American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[WeAAsles]

I wish we all worked for a company that wasn’t run by pieces of chit who keep trying to put the screws to all of us despite making billions. F them

But what never ceases to amaze me is how many members when they’re holding a rock in their hand and can throw it at either the Company or the Union, chose to always throw that rock at the Union while the Company continues to smile (laugh) at them?

 

[Rogallo]

I wish when the Soldiers went in to battle they didn’t have their own Brothers shooting them from behind in the back of the head.

The enemies being among us as much as in front of us.

Gotta win the battle before we can win the war.

I wish we all worked for a company that wasn’t run by pieces of chit who keep trying to put the screws to all of us despite making billions. F them

Corporate greed. More for them, less for us!

 

[WeAAsles]

When the UA CEO offers to do an early contract opener you know the union screwed up royally.

Josh

Incorrect:

April 7, 2009

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM) District 141 today exchanged opening contract proposals in Chicago with United Airlines for the carrier's 16,000 Ramp & Stores, Public Contact, Food Service, Maintenance Instructor, Fleet Technical Instructor and Security Guard employees. The current IAM agreements become amendable on Dec. 31, 2009.

"It has been nearly a decade since our members had an opportunity to propose changes to their collective bargaining agreements," says IAM District 141 President Rich Delaney. "Since our last negotiations, United abused the bankruptcy laws to extract $4.6 billion from our members. The challenge we face in these negotiations is bridging a canyon of distrust."

IAM District 141 conducted a pre-bargaining membership survey and received more than 50,000 proposals and recommendations from members. "The three main areas of focus during these negotiations will be job security, improved wages and improved benefits," says Delaney. IAM District 141's opening contract proposals and frequent negotiation updates will be available on the District 141 website, www.iam141.org.

IAM members were forced during United's three-year bankruptcy to accept a 13 percent wage reduction in 2003, as well as another 5.5 percent cut in 2005. Additionally, United terminated its employee pension plans in bankruptcy, although IAM members are the airline's only employees to successfully negotiate a replacement defined benefit pension plan, the IAM National Pension Plan.

 

[WeAAsles]

Gotta win the battle before we can win the war.

Always trying to start your own army because you want to secede and be a part of your own little Country is not the way to win any battles and especially not win the war.

I certainly don’t always agree with the Generals either but I will always take up the sword and follow the charge.

 

[Rogallo]

You are entitled to your own opinion there PFC.

 

[WeAAsles]

You are entitled to your own opinion there PFC.

So says one of the traitors or deserters?

 

[Rogallo]

So says one of the traitors or deserters?

You may be content waving your white flag, but we traitors are not.

 

[PIEDMONT784]

The problem is that there are some people out there who want them to fall on the sword to bring us up and out. And the argument they use that we’re the majority is a piss poor and frankly offensive one to use. It implies that the minority should be either stepped on or do what they’re told (By the bullies)

IMO no the IAM side cannot give up their jobs particularly and absolutely not Catering. And they cannot give up their Medical unless it was financially advantageous to do so.

And frankly it was incredibly insulting for the Company to try and sell their inferior plans pretending they would be so much better rather than being honest about them instead.

It would be interesting to research the dynamics of these JCBA talks. My speculation is that there has NEVER been a similar dynamic, demographic, or a duel represented aggregate within a membership group. I have to hand it to the company though, they are playing their hand well.

You are correct about the majority numbers, within the duel dynamic -- there is a majority within a majority! This makes it's especially easy for the company to divide by playing one group against another. Of course... a little spurring by questionable social media posters helps them a lot as well...

 

[WeAAsles]

You may be content waving your white flag, but we traitors are not.

My enemy in this regard is still in front of me and that enemy is the Company. I haven’t waved any white flag against my real enemy.

Besides anyway I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. What you people do IMO is counterproductive for what at least should be really important. That would be gaining a new CBA that has reasonable or even substantial gains.

I think what you guys do just pushes all of us further away from those goals.

But you don’t really give a chit anyway right? Gotta kill that old White Whale.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Al unless you are just playing the let me go along with Tim as a good game it’s personally getting a little tiresome explaining that UAL deal and how it came into existence (And arguing it with non union individuals also)

There first devastation was caused through Bankruptcy. From there those members had a choice to gain a contract with more jobs but less money which they turned down. They then voted to pass a deal giving them more money but less job protestions (This was there choice)

When Oscar Munoz took over the helm from the scumbag Jeff Smisek, Munoz agreed to open the Contract early and take care of some of the issues that were incredibly harmful to those IAM Members.

Those “improvements” were then overwhelmingly passed by those Members.

You and any others in the extreme minority can disagree with their choice but they made that choice and blaming the Union assumes that all those people who voted yes are stupid where you’re I guess the genius who disagrees. (The guy who doesn’t even work there BTW)

it doesnt assume they are stupid. Selfish but not stupid. I blame the iam because of United Ground. Protect those who are on the books but hose the unborn dues payers is anti union in that situation.

Same thing with the twu. In '84 they agreed to originate the B scale in this industry. In return, the company agreed to give the twu all envoy employees as twu members, automatically without a vote, in the hubs.

This negotiation is seemingly following that plan. We will all be treated first class but the unborn and B stations second class. Such is anti union but selfishness is king nowadays, so any contract will pass.

 

[Rogallo]

But you don’t really give a chit anyway right? Gotta kill that old White Whale.

Pretty much. I make good scratch as you say. It's all about me, right?

 

[ALUS78]

Al unless you are just playing the let me go along with Tim as a good game it’s personally getting a little tiresome explaining that UAL deal and how it came into existence (And arguing it with non union individuals also)

There first devastation was caused through Bankruptcy. From there those members had a choice to gain a contract with more jobs but less money which they turned down. They then voted to pass a deal giving them more money but less job protestions (This was there choice)

When Oscar Munoz took over the helm from the scumbag Jeff Smisek, Munoz agreed to open the Contract early and take care of some of the issues that were incredibly harmful to those IAM Members.

Those “improvements” were then overwhelmingly passed by those Members.

You and any others in the extreme minority can disagree with their choice but they made that choice and blaming the Union assumes that all those people who voted yes are stupid where you’re I guess the genius who disagrees. (The guy who doesn’t even work there BTW)

Where I come from Weez to vote yourself out of a job is"stupid".But my point was more directed towards the ineffective IAM of which I am a member.Perhaps if something as little as an update was more informative our frustrations would be directed more towards the company and not the association.Heck cant they figure that out .So frustrated that it has spawned a card drive and with Tim's upcoming video a move towards dues objection by many.

 

[swamt]

two weeks. ive been saying that for quite a while. Im trying to get that spread systemwide. About two weeks.

You can't be serious, are you really saying new contract signed within 2 weeks? I'll take that bet. They won't even have an AIP in 2 weeks Tim, C'mon Man...

 

[swamt]

5 years to top is not too terribly bad

We refused the co's first offer to stretch out our top out to first 9 then down to 7 years.
I hope you guys don't follow the others in the industry making this big mistake.

Not sure I would say the company wants more than what they originally said. I think it’s probably more the executive team trying to hit home to the membership, that the company is wanting to take work from the current situation even though they are making a profit. Sooo why do they need to take work or Jobs if they are currently making a profit.
This company makes a billion dollars a year on charging for bags, changing or cancelling reservations, and credit card fees. This is before they sell one ticket, Not to mention they will one day start charging for carry on bags which will be another half a billion. These are the main reasons Parker says that we will never lose money again. All these fees and all the fees they know they can add in the future if needed. So if they are making a profit already, why should we give up anything that we currently have or perform? This is the main issue!!

You know CB I agree with you that it is not that the co. is asking for even more, it's more like this asso kept the membership in the dark and kept the "real" information from the membership which gives more of the same confusion and division, and that is not good for the membership to get behind and support the NC. If the asso. would have told the membership from the get go what all the outsourcing, scope, job positions, station protections etc..., Even weez will be shocked at what the real ask are and how much it really will affect the membership as a whole. It is pathetically sad how much this membership is kept in the dark. And yes I do blame you and every single one one the NC and the executive cmte as well as the asso.

 

[swamt]

Where I come from Weez to vote yourself out of a job is"stupid".But my point was more directed towards the ineffective IAM of which I am a member.Perhaps if something as little as an update was more informative our frustrations would be directed more towards the company and not the association.Heck cant they figure that out .So frustrated that it has spawned a card drive and with Tim's upcoming video a move towards dues objection by many.

This says it all. You see CB. Keeping the membership in the dark will in fact be the demise of this asso. Hence the total confusion on where to focus the pressure. This why you guys have the huge division rather you and others on the NC want to admit it or not. And this came from an IAM member NOT the TWU side and they are just as frustrated with you guys, the TWU side is just severely frustrated with you guys as well as the EC and this fiasco of an asso.
Good post ALUS78, the NC, EC and the asso. needs to see these kinds of post but i fear it is way too late now...