AAG had 113,300 employees as of Dec. 31. That’s up nearly 3,000

Haha ... if I had a "clue about economics" then I could "read expense statements" and "figure it out."  From the person who thought a firm could arbitrarily create and value goodwill and place it on a GAAP-compliant balance sheet.  How classic.
 
First off, "expense statements" are better known to actual financial professionals as "income statements," and they're actually driven far more by "accounting" than "economics" - which aren't the same thing.  But, alas, I actually do happen to know this given my two business degrees and job in finance.
 
Keep digging.
 
there isn't any need to dig.

AA can't pay more for labor expenses than other competitors.

even you acknowledged that AA/US paid their employees less in order to keep more employees on the payroll.

So which is it? is AA going to keep salaries down or will they raise salaries to industry average levels across the board?

it's basic economics that they can't do both.
 
Per usual, the ability to argue points that nobody is debating is impressive.
 
Obviously we already know which path AA has chosen.  In the case of both of the JCBAs the merged company has already negotiated and had ratified, with its largest work group (FAs) and most strategically important work group (pilots), the company has advocated for, and received approval (ratification) of, lower overall rates of compensation than Delta - either now or in the near future.
 
And yet again, that's the way it should be - and entirely economically logical - considering that in almost all cases, Delta's employees have less security over their compensation and their jobs than their counterparts at AA who have union contract protection, as evidenced by the fact that Delta does precisely 0% of the overhauls on its own aircraft in-house, and has effectively outsourced hundreds if not thousands of ramp jobs to Ready Reserve.
 
Makes you wonder, with the outsourcing of HMV's why in the world DL has hired close to 2000 maintenance personnel over the last 5 years and continually makes a profit for the company!
Maybe they finally figured out, doing HMV's in-house was costing them money and instead decided to bring work in that would generate revenue and secure jobs in the future.
Don't really see a company ever outsourcing work, that can actually make money for them, so I'm feeling pretty good without a contract, thank you very much.

And congrats on hiring more employees! I consider it a good thing for the aviation industry as a whole!
 
CORRECTION, commavia, DL sends out AIRFRAME overhauls.

and brings in $500M in INSOURCED work mostly in engine overhauls which will only increase when the new engine and component facility opens. Can you tell us how much INSOURCED work AA brings in - not as part of TAESL?

and yet despite all of this supposed INSECURITY that DL employees have, they have gained far more often and larger increases in compensation.

further, the difference in AA compensation is NOT ENOUGH to explain 30K more employees (37%) for only $2 billion more revenue (5%).

as much as it hurts you to admit it, the economics of the merger don't work.. and never did not for Parker's employee strategy or his network strategy. Parker has shown he is willing to push the merger thru including giving up gates at DAL just as WN expands rather than develop a sustainable business plan.

All of the increase in employees and their wages are not sustainable and the cuts will come.

and thank you for admitting that AA employees don't make as much as their peers at DL; 693 will need to sit down with you for you to explain that reality. thanks for being of such great service to the board in recognizing that DL employees do indeed make more than their peers at AA and UA.

speaking of res hiring, how many outsourced res offices does AA/US have in N. America or that handle N. America calls? and how many ACTUAL AA/US staffed res offices remain?
 
Here's how I see it. At AA if I accidentally cause Aircraft damage I get drug tested and if that comes back clean I still have my job, although with discipline in my file. If (and I'm assuming) I accidentally cause Aircraft damage at Delta I'm unemployed? 

But back on topic. I'm wondering if since we have hired so many in Fleet if it might mean that they are preparing for some sort of attrition? AA has by percentage the oldest workforce in the industry. Could they "possibly" be adding so many heads in anticipation of offering some sort of buyout as other airlines have done after their mergers?

I've heard what Parker has stated about buyouts coming up and I hate bringing up that carrot on a stick but it would make sense to bring in lots of new blood and have them trained and competent before going through an attrition.
 
Why does DL have DGS and other contractors working along side of DL mechanics, instead of all being DL mechanics?
 
WeAAsles said:
Here's how I see it. At AA if I accidentally cause Aircraft damage I get drug tested and if that comes back clean I still have my job, although with discipline in my file. If (and I'm assuming) I accidentally cause Aircraft damage at Delta I'm unemployed? 
Click to expand...

Depends... There is no consistency when it comes to applying any sort of discipline. Speaking of my own working conditions, we've had 3 in the last 2-3 years. All were accidents. All had the same very identifiable human factors in play (not that local mgmt. wants to actually address those). All had very different outcomes.

But back on topic. I'm wondering if since we have hired so many in Fleet if it might mean that they are preparing for some sort of attrition? AA has by percentage the oldest workforce in the industry. Could they "possibly" be adding so many heads in anticipation of offering some sort of buyout as other airlines have done after their mergers?
Click to expand...
Why not? It's certainly plausible. Profits are high enough that AA can afford the short term cost of any sort of buyout, it would obviously lower their costs for the short-medium term, and if they take a little time to do so, they can get the new hires up to (relative) speed before the senior people hit the exits... Just brace yourself for a lot of institutional knowledge going with them...


 
700UW said:
Why does DL have DGS and other contractors working along side of DL mechanics, instead of all being DL mechanics?
Click to expand...
Because there's nothing stopping them...
 
I think the current hiring is to get control of the operation first and get through the merger. In a two or three years once everyting starts to settle is the earliest they might consider some buyouts.
 
WeAAsles said:
Here's how I see it. At AA if I accidentally cause Aircraft damage I get drug tested and if that comes back clean I still have my job, although with discipline in my file. If (and I'm assuming) I accidentally cause Aircraft damage at Delta I'm unemployed? 
But back on topic. I'm wondering if since we have hired so many in Fleet if it might mean that they are preparing for some sort of attrition? AA has by percentage the oldest workforce in the industry. Could they "possibly" be adding so many heads in anticipation of offering some sort of buyout as other airlines have done after their mergers?
I've heard what Parker has stated about buyouts coming up and I hate bringing up that carrot on a stick but it would make sense to bring in lots of new blood and have them trained and competent before going through an attrition.
Click to expand...
You are assuming wrong!
 
Yep you certainly drive around airplanes all the time in your engine shop.
 
Especially after Kevin, you know someone that actually works around airplanes on the tarmac has stated different.
 
UPNAWAY said:
I think the current hiring is to get control of the operation first and get through the merger. In a two or three years once everyting starts to settle is the earliest they might consider some buyouts.
Click to expand...
Exactly, though 2-3 years might be a bit too long for a start date...
 
Here's how I see it. At AA if I accidentally cause Aircraft damage I get drug tested and if that comes back clean I still have my job, although with discipline in my file. If (and I'm assuming) I accidentally cause Aircraft damage at Delta I'm unemployed? 

But back on topic. I'm wondering if since we have hired so many in Fleet if it might mean that they are preparing for some sort of attrition? AA has by percentage the oldest workforce in the industry. Could they "possibly" be adding so many heads in anticipation of offering some sort of buyout as other airlines have done after their mergers?

I've heard what Parker has stated about buyouts coming up and I hate bringing up that carrot on a stick but it would make sense to bring in lots of new blood and have them trained and competent before going through an attrition.
Click to expand...
doesn't matter what Kev says or not, there is nothing any harsher about the way DL handles aircraft or equipment damage than what AA does.

IN fact, who has Career Decision Days which not only go into the personnel file but which remain there for one's ENTIRE career - because I have had AA employees confirm that CDDs from decades ago are brought up.

There is no protection to what the TWU offers AA employees.

and on the subject of overstaffing, two to three years is well beyond what any US company would take to get a merger in order - and given that we are talking 30K employees at a cost of $2B per year, it is a cost that Parker is taking in order because fuel costs allow him to be inefficient right now.

there is also nothing that I said that says that AA can't offer buyouts - I have suggested it multiple times to the cries of people here that Parker doesn't believe in them.

Further, the age of AA's work force is real but unless Parker does something to incentivize people out the door, it is highly unrealistic that number of employees can be removed from the payroll in a couple years without a whole lot of pain.
 
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