2015 Pilot Discussion.

[luvthe9]

Last February at Wye River, Rice and Prater told both MECs that the NIC would never be implemented. The East pilots had the votes to stop it. That’s why ALPA spent so much time and money trying to get us to compromise. The failure of Wye River pretty much ended ALPA on the property and ALPA knew it.
The real victims of Wye River are the 175 West pilots getting furloughed. We can thank our MEC for that. The Pro-ALPA East MEC offered a compromise they thought would save ALPA and get a cram-down contract vote out before the final USAPA election. According to our sources who were there, the East offer had fences that protected their retirement attrition and prevented East pilots from bidding into PHX/LAS and pushing down West pilots down. Furloughs would be based on length of service. We hear that came out of an old Empire Airlines furlough model.
The East MEC offer would have put Dave O’Dell ahead of approximately 400 east pilots (not a typo – four hundred). The East MEC’s offer was furloughs based on longevity, months of active mainline service.
That’s right, guys. They were desperate to save ALPA and their cushy union jobs. The polling must have told them their plan would save ALPA. For sure their proposal would “SAVE DAVE” from furlough.
Just like in the B-757 IOU, the E-190 arbitration IOU and unbalanced East-West flying, our MEC ended up getting 175 West pilots furloughed, because they refused to negotiate and THEY TURNED DOWN THE OFFER!
From what we’ve been told, Jeff Freund left the Wye River conference out of frustration over our MEC’s refusal to negotiate a compromise. Our MEC says they held the line. If failure to negotiate, causing 175 furloughs, is holding the line, great job, guys. The East MEC made an offer that would have prevented Dave O’Dell from being furloughed. You turned it down.
So, if you still think our MEC were heroes at Wye River, tell that to our bottom 175 pilots. All we can say is when you update your resume’, just remember who didn’t “SAVE DAVE.”
If the former West MEC goes after us on the facts, we’ll have to put out more details, including actual statements from those who were there on both sides. But that’s the former MEC’s call.
(Go ahead, former MEC members. Deny the truth. Look every pilot facing furlough in the eye and tell them about holding the line at Wye River. Want to talk? We’ll give you our forum to explain yourselves.)
Upcoming U-Turns: (Something that caught U-Turn off guard) Is the NIC negotiable? The case for DFR. Why Wye River’s failure will hurt even senior pilots. Were does Ken Straves stand on Wye River? What does Ken Straver say happened at Wye River? Battling ALPA one week, supporting them the next? Is this Alice In Wonderland or what?

Always remember the east saved Dave!

 

[luvthe9]

Mr Wilder for the East pilots, Friday 01/08/2015
 
“Absent that, there is no legal basis for the claimed entitlement. And of course, because the predicate of a single joint collective bargaining agreement has been conceded by the West pilots, who have -- the witnesses for the West Pilot Committee, who have preceded Captain Stockdell, that no such joint collective bargaining agreement occurred, although it was a predicate for adoption of the Nicolau award. So the notion that, absent any claimed legal basis for this entitlement, it is appropriate to introduce this, I think lacks merit. And what this presents is that this testimony is irrelevant. It is prejudicial to the East Committee.”
 
Captain Stockdell, witness for the West Pilots, was asked to pack up and leave on Friday, January 8th.  Mr. Freund, council for the West pilots, tried to stick his toe in the water again regarding this on January 14th. 
 
Response for the MB BOA,  Bzzzzzzzzt.

Ouch!

 

[luvthe9]

Keep laughing DOROTHY, you're gonna need that sense of humor.

How's that sense of humor doing "Dorothy"................PHX training center, buh bye and that's just phase one.

 

[dariencc]

How's that sense of humor doing "Dorothy"................PHX training center, buh bye and that's just phase one.

 
Some great blasts from the past today.  Dave's words are really coming back to haunt him.
 
Now Dave is going to get a cold blast of reality.  A lot more "adjustments" are about to happen at our Phoenix jewel of a hub. 
 
I wonder what ever happened to that great plan for a Westie widebody international base in Philly.  Dave and the boys used up a lot of bandwidth pushing that brain fart.  

 

[luvthe9]

Some great blasts from the past today.  Dave's words are really coming back to haunt him.
 
Now Dave is going to get a cold blast of reality.  A lot more "adjustments" are about to happen at our Phoenix jewel of a hub. 
 
I wonder what ever happened to that great plan for a Westie widebody international base in Philly.  Dave and the boys used up a lot of bandwidth pushing that brain fart.  

He's clicking those heels as fast as he can........there's no place like the fishbowl......



West pilots have turned on AOL! They were offered the NIC at WYE RIVER and AGAIN in STL.........sorry westies there will be no third chance.

 

[luvthe9]

Leonidas win was Pyrrhic? Gee, I seem to recall the Nic being presented by 2 out of 3 parties in the SLI. I also heard about 5.5 million dollars leaving scab hands into those of AOL. USTUPID was too focused on the Nic to negotiate RR  so you'll be paying for that as well. But to be fair, USCABA never negotiated a single thing. Ever. You must be shocked at how much real unions can accomplish...
 
As far as yet ANOTHER loser MDA suit?  HAAAAA!! right. You know the one requirement to fly for MDA was?
 
BE. ON. FURLOUGH.
 
not hard to understand...unless you're a POS scab with zero integrity. This is the tip of the iceberg. Wait til SLI. You'll be begging for the Nic back.

"You'll be begging for the NIC back"......... That's a good one.


Hey what happened to that 5 mill, is it all in the hands of AOL.

 

[dariencc]

Check out the Robert Isom crew news in PHX yesterday.  Look at the 757 safety link and the SLI one, too.
 
Who is that crazy lady asking the questions and then interrupting everyone who tried to answer her?  She is totally out of her mind.  She should be dating Cap'n Aux.  It looked like Isom and Kimball Stone were about to call for the guys in the white coats.
 
I can't stand Isom but I almost started to feel sorry for him.

 

[luvthe9]

http://youtu.be/Yti-cfW_OlU
Voice over by the labor friendly Cap'n Aux

Wow!

 

[luvthe9]

It's going to be OK, boys. Just keep your chin held high, and you'll get through it. Deep, calming breaths.

At a boy, that's the spirit.

 

[luvthe9]

I'm confident enough in his work to have recently made a donation to help him make a car payment.
Good job, Marty!
You sent a payment for $1,000.00 USD to Leonidas LLC.
Please note that it may take a little while for this payment to appear in the Recent Activity list on your Account Overview.

Marty is laughing at AOL, are you using him for your next lawsuit?

 

[cactusboy53]

Ouch!

[SIZE=12pt]In the matter of: Preliminary Arbitration Board APA/USAPA/AA (December 17, 2014)[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=12pt]"ARBITRATOR JAVITS: All three lists. I guess the gravamen of the questions is are you then putting yourself in the place of Nicolau, are you the new Nicolau because you are proposing a list which may not reflect Nicolau's list? ….. And American pilots. And, therefore, you're making a proposal, which may be different than what Nicolau had in mind and issued back in '07.[/SIZE]
 

[SIZE=12pt]MR. FREUND (in closing): As the Chairman put it so nicely in his questioning of Jess Pauley, what the US -- what the East Committee, the US Airways Committee, the USAPA Committee, call it what you want, what it wants to do is to put itself in the place of George Nicolau and redo what George did in 2007."[/SIZE]
 
[SIZE=12pt]Ouch ... indeed.[/SIZE]

 

[luvthe9]

You know.....I thought I would never post here again because arguing with folks like Luv'r just can't be done.  Logic & reason can not argue with the unrestrained GRIEF & repeatative regurgitation of the same old posts (& videos). 
 
It's like St. STEVEN always admonished:  "The Merger Policy provides, “TheAward of the Arbitration Board shall be final and binding on all parties to the arbitration and shall be defended by ALPA.” No ALPA seniority integration arbitration result has ever been set aside by the courts although some dissatisfied pilots have challenged the award before administrative agencies and the courts."  Oh wait, my mistake.  That was US Air pilot Mike Cleary writing in US Airwaves in June/July 2000 in an article regarding airline mergers.
 
We now return you to the regularly scheduled rantings of Claxon, Mutatis, Luvthe9, et al.

All I can say is, welcome back, the end is near.

 

[cactusboy53]

And no NIC ..........check!
WYE did the west not take the NIC when offered........chance one.
STL did not take the NIC again .........chance two.

 
[SIZE=12pt][[/SIZE][SIZE=12pt]sub-note 40: Not only does the Wye River meeting confirm that the East pilots understood the force of the Nicolau Award, it confirms that they were willing to live under it.  By the terms of their proposal, the list would be operative immediately upon execution of a JCBA but with restrictions for seven additional years.  (The East pilots’ Wye River proposal contemplated that a JCBA[/SIZE] [SIZE=12pt]would be ratified by June 2008, which was a reasonable assumption given the state of negotiations, including the Kirby proposal.  See West R. Ex. C (East Wye River Proposal) 22.)  Had the East’s Wye River Proposal been in effect, the Nicolau list would have been the list to be used in this proceeding without question and the carryover restrictions of the East pilots’ Wye River Proposal would have dropped within months of the effective date of the Award in this case…][/SIZE]

 

[luvthe9]

David Simmons is merely a purveyor of fairy tales. He has been an ill informed and woefully inadequate advocate for those who elected him and rely on his information.
PHX pilots should be asking him serious questions as to why his statements of fact fly in the face of court record and statements by the leaders of American Airlines. To this day Mr. Simmons is confounded as to why the list called the Nicolau still is not in effect nor published in any official American Airlines documents or seniority list. Ask him why when you see him.

But nobody tells those fairy tales like him!

 

[luvthe9]

WYE on earth would we negotiate AWA from the product of an mutually agreed upon process? Please tell me that you're going to lead with that in your opening arguments. Then be sure to close with "It's not fair".

The question should be Wye did you not take the NIC when offered at Wye River.......then offered again at STL and turned down by D.S......not flounder.