WN Mechanics seek mediation

[dgaf]

driver here's an update from the meetings today in Dallas:
Griev's will remain and not go away.
Lawsuits will go away if this 2nd offer is accepted, all of them.
Told 145.5 Million makes the membership whole. So 14.5 Million is over that. Distribution will differ between those two. The 145.5 will go to all who deserve including retirees, folks who have quit, blah, blah. The only ones not included are the ones removed for cause. The remaining 14.5 Million will be divided out with the current mechanic employees and as per year of service and since these nego started.
Look for a 60-90 day payout for the funds, just like they did last time.
Also told of 3 checks coming, 1- full retro from 2012-March 31, 2019. 2- another from 4-1 to DOS for the snap up. And another after they reserve the funds for the members that have been fired and waiting for final results to see if they get it, or, if they lose the case for continued employment, then those funds will go back to the members equally distributed.
AIP is currently being reviewed by the union for verifications and blessing. If AIP is not changed from the AIP when becoming a T/A the Dallas folks will recommend the offer to be voted in.
Company was set on having this done by May 31st. Being told it should be done by or between May 15-31st., the vote that is.
The percentiles of the first vote as well as the percentiles of the second vote coming, will be released IF this second offer is accepted by the membership. IF rejected, no numbers , just that it did not pass.
Once the NEC approves the T/A we will be voting on it within a week or so. Being told they may shorten the vote period time a bit to 3 weeks instead of the normal 4 weeks in order to try their best to maintain the May 31st timeline.
Also being told Kinder is setting up future meetings with all Presidents from all the locals to meet and talk about new and improved ideas to work together better in the future.
LOA 1 is remaining as is, with very slight changes from dates and length of new contract. LOA 2 is remaining untouched and getting into new contract. LOA 3 not sure (kinda forgot-sorry) LOA 4 will be a new LOA on the distribution of the 160 Million retro/back pay/bonus whatever anyone wants to call it.

As long as all highlights, bullet points, and promises made by Kinder, the NC, and the updates are true, I see and hear of a pass by Dallas. The IO will be troubled by some, but I don't think at this point it will stop it dead in its tracks.
They finally made us whole. We saved all scope % of outsourcing with only adding IO instead of USA outsourcing.
For some reason they are offering an overpay of about 15 million and I believe that is to kind of guarantee the vote passes on the IO. Saved all C-checks from going away. Saved from going to the impossible Scott Collins maint program that would have eliminated several lines, jobs and headcount later in the future.

Driver, I know this was long and hard for all of us. Now, I am very proud for voting NO on the first one. I know it was a risk, but I just thought it was the right thing to do at that time. I am sorry that some were put through a lot of anxiety of the no voters, but, hey, looks like it all turned out for the better. So let's all move on, get all the info, look it all over, and hopefully we will all vote this offer in. As much as I hated to wait this long, I am now thinking it was worth it and I only hope others do to.
Sorry for not PM you, but thought all would want this info to help the other airlines still in nego's. Cheers, and hope to see the ballot soon. Oh, BTW new ballot co. handling the votes now for us. TB was fired and I think it is called Election Buddy will now conduct our votes.
Sorry so long winded, but trying to pass on all info I can...

Thanks Swampy for the great update. I think timing, circumstances and some luck finally fell on our craft. Looking forward to the TA in my hands and if all that I've heard and see as in above rings true, I can certainly live with this. Only thing that would make me any more pleased would be 3 (1 way) departures. Van/Lan/Greedy

 

[swamt]

That's fine Midway is happy so I am sure we will pass. I have heard no complaints from BWI or ATL, I apologize to you and crowsfoot and others, it was rough but AMFA came through, and they deserve to stay. It feels good to get more involved , instead of just bitching. The New ALRs from Phoenix and Dan from Chicago made a difference. Also I would like to see Kinder become a guy in charge, and Landon gone.

No worries driver. If after all this really did help you, and maybe even others, to start getting more involved, then I am happy.
This took way too long and tensions grow more and more the further they take it.
One day if we ever cross paths I will buy you a drink and laugh about this crap. We all get worked up, just do our best to not let it get personal and sometimes that is the hardest part when up against a billion dollar co. with unlimited funds to carry this out.
New ALRs did help, and KK was a huge factor with final results as well. Everyone still speaking very, very highly of him.
Been hearing more negative stuff about LN. Not so sure he will be around in such a high roll as he is currently. Time will tell...

 

[swamt]

Swamt what do you mean about the 14.5m? It will be paid based on seniority, or will it be paid based on amount of time you were here after amendable? (Ie most of us would be credited for ~6.75 years) I’ve heard different things about the 14.5m, one being that it could be divided equally to all on payroll currently, it could be based on the ‘retro’ formula, and now what you mentioned. Just asking for clarity in what you’ve heard. Thanks

The way it was explained to us is most all will get the larger payout almost 7 year credit. Then the guys that have 6-5-4-3-2-1 and less years or time will get a % payout that reflects the amount of time they have been here. In other words a 1 year guy will not get the same as a 10 year guy, it will be pro-rated (if you will) per their time here during the last 6.5-6.75 years of waiting.
Blue hope that helps a little more. After re-reading my post I concur that it was a bit confusion.
I took the 14.5 and divided it up to 2550 union members and it came out to around 5600 bucks each IF evenly distributed. So I would say for most of us here longer than 6 years will all get around that and even a bit more closer to 6K over being made whole for the almost 7 years.
When we get the final numbers I think we will all get a better explanation by the economist. Don't get me wrong our ALR did a great job, it me that is not explaining it correctly and for that I apologise to you all.

 

[swamt]

Thanks Swampy for the great update. I think timing, circumstances and some luck finally fell on our craft. Looking forward to the TA in my hands and if all that I've heard and see as in above rings true, I can certainly live with this. Only thing that would make me any more pleased would be 3 (1 way) departures. Van/Lan/Greedy

Couldn't agree more with you gaf. Although I am against IO, I have been more realistic lately knowing the company really needs that option 1- as a tool to get other 3rd party vendors to lower their labor charges, and to also possibly use an IO to also lower their outsourcing cost to help pay for a new ILC (at least ILC for pass. air.) UPS will still have us beat by a couple or few dollars. But, they still kill us with benefits and health care big time. So to them I say congrats and I hope if/when this is voted in, it helps the folks at AA get their mechanics a new contract too. I will pass on anymore info I get from DAL. I know being here is easier than being at outstations where the info is so much harder to get.

 

[B737 driver]

The way it was explained to us is most all will get the larger payout almost 7 year credit. Then the guys that have 6-5-4-3-2-1 and less years or time will get a % payout that reflects the amount of time they have been here. In other words a 1 year guy will not get the same as a 10 year guy, it will be pro-rated (if you will) per their time here during the last 6.5-6.75 years of waiting.
Blue hope that helps a little more. After re-reading my post I concur that it was a bit confusion.
I took the 14.5 and divided it up to 2550 union members and it came out to around 5600 bucks each IF evenly distributed. So I would say for most of us here longer than 6 years will all get around that and even a bit more closer to 6K over being made whole for the almost 7 years.
When we get the final numbers I think we will all get a better explanation by the economist. Don't get me wrong our ALR did a great job, it me that is not explaining it correctly and for that I apologise to you all.

When I talked to Dan our ALR from MDW local 4, he said that part was still a little fluid, but was almost done, and it was a percentage based on time .

 

[swamt]

When I talked to Dan our ALR from MDW local 4, he said that part was still a little fluid, but was almost done, and it was a percentage based on time .

Yes. And it will all come together better once all the numbers are crunched and cracked. Everything is fluid until it is bottled up and stopped flowing.

 

[swamt]

When I talked to Dan our ALR from MDW local 4, he said that part was still a little fluid, but was almost done, and it was a percentage based on time .

driver, it would appear that you are getting much better communications from your new ALR. This is good. I really think that was part of his removal from that position. He should have taken the time to do more communicating when members were asking for the info. Leaving folks in the dark only start the rumors and misinformation headaches.
I know we still have to vote and even get to a T/A first, but man does it feel good knowing we are staring at the end of all this. I say end, but I feel this is the one that will pass. By the company really making us whole thru all this plus some, that is what the membership really wanted in the end and now they are getting it as well as other additions and improvements in our contract. In the long run of things, if ya think about it, the 8 lines will be lowered to 5 as 3 will sunset, and that 5 lines is only one more line than they were doing before with Aeroman and still the same amount of % of outsourcing. I really haven't heard of any resistance so far to the current offer being made.

Hate to have to sit here and watch the AA'ers go thru exactly what we went thru. They are fighting hard for 2200 mechanics positions, outsourcing as well, and a large amount of line maint to foreign outsourcing. Plus other positions with fleet and other groups.
Look for the announcement next week hopefully. Should be another joint release (I like those better than the two sides doing their own) makes it more professional that way. then let the voting begin...

 

[B737 driver]

driver, it would appear that you are getting much better communications from your new ALR. This is good. I really think that was part of his removal from that position. He should have taken the time to do more communicating when members were asking for the info. Leaving folks in the dark only start the rumors and misinformation headaches.
I know we still have to vote and even get to a T/A first, but man does it feel good knowing we are staring at the end of all this. I say end, but I feel this is the one that will pass. By the company really making us whole thru all this plus some, that is what the membership really wanted in the end and now they are getting it as well as other additions and improvements in our contract. In the long run of things, if ya think about it, the 8 lines will be lowered to 5 as 3 will sunset, and that 5 lines is only one more line than they were doing before with Aeroman and still the same amount of % of outsourcing. I really haven't heard of any resistance so far to the current offer being made.

Hate to have to sit here and watch the AA'ers go thru exactly what we went thru. They are fighting hard for 2200 mechanics positions, outsourcing as well, and a large amount of line maint to foreign outsourcing. Plus other positions with fleet and other groups.
Look for the announcement next week hopefully. Should be another joint release (I like those better than the two sides doing their own) makes it more professional that way. then let the voting begin...

The sad thing Swampy if you read their forums they are where we were. If you try to help, some get mad. Most likely the ones that are afraid they will get replaced. I was all butt hurt when the Teamsters were kicked out, but AMFA was smart this time around , and didn't fall into Landon Nickelodeon's trap, like the poor saps at Northwest. I like the fact that Kitner is working to heal our culture. I look forward to when he visits MDW.

 

[swamt]

The sad thing Swampy if you read their forums they are where we were. If you try to help, some get mad. Most likely the ones that are afraid they will get replaced. I was all butt hurt when the Teamsters were kicked out, but AMFA was smart this time around , and didn't fall into Landon Nickelodeon's trap, like the poor saps at Northwest. I like the fact that Kitner is working to heal our culture. I look forward to when he visits MDW.

Since I have starting digging to get more info on KK, I haven't heard one negative thing about this man, they are all good words for the man from both sides, union and company.
I have to give him kudos for doing what he has done so far. 1- Making LN and LL lift the SOE prior to him entering nego's to get HIS deal done. 2- getting the deal done (so far as it looks like). 3- wanting to rebuild that relationship between AMFA and company, like we had when Sokol was here. I too hope he gets it done. It really is time to move on. Question is, with the couple guys in maint at the helm can we get it back to where it was before??? Maybe some changes are needed to do so...

 

[B737 driver]

Since I have starting digging to get more info on KK, I haven't heard one negative thing about this man, they are all good words for the man from both sides, union and company.
I have to give him kudos for doing what he has done so far. 1- Making LN and LL lift the SOE prior to him entering nego's to get HIS deal done. 2- getting the deal done (so far as it looks like). 3- wanting to rebuild that relationship between AMFA and company, like we had when Sokol was here. I too hope he gets it done. It really is time to move on. Question is, with the couple guys in maint at the helm can we get it back to where it was before??? Maybe some changes are needed to do so...

If you let him run the show. Treat people like Herb did without giving away the store. Maintenance will gladly go above and beyond like we used too.

 

[dgaf]

If you let him run the show. Treat people like Herb did without giving away the store. Maintenance will gladly go above and beyond like we used too.

Do we have any AK guys that are on this board, to give us their feedback on KK as well. Of course at this point it's getting a little late to form an opinion on KK with that because he's already creating a reputation of a good leader. Even with the tidbits we know of his involvement, whether it was to drop the SOE, or I also heard it was largely his doing to try and wrap this up on Saturday because I think the negotiators were all headed home Friday night. So far I'm liking what I have heard with his involvement and the AIP. I would really like to see some shakeups in SWA upper management, to even further restore my confidence in a company that means what it says and says what it means.

 

[B737 driver]

Do we have any AK guys that are on this board, to give us their feedback on KK as well. Of course at this point it's getting a little late to form an opinion on KK with that because he's already creating a reputation of a good leader. Even with the tidbits we know of his involvement, whether it was to drop the SOE, or I also heard it was largely his doing to try and wrap this up on Saturday because I think the negotiators were all headed home Friday night. So far I'm liking what I have heard with his involvement and the AIP. I would really like to see some shakeups in SWA upper management, to even further restore my confidence in a company that means what it says and says what it means.

It's a start in the right direction.

 

[swamt]

Do we have any AK guys that are on this board, to give us their feedback on KK as well. Of course at this point it's getting a little late to form an opinion on KK with that because he's already creating a reputation of a good leader. Even with the tidbits we know of his involvement, whether it was to drop the SOE, or I also heard it was largely his doing to try and wrap this up on Saturday because I think the negotiators were all headed home Friday night. So far I'm liking what I have heard with his involvement and the AIP. I would really like to see some shakeups in SWA upper management, to even further restore my confidence in a company that means what it says and says what it means.

I don't think any ALK guys are here. However, myself, as well as others here at SWA, have spoken to a many ALK mechanics about him (Kinder) and they speak of "nothing" but good vibes about him.
I really think the shake up is coming. Just not so soon after these nego's are done so that it doesn't look like he or they were removed for the nego's fiasco they created.
I also have heard from mechanics that have talked to KK themselves, he is very honest when he talks with us mechanics on the floor. And, he has so far delivered as he has promised or said he would do. A man of his word. He is also very much Southwest attitude and get er done mentality.
ALK mechanics and employees were pretty upset that he left to come over here. That in itself speaks volumes in my opinion.

 

[swamt]

Just a little FYI. In the AMFA/SWA joint release is was put out on Fri. the 22nd. and they mention doing their best o get to a T/A by next week. (end of 1st para). Unfortunately it did not come that next week. Some are saying this next week now and hopefully as early as possible.
I know, were all anxious to get er done, it's been long time, but, let us allow out NC, economist and attorneys to dot every "I" and cross every "T" and to double check that all info is correct and true from the intent of AIP to T/A.
Also remember AMFA will not have any info from the company until some time after April 5th as this is the day they will close the month of March on the books (as far as retro, and backpay numbers).
Still not confirmed if co. or union will send out the retro numbers and bonuses. We already know the snap up and outgoing years numbers.
Also remember that the voting will start somewhere around a week or so (7-10 days) after the union gets all the info from company after March close of books.
We have an agreement, just takes time to organise it into the T/A. Also remember the co. will more than likely also ask for up to 90 days for the payout like they did last time.
Below is the joint release I am referring to:

March 22 – Joint Memo: AMFA and SWA Update on Tentative Agreement
After reaching an Agreement in Principle (AIP) on March 16, the Southwest and AMFA Negotiating Committees began finalizing the contractual language to turn the AIP into a Tentative Agreement (TA). By and large, this work has been completed, with only a few remaining issues. The TA calls for retro pay through March 31, 2019, and Southwest will provide AMFA with the final numbers around April 5. At that point, AMFA will determine how it plans to distribute the ratification bonus to each individual. The last remaining step is to combine all of the documents we’ve agreed to into one TA document for your review, and we plan to complete this work next week.

Here are some additional details about the modification of Letter of Agreement 1 (LOA1)…

Read the memo here.

 

[an-amt]

I don't think any ALK guys are here. However, myself, as well as others here at SWA, have spoken to a many ALK mechanics about him (Kinder) and they speak of "nothing" but good vibes about him.
I really think the shake up is coming. Just not so soon after these nego's are done so that it doesn't look like he or they were removed for the nego's fiasco they created.
I also have heard from mechanics that have talked to KK themselves, he is very honest when he talks with us mechanics on the floor. And, he has so far delivered as he has promised or said he would do. A man of his word. He is also very much Southwest attitude and get er done mentality.
ALK mechanics and employees were pretty upset that he left to come over here. That in itself speaks volumes in my opinion.

At least one. Me, that shop steward. From years ago.