American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Bin Stretcher]

I don’t agree having this association has created having too many different voices and opinions negotiating the contracts with a single union a lot of those issues would not exist and we would have had an agreement a year ago

So, you're saying the NC should not have attempted to gain the best of each contract..... bargain for and try to maximize wages, work rules and benefits to the betterment of us all?
What should have been done in your opinion?

 

[WeAAsles]

AFTER TWO YEAR FIGHT, LOCAL 525 MEMBERS RATIFY CONTRACT BY 80%
Air, Air Blog, Negotiations, Recent Posts

TWU members picketed outside Kennedy Space Center on July 27, 2019 for a fair contract for Local 525. A contract was ratified on June 16, 2019.

After spending nearly 2.5 years at the negotiating table, Local 525 members ratified a new contract with an 80 percent vote on June 16.

Local 525 members are firefighters at Kennedy Space Center and bargain with the Chenega Corporation. In case any sort of fire or emergency happens to NASA, they are on call.

In March 2018, Chenega imposed their “best and final offer” to the membership, which was a huge slap in the face. Their proposal included:

• Massive Overtime cuts
• 401K Losses
• Minimal wage increase
• Non-paid rest periods – and
• Removed 100% sick leave

“Local 525 members put their lives on the line every day and we absolutely could not accept this miserly deal,” said TWU Air Division Director Mike Mayes. “It’s disgraceful to offer a firefighter a contract that doesn’t include any sick days.”

Solidarity was a huge part of the contract fight. In July 2018, hundreds of TWU members from across the country picketed outside the Kennedy Space Center, demanding a fair contract for Local 525. The picket line went on for three quarters of a mile and lasted for hours – even in the scorching temperatures.

Mediation
In 2018, the TWU filed a lawsuit against Chenega for not paying overtime as required by the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA).

On June 11, 2019, the TWU and Chenega met in federal mediation and began the process of trying to find a resolution to the lawsuit.

Local 525 President Kevin Smith explained that Chenega was motivated to settle the lawsuit and come to a contract agreement because NASA was poised to remove them from their property and replace them with a new contractor. At the same time, the union was also pressed to find common ground due to the fact that the next contract “could” include a “Wage Determination” for the Department of Labor, which could result in wage and benefit cuts.

Big Wins
That very same day, on June 11, the lawsuit was settled via mediation late into the evening with $1.375 million in back-wages for all overtime illegally removed.

The three-year contract includes:

• Returned sick leave (all but one day)
• Restoration of all overtime going forward
• “Time-Trades” allowing more time off for employees
• The return of two terminated employees
• Agreed to a 401k Matching program (5% Matching)
• Wage Increases
  • 4%
  • 4%
  • 3%

“This is another big win for the TWU,” Mayes said. “It proves that you can never cave into a company’s demands – workers should always prevail.”

“We didn’t get 100 percent of what these first responders deserve, but we’ve returned the majority of the vital benefits the company stole from us and secured a three-year contract for the membership,” Smith said. “Now we’re are going to focus on providing the first-class service we’ve always given at Kennedy Space Center.”

 

[WeAAsles]

American Airlines Management so far has only been offering wage increases of 2% per year on a 5 year deal.

2020: 2%
2021: 2%
2022: 2%
2023: 2%
2024: 2%

No industry look-back or wage adjustment if any competitors pull ahead.

 

[robbedagain]

Good enought to reject that based on that alone if we were to vote on it

 

[swamt]

IAM Reaches Tentative Deal for New Contracts at Alaska Airlines

June 16, 2019

Washington D.C., June 18, 2019—The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers today announced that it has reached tentative agreements on contracts covering approximately 5,000 clerical, office, passenger service, reservations, ramp and stores workers at Alaska Airlines.

The tentative accords prohibit the outsourcing of work, increase base wage rates 14 percent, on average, on date of signing, provide a mechanism to ensure wages keep pace with the industry, reduce health insurance costs, increase company sponsored retirement benefits, increase premium and shift differentials by up to 20 percent, among other improvements.

“I thank IAM members at Alaska Airlines for the unity and solidarity they demonstrated throughout this process,” said General Vice President Sito Pantoja. “It’s because of that unity that the negotiating committee was able achieve the notable gains in these tentative agreements.”

“I congratulate the IAM negotiating committee on a job well done,” said IAM District 142 President and Directing General Chairman Dave Supplee. “IAM members at Alaska Airlines can be proud of these agreements, especially the prohibition on outsourcing work. IAM members spoke loud and clear that their futures needed to be secure, and this tentative agreement is a solid step in the right direction.”

Please click here for more information regarding the tentative accords.

The IAM represents approximately 5,000 clerical, office, passenger service, reservations, ramp and stores employees at Alaska Airlines.

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2 points here; 1- It really does affect the outcome when you figure in WHO you are dealing with. ALK still has good (better than SWA does) relationships with their employees and unions. A huge difference when only looking at how long it took them to get to adeal.
2- Clerical? Office?? Just more reasons for the mechanics at AA to get out of this pathetic asso. They just represent too many "other" groups. Not enough focus on the mechanics with this type of representation.
3- Only 5K represented at ALK. Over, what is it, 35K represented at AA under nego's? A huge factor and differences.

 

[swamt]

The Association has nothing to do with it.
All Negotiations are done between a company and a bargaining agent. It shouldn't matter if we had a single union at all. The problem would still exist as the company deliberately stalls negotiations. The company is saving money each and every day they stall. It simply would not matter who they are bargaining against.
They will continue to stall until they are forced into finally having to make a move.

Sorry Bin, but I have to disagree here. Having 2 very different unions with 2 very different rules and seniority integration and time credit in different classifications.
Now I agree with how the co is dragging things out, however, when there is so much interfighting and changing of who is in control and neither side wanting to change the way their contract rules are worked within their contract is a huge factor in getting a deal done sooner. I have said this from day one when they announced the merger and the asso. being merged as well into this asso. And they have consistently proved this point several times already. Too many big heads trying to run an asso. the way they have been used to for over 40 years on both sides. It's just a roller coaster nightmare, back and forth, 2 steps backwards and then 2 more steps backwards.
At a minimum there should have been a vote for either the IAM or the TWU. If one union was representing there would be no interfighting, disagreements in the way it will be ran and rules, as the prevailing unions rules would have ruled the roost period. Remember how long it took a third party to decide the seniority integration and the long pause in the contract nego's waiting for that to get ironed out? A perfect example of WHY it should be one union representing...

 

[V.O. Reason]

What particular issues do you feel wouldn’t have existed?

Trying to find the best of both contracts or even incorporating parts of each other’s that one side didn’t like, IE the higher insurance or the the pension issue. These two issues are the prime reason this whole process has been messed up from the time it became a part of the discussions

 

[WeAAsles]

Trying to find the best of both contracts or even incorporating parts of each other’s that one side didn’t like, IE the higher insurance or the the pension issue. These two issues are the prime reason this whole process has been messed up from the time it became a part of the discussions

That’s incorrect. The “prime” issue has to do with outsourcing work in all areas of Association representation. Shrinking back our numbers in total by a few thousand over time.

If you go back and look at the Association videos SCOPE is the primary focus of those explanations.

Let me ask though. As an IAM Member are you ok with your Medical going up to 21% and there being no mechanisms in place to audit the Company’s cost projections and having no caps on what they “claim” to be their costs?

Are you on a Single Medical Plan? (No wife or children)

 

[WeAAsles]

Trying to find the best of both contracts or even incorporating parts of each other’s that one side didn’t like, IE the higher insurance or the the pension issue. These two issues are the prime reason this whole process has been messed up from the time it became a part of the discussions

BTW even without the formation of the Association the TWU would have been required to service the IAM Contracts and by the TWU Constitution would have had to hold elections to chose Locals and Local Officers for the new cities that the TWU would be representing.

The Officers who would have been voted in would be former IAM Representatives likely and would have had a keen awareness to their current IAM agreements and would have defended keeping the language and philosophies they were accustomed to. So they would have made the argument for their survival in JCBA’s.

Actually if the TWU had taken representation of the whole it may have been even more difficult to reach consensus with the Company as we would be dealing with LUS Management and not LAA, and LUS Management I’m sure would argue more for the IAM Language philosophy against the stronger TWU work rules.

In some areas it may have been a little easier but in other areas I think it would have been much harder IMO.

 

[Tim Nelson]

That’s incorrect. The “prime” issue has to do with outsourcing work in all areas of Association representation. Shrinking back our numbers in total by a few thousand over time.

If you go back and look at the Association videos SCOPE is the primary focus of those explanations.

Let me ask though. As an IAM Member are you ok with your Medical going up to 21% and there being no mechanisms in place to audit the Company’s cost projections and having no caps on what they “claim” to be their costs?

Are you on a Single Medical Plan? (No wife or children)

Wrong! The scope in the company proposal is not only stronger but it offers station, status, and system protection. Neither contract has that currently.
The association proposal actually proposed the exact same protection, including force majeure outs, but wanted to expand it to transfers as well, which would be nice but its not happening.
And the union wants to expand membership and dues by refusing to move until the company includes 20 more stations or 2500 more dues payers.
All the TAs are solid. bigtime enhanced but the unions tantrums for 20 more stations is sad, especially when they offered 25% less pay to the company to gain the extra stations.
Obviously, you sir, are pro union and anti worker.

 

[WeAAsles]

Wrong! The scope in the company proposal is not only stronger but it offers station, status, and system protection. Neither contract has that currently.
The association proposal actually proposed the exact same protection, including force majeure outs, but wanted to expand it to transfers as well, which would be nice but its not happening.
And the union wants to expand membership and dues by refusing to move until the company includes 20 more stations or 2500 more dues payers.
All the TAs are solid. bigtime enhanced but the unions tantrums for 20 more stations is sad, especially when they offered 25% less pay to the company to gain the extra stations.
Obviously, you sir, are pro union and anti worker.

Didn’t you claim that I was silenced? Anyway I am about to jump off of here again. Shall I continue to expect you all to be talking about me obsessively just begging me to come back and pay attention to you all?

BTW there is no “System Protection” Look again. If the Company offered System Protection then you could also call that “Transfer Protection” as well.

And I thought a long time ago you said you wanted us to open up more cites?

I think you’ve become Anti Worker now. Members want to work in those Cities.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Didn’t you claim that I was silenced? Anyway I am about to jump off of here again. Shall I continue to expect you all to be talking about me obsessively just begging me to come back and pay attention to you all?

BTW there is no “System Protection” Look again. If the Company offered System Protection then you could also call that “Transfer Protection” as well.

And I thought a long time ago you said you wanted us to open up more cites?

I think you’ve become Anti Worker now. Members want to work in those Cities.

View attachment 14492

you were quaranteened like the others until the attorneys told your handlers the talking points.
Sure id want more stations but i also want 7 weeks of vacation. Not going to happen so get over it. Your handlers are just dumb and have no understanding. They will lose the trial as well.
Nobody will b negotiating for years unless your handlers learn. Hopefully the mx votes the assoc out soon.

 

[WeAAsles]

you were quaranteened like the others until the attorneys told your handlers the talking points.

Oh that’s what happened then. Ok. Hey Tim can you tell me what my title is with the Union and how they’re paying me?

I mean I really sometimes wish I was what you think I am. Maybe I wouldn’t have to get in the back belly 5 days a week and sweat myself out to exhaustion sometimes.

Anyway listen seriously. Do you mind if I take off now? This place is boring as hell I know but you guys are really ridiculously obsessed with me and as flattering as it is it’s also kind of out there man.

Take care of yourself ok.

 

[V.O. Reason]

That’s incorrect. The “prime” issue has to do with outsourcing work in all areas of Association representation. Shrinking back our numbers in total by a few thousand over time.

If you go back and look at the Association videos SCOPE is the primary focus of those explanations.

Let me ask though. As an IAM Member are you ok with your Medical going up to 21% and there being no mechanisms in place to audit the Company’s cost projections and having no caps on what they “claim” to be their costs?

Are you on a Single Medical Plan? (No wife or children)

Ok yes outsourcing future employees again something that has been beat to death by many on here as to why are they worried about future employees. Oh right it’s called dues.
So no I’m not concerned about future members.
As far as the insurance cost going up 21 percent is the max it would increase there are ways to make it lower based on which plans you choose.
As far as I’m concerned that’s just basic part of life learning to live within a budget.
We deal with increased cost all the time, my home owners insurance for instance or car insurance. Go up all the time.
I just have to manage it and my property taxes go up.
I would love finding an equatable solution to this issue but if it’s going to continue to cost me and others the benefits of higher pay and other benefits that are out there than I’m willing to pay the increase cost of the insurance

 

[WeAAsles]

Ok yes outsourcing future employees again something that has been beat to death by many on here as to why are they worried about future employees. Oh right it’s called dues.
So no I’m not concerned about future members.
As far as the insurance cost going up 21 percent is the max it would increase there are ways to make it lower based on which plans you choose.
As far as I’m concerned that’s just basic part of life learning to live within a budget.
We deal with increased cost all the time, my home owners insurance for instance or car insurance. Go up all the time.
I just have to manage it and my property taxes go up.
I would love finding an equatable solution to this issue but if it’s going to continue to cost me and others the benefits of higher pay and other benefits that are out there than I’m willing to pay the increase cost of the insurance

Fair enough. I can’t use the line on you that some people in the past fought to make sure you had a spot to come into since the IAM only organized you guys in 1995 and you hired in way before that.

Now to some of course it’s about Dues. But there are some of us morons out there that are supportive of the ideology. I can’t speak for the people in your Union but I would like to hope at least some of them have that honorable ideology in their bones?

Again though forget the 21%. It’s not exactly about that as much as it is not having the ability to audit or Cap the costs. If you don’t have either of them they can put your wages in one pocket and take it back out of the other through Medical expenses.

BTW are you in a City that does Catering? You ok with those guys losing their work? You don’t do a lot of OT I hope?