2015 Pilot Discussion.

[luvthe9]

Just like last time, the end result will be fair to all parties.
 
The problem, just like last time, is not all the parties will agree on what is fair, or if the result is fair.  Particularly when none of the committees are going to get anywhere near their ask.
 
The Nic award is fair.  From my perspective, Nicolau gave the east far more than they deserved.  Yet, you think it is a travesty, a miscarriage of justice that you were not allowed to take your overinflated sense of self worth and leapfrog your position above West pilots with far more seniority than yourself.
 
Sorry your bubble was burst, but the Nic is more than fair.  The outcome of the current SLI will be fair, and odds are you will sulking like a toddler who wakes up Christmas morning to find a Raggedy Andy doll instead of his desired GI Joe with the kung fu grip!

POST-HEARING BRIEF OF THE WEST PILOTS MERGER COMMITTEE SUBMITTED MARCH 28, 2016


3. The West Committee understands that, despite the Ninth Circuits decision regarding USAPAs conduct in negotiating the MOU, there is no legal argument to be made that the Nicolau Award is now binding in this SLI proceeding as a consequence of the terms of the America West-US Airways Transition Agreement.41





Sure sorry to burst your bubble junior





You know very well the bottom line is NO NIC4YOU........

 

[luvthe9]

 
As it were, I made around $250,000 more than my east counterpart, took 170 days more vacation, lived in the best domicile,,guess I did come out ahead!!!

Good for you junior, you still behind in career earning........geez if you took the NIC when it was offered at Wye maybe you could have had a 330 slot and made even more........glad you went the NIC or nothing route though.

 

[nevergiveup]

 
I lost seniority in the Nic.
 
I would have come out somewhat better had we negotiated a contract or two and improved our wages, instead of a scab union forcing separate ops.
 
As it were, I made around $250,000 more than my east counterpart, took 170 days more vacation, lived in the best domicile,,guess I did come out ahead!!!

 
Then I guess you are quite satisfied if you stay in PHX with a nice fence for protection. Happy for you!

 

[Claxon]

 
I lost seniority in the Nic.
 
I would have come out somewhat better had we negotiated a contract or two and improved our wages, instead of a scab union forcing separate ops.
 
As it were, I made around $250,000 more than my east counterpart, took 170 days more vacation, lived in the best domicile,,guess I did come out ahead!!!

The ill fated nic award was 9 years ago.  You have been stagnant since.
 
What kind of retirement benefits and profit sharing did the west pilots have before they
met the East?
(Rhetorical question)
 
You were paid half of what other pilots made during most of your career, but had less than twice their vacation.  Math lesson son.
 
Why did the East Pilots not listen to the west pilots history of wisdom regarding wage increases?
(Rhetorical question)
http://web.mit.edu/airlinedata/www/2014%2012%20Month%20Documents/Employees%20and%20Compensation/Pilots/Average%20Annual%20Wages%20and%20Salaries%20-%20PILOT%20AND%20CO-PILOT%20PERSONNEL.htm

 

[Phoenix]

You make a false assumption.
 
The truth is the Nic "was" not harmful then, and "is" not harmful now...to anyone.  
 
So, the arbs use of the Nic cannot impose harm on anyone.  Using the Nic is no different than using three list, combining two (in very much the same order as Nic, cause the West still had better pay and career earnings expectations thanks to the scab union), then slotting into the third.
 
Oh, and it is to this day ....the Nic is the only accepted system seniority list that ranked the LCC pilots.

You suck at details. "If the Nic is harmful now.." If...

The company lawyers never wrote "accepted". They wrote "will accept"... A caveman could understand why the lawyers phrased it that way. Think about it.

Read the details and save yourself the embarrassment and disappointment.

 

[EastUS1]

 
The truth is the Nic "was" not harmful then, and "is" not harmful now...to anyone. 

 
Seriously? Sheesh! Honestly; do they ever do ANY drug testing at all out in "sparta"? No matter. Just for the sake of soliciting more of your predictable (if unintended) jokes; the following question is yours for the taking. Through just what arcane alchemy can you even imagine artificial advancement of such as yourself over others who actually EARNED their seniority by years worked wouldn't harm them, and do so purely for your own selfish purposes? That's a very simple question that no amount of twisted tap dancing could help you with, but have at all the absurdly self-"righteous" tap dancing you clearly feel the continuing need for regardless...We can always use some more laughs here.
 
For some added chuckles; kindly explain just how your earlier notion that " From my perspective, Nicolau gave the east far more than they deserved." wouldn't indicate some perceived sense of "harm" to yourself, especially amusing if "the Nic "was" not harmful then" simultaneously makes even the slightest sense to you? I'll have to go with the thought that you never so much as even slept through a "Philosophy 101" class, much less actually survived any courses at all involving deductive reasoning.

 

[nic4us]

You suck at details. "If the Nic is harmful now.." If...

The company lawyers never wrote "accepted". They wrote "will accept"... A caveman could understand why the lawyers phrased it that way. Think about it.

Read the details and save yourself the embarrassment and disappointment.

 
Funny how once again our recollections of historic fact differ.
 
I remember ALPA VP Paul Rice personally hand delivering the Nic to Doug Parker, who "accepted" the list at that time.
 
I don't recall there being any "will accept" with that handshake.
 
You had probably forgotten that fact, as you were likely busy starting up a scab union and missed the ceremony altogether.

 

[nic4us]

The ill fated nic award was 9 years ago.  You have been stagnant since.
 
What kind of retirement benefits and profit sharing did the west pilots have before they
met the East?
(Rhetorical question)
 
You were paid half of what other pilots made during most of your career, but had less than twice their vacation.  Math lesson son.
 
Why did the East Pilots not listen to the west pilots history of wisdom regarding wage increases?
(Rhetorical question)
http://web.mit.edu/airlinedata/www/2014%2012%20Month%20Documents/Employees%20and%20Compensation/Pilots/Average%20Annual%20Wages%20and%20Salaries%20-%20PILOT%20AND%20CO-PILOT%20PERSONNEL.htm

 
Nope, pretty much blew waaaayyyy past your 1800 furloughs career earnings back in 2011.
 
You actually have to be working (not half a career on furlough) to make the bank.
 
Have I mention that for an entire decade, I made waaaaay more than my east counterpart, and had 170 more days vacation.

 

[nic4us]

Hey junior, they are asking for 150 to 200 bucks, way better than you scabs paying 675 for a stupid tie that says I'm a fool, and forking over millions to Marty.



PS.......... How did you make out on this last bid?..........oh wait a minute.........

 
Hi loser...actually I should say junior loser,
 
You do realize that the former scab union agreed in the global agreement to pay Leonidas $5.5 million...right?
 
Thanks for the $1000 per east pilot for that payment!!
 
Oh, and Marty did make millions, and you footed the bill, again thanks, could not have beaten the scab union back without you!

 

[Claxon]

 
Hi loser...actually I should say junior loser,
 
You do realize that the former scab union agreed in the global agreement to pay Leonidas $5.5 million...right?
 
Thanks for the $1000 per east pilot for that payment!!
 
Oh, and Marty did make millions, and you footed the bill, again thanks, could not have beaten the scab union back without you!

Did you receive the 5.5 million dollar check yet sir?  (rhetorical question)
 
Will you actually receive any money once a check is deposited or will it all go to marty?
(rhetorical question)
 
Who lost more, an East pilot or an idiot west pilot like you who gave 100 per month for 9 years that will not receive a 1000 dollar dues refund from USAPA?  (yes, but another rhetorical question)
 
Stagnation for 9 years, how does that feel?  (rhetorical question)

 

[Claxon]

 
Funny how once again our recollections of historic fact differ.
 
I remember ALPA VP Paul Rice personally hand delivering the Nic to Doug Parker, who "accepted" the list at that time.
 
I don't recall there being any "will accept" with that handshake.
 
You had probably forgotten that fact, as you were likely busy starting up a scab union and missed the ceremony altogether.

On the company web site and on the Allied Pilots Association web site, there are only East, west and American pilots seniority lists.  The only web site that mentions the ill fated nic list is the army of lyingitas.
 
Your thoughts please sir?

 

[EastUS1]

nic4us: The truth is the Nic "was" not harmful then, and "is" not harmful now...to anyone.

 
Hi loser...actually I should say junior loser,....

 
Sigh....You honestly just can't help yourself, can you? How sad is that? For yet another moment's predictable laughs; let's put "the Nic "was" not harmful then, and "is" not harmful now" alongside "junior loser".  Again: I'll have to go with the thought that you never so much as even slept through a "Philosophy 101" class, much less actually survived any courses at all involving deductive reasoning. As previously noted; NO intelligence or psych testing of any kind was ever done for "pilot" employment screening at AWA. Do correct me if I'm at all in error there....?

 

[EastUS1]

Oh, and Marty did make millions, ....

 
Well, unless you're Marty; how does that mark any great "victory" for your personally, or your naturally "noble" cause? Mindlessly contributing to some wayward lawyer's charity hardly serves to much impress. How many paid-off mortgages or at least childrens' college funds enhancements might you hapless fools have otherwise achieved? Given that "you'se" are still stuck in your sadly self-decribed little "fishbowl" in PHX left to rant on the internet,  with, as always, nothing more than high hopes and seemingly-forever-childish-arrogance...well...what is it exactly that you've actually achieved?
 
Myself, shortly after the nic announcement on these very boards: "Umm...Guys/Gals...This nic thing isn't really going to work. Can we talk?" Genius-level west responses then being, and I directly quote: "Booyooshaka!"...."Final and Binding!"...."It's OVER!....Get used to it!"...Ten years later and "you'se" sad little fools are still left futilely pounding your hollow chests and clogging your keyboards up with mindless froth and spittle...and still stuck in your sad little "fishbowl"...I suppose that hearty congratulations must somehow be in order there....?

 

[EastUS1]

 
Nope, pretty much blew waaaayyyy past ....

 
Well..."waaaayyyy" cool of course, but "you'se" unthinkably left out "Dude" there. One can excuse a momentary omission of even that magnitude, I suppose.
 
"NO intelligence or psych testing of any kind was ever done for "pilot" employment screening at AWA. Do correct me if I'm at all in error there....?"
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT8H9smpK3U
 
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIfKKw-kvPo

 

[Silverflyer330]

Funny how once again our recollections of historic fact differ.
 
I remember ALPA VP Paul Rice personally hand delivering the Nic to Doug Parker, who "accepted" the list at that time.
 
I don't recall there being any "will accept" with that handshake.
 
You had probably forgotten that fact, as you were likely busy starting up a scab union and missed the ceremony altogether.

Funny that "accepted" list went from Dougs hand to being lost. How's it working for you?......never mind.