one
He’d be on here the next the next day cursing the union and bragging how he could have done much better.

Exactly why he wants that vote so desperately now as he thinks he knows how it effects him in ORD.

CLT, PHX and PHL get devastated with Job hits with Catering losses (Doesn’t effect Tim)
Medical goes way up on the LUS Family plans (Doesn’t effect Tim)
We gain no new cities (Doesn’t effect Tim)

He claims not to care about the AMT’s, Facilities or Automotive Maintenance but if the Association sold out that future there Nelson will be all over it like a cheap suit undermining the IAM and TWU on every Social Media page he can find (Who let him in)

And the offers from the Company are regressive over time with future job losses so Nelson has a field day with it.

 

[WeAAsles]

Y'all took your drivel to Jetnet. Amazing!

Overkill?

 

[T5towbar]

Tim/LUS IAM 141 Membership:

Not sure if heard about this or not:

https://www.mackinac.org/RLA

Here's the complaint: https://www.mackinac.org/archives/2019/rizzoruponsuitfiledcomplaint.pdf

Wonder what the implications are for LL 914, DL 141, IAM Grand Lodge and possibly the association if a ruling in the plaintiffs favor would effectively bring about national right to work under the RLA.

Don't know anything about this attorney, but no airline worker should be forced to pay dues or an agency fee simply to maintain employment. Particularly in right to work states like FL or TX it is wrong that airline employees don't enjoy the same rights as those covered under the NLRA.

Josh

I'm kind of torn on this one......
As a member of said Local (LL914) Some people have been wondering what this union have been doing with all of their dues money. Like the complaint states, these 3 CSR's were PMCO, and they didn't have a union. IMHO, they were treated much better (by hub management) than the ramp. When the cuts came, they got theirs back faster than we did (along with all of the other unionized groups). There were no union drives on that side of the house. We felt we had to go Union because of a upcoming merger and a "staple job" might happen because we were smaller group than PMUA. But that is history now.

A lot of people are pissed with the local because of the attendance issues (and other things....) Some miss the flexibility that no union rules had. But the trade off is having definite work rules that were much needed (especially on the ramp side) Like all things, there are pros and cons. District 141 needs some changes big time, and now that I have been on both sides of the Union / Non-Union fence, is it worth paying sixty plus dollars a month for what???

EDIT: Oh and I forgot... The District doesn't seem to care because they will be getting new members once UGS hits the property... I guess they will be members of our LL as well.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Exactly why he wants that vote so desperately now as he thinks he knows how it effects him in ORD.

CLT, PHX and PHL get devastated with Job hits with Catering losses (Doesn’t effect Tim)
Medical goes way up on the LUS Family plans (Doesn’t effect Tim)
We gain no new cities (Doesn’t effect Tim)

He claims not to care about the AMT’s, Facilities or Automotive Maintenance but if the Association sold out that future there Nelson will be all over it like a cheap suit undermining the IAM and TWU on every Social Media page he can find (Who let him in)

And the offers from the Company are regressive over time with future job losses so Nelson has a field day with it.

Weez... more than likely he want's to force a concessionary agreement (entire departments lost) because he hates unionism, and he could use the losses as criticism for future campaigns to eradicate organized labor from the industry. Besides, "Uncle Jerry" want's the Association to accept the last offer as well for obvious reasons...

 

[cltrat]

Look it’s not like I think the union is infallible or without issues but anyone gives a clown with the track record of Nelson a sliver of credibility is as out to lunch as he.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Exactly why he wants that vote so desperately now as he thinks he knows how it effects him in ORD.

CLT, PHX and PHL get devastated with Job hits with Catering losses (Doesn’t effect Tim)
Medical goes way up on the LUS Family plans (Doesn’t effect Tim)
We gain no new cities (Doesn’t effect Tim)

He claims not to care about the AMT’s, Facilities or Automotive Maintenance but if the Association sold out that future there Nelson will be all over it like a cheap suit undermining the IAM and TWU on every Social Media page he can find (Who let him in)

And the offers from the Company are regressive over time with future job losses so Nelson has a field day with it.

A vote is subject to the majority, not me or you.
Not sure what you are talking about with clt, phl, phx, devastation. Please explain.
The company can contract out 800 phl jobs right now, 3 twu stations, and hundreds combined in dca, bos, clt Republic airline work.
I dont trust management at all but it is still unclear to me how phl, clt, phx is going to be devastated when everyone should have station seniority.

 

[WeAAsles]

A vote is subject to the majority, not me or you.
Not sure what you are talking about with clt, phl, phx, devastation. Please explain.
The company can contract out 800 phl jobs right now, 3 twu stations, and hundreds combined in dca, bos, clt Republic airline work.
I dont trust management at all but it is still unclear to me how phl, clt, phx is going to be devastated when everyone should have station seniority.

When they dump Catering to a vendor that will create an overage in those locations that it was lost. Buyouts of more senior Members will mitigate some of that headcount but not necessarily enough to prevent downgrades to PT for formerly FT Members. (Something you scream bloody murder about over at UAL)

And overages at those locations will also restrict a measure of OT outside of OSO.

If the Company does currently have the ability to contract out all those jobs you say (Not likely due to current contractual language that you ignore) they would not implement that strategy while our contracts are in flux.

BTW NYer came on here many times in the past and informed you and Josh that only 1 (ONE) TWU City would be at risk when our Contract came due for opening. That city is/was SJU. The other 2 were above the (Bankruptcy) Flight threashold language.

 

[WeAAsles]

Look it’s not like I think the union is infallible or without issues but anyone gives a clown with the track record of Nelson a sliver of credibility is as out to lunch as he.

In my career I can probably count more representatives that were terrible than I can say were any good honestly. Overall the goal should be to replace the dead and rotted wood with some sturdy timber.

Nelson is absolutely not sturdy timber.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez... more than likely he want's to force a concessionary agreement (entire departments lost) because he hates unionism, and he could use the losses as criticism for future campaigns to eradicate organized labor from the industry. Besides, "Uncle Jerry" want's the Association to accept the last offer as well for obvious reasons...

The Company knows full well they can slip an over time concessionary Agreement on the workforce by fluffing the pot with dollars. Absolutely there are loads of individuals out there who will sell their souls for the measly shekels of $3,000.

My Negotiators need to be a butrice against over the top, stars in the eyes greed.

Still haven’t heard how the Company defines my “Core Work” BTW?

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Look it’s not like I think the union is infallible or without issues but anyone gives a clown with the track record of Nelson a sliver of credibility is as out to lunch as he.

Rat, no entity is perfect or without flaws. I think you know where we would be now if had decided not to join the IAM while at Piedmont. "IF" (a big if) we were to still be employed as actual employees, we would be paid lower with less benefits than the rest of the represented industry. Remember how we got forced part-time, took pay cuts, lost our pensions, and were treated as liabilities in the 90's as the represented groups kept their jobs, pay, and retirement? That's what ushered in the era of a unionized Fleet Service to begin with... solid PROOF of what happens to non-represented employees!

Still haven’t heard how the Company defines my “Core Work” BTW?

Ohh Weez... that's simple... they define it as "when, and so directed". So, essentially-- if they decide not to 'direct' you to load planes, you are no longer a baggage handler!

Thank god for contractual scope and recognition... the same scope Nelson is asking us to weaken!

 

[Tim Nelson]

When they dump Catering to a vendor that will create an overage in those locations that it was lost. Buyouts of more senior Members will mitigate some of that headcount but not necessarily enough to prevent downgrades to PT for formerly FT Members. (Something you scream bloody murder about over at UAL)

And overages at those locations will also restrict a measure of OT outside of OSO.

If the Company does currently have the ability to contract out all those jobs you say (Not likely due to current contractual language that you ignore) they would not implement that strategy while our contracts are in flux.

BTW NYer came on here many times in the past and informed you and Josh that only 1 (ONE) TWU City would be at risk when our Contract came due for opening. That city is/was SJU. The other 2 were above the (Bankruptcy) Flight threashold language.

the last offer, prior to sept 10th, had all current scope, including catering.

The union stood down. Since then, catering has been removed and it will not be coming back. Union was apparently told, take it outside of section 6 or forever gone.

The offer does apparently still have no displacement language. Im uncomfortable with losing catering but the union blew leverage and its not going to get better.
Whatever the case, why not have the majority decide?

If things keep getting kicked down the road then it may be an opening for the new union to take over and bring out a proposal for a vote.

The Association is on the clock.

 

[GVPSPIAM]

You can’t vote and have no say.

 

[WeAAsles]

the last offer, prior to sept 10th, had all current scope, including catering.

The union stood down. Since then, catering has been removed and it will not be coming back. Union was apparently told, take it outside of section 6 or forever gone.

The offer does apparently still have no displacement language. Im uncomfortable with losing catering but the union blew leverage and its not going to get better.

.

Sorry but I don’t believe you on the Catering since you don’t have anything in writing to prove that and the Company talking Heads didn’t put out any messages confirming the move off their position.

And they couldn’t say forever gone if it’s still being held under contractual language. We aren’t at an impasse.

No displacement is irrelevant if Members will be knocked back to PT with less hours because of the loss. Do you have difficulties understanding that?

Now if your Uncle Jerry were to offer Station and Status Protection that might be at least somewhat considered by the Association? Or a 25% PT Cap at least on cities that would be affected by the work loss.

I deleted the writings you had that weren’t worth my response.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Sorry but I don’t believe you on the Catering since you don’t have anything in writing to prove that and the Company talking Heads didn’t put out any messages confirming the move off their position.

And they couldn’t say forever gone if it’s still being held under contractual language. We aren’t at an impasse.

No displacement is irrelevant if Members will be knocked back to PT with less hours because of the loss. Do you have difficulties understanding that?

Now if your Uncle Jerry were to offer Station and Status Protection that might be at least somewhat considered by the Association? Or a 25% PT Cap at least on cities that would be affected by the work loss.

I deleted the writings you had that weren’t worth my response.

i dont think you fully understand. The company offered that nobody (current snapshot) would be necessarily displaced. That means not displaced to pt.
At any rate, you had it in writing about the scope, so you dont have to rely on me.
The union confirmed in your update that the company did offer all current scope. But the union didnt listen and it drove the company into section 6. Funny thing is that fly said it was a helluva offer and that the company was shocked that the association flushed the offer down the toilet cuz it wanted to use fleet as a chip for mx.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

Sorry but I don’t believe you on the Catering since you don’t have anything in writing to prove that and the Company talking Heads didn’t put out any messages confirming the move off their position.

And they couldn’t say forever gone if it’s still being held under contractual language. We aren’t at an impasse.

No displacement is irrelevant if Members will be knocked back to PT with less hours because of the loss. Do you have difficulties understanding that?

Now if your Uncle Jerry were to offer Station and Status Protection that might be at least somewhat considered by the Association? Or a 25% PT Cap at least on cities that would be affected by the work loss.

I deleted the writings you had that weren’t worth my response.

Weez... I have a question-- How does someone like Tim know what the last offer actually entailed? He is not on the N/C... he is said to not even a member in good standing... How can he know these things... unless... WAIT... he has an insider on the Company side of the table!