WN Mechanics seek mediation

[blue collar]

I’m not acting like they have it terrible here, because they don’t. You’re the one trying to say they’ve been getting raises while you haven’t. The steps they’re working their way up are still 2012 wages- the same as yours. You’re not always a victim.

 

[B737 driver]

What because I became a lead in 2014? I have had to start over several times give me a break, you act like these younger guys have it terrible here. That's part of Aviation is, and what your seniority brings you. Just like the seniority you had at your last Airline.

Hello Max, you love red marks lol!

 

[Birdman]

I went into the Wednesday RS with an open mind and the negotiators made a good case for more money. I'll have to say I've been leaning toward the yes side simply because scope was secured and the 14.8% snap-up backdated to April 1st certainly beat a snap-up upon ratification, which is a substantial amount of money. What is causing me to wrestle with my previous posture was the Houston ALR's description of what he experienced during his 12 years in management up until 2017. Many of us who witnessed his confession were appalled by his description of how management bonuses are enhanced by cutting budgets and expenses in maintenance and how that has affected our lack of support in doing our jobs. IMO, it's also directly tied to how much we receive in pay and benefits and to me is a totally unethical way to do business. I am one of those guys who took a pay cut to come here 5 years ago and now making $11 dollars and change more than I made after 23 years at AA but let me assure you, that has not made the decision I've yet to make any easier.

 

[B737 driver]

I’m not acting like they have it terrible here, because they don’t. You’re the one trying to say they’ve been getting raises while you haven’t. The steps they’re working their way up are still 2012 wages- the same as yours. You’re not always a victim.

I never said I was a victim. The point is they received wage increases and senior people have not. If they were in the apprentice program, say they were a cleaner, or ramp, once they became a full mechanic it is still an increase in pay. What part of economics do you not understand. If a senior topped out guy pay doesn't increase , and a junior guy moves up the scale at the same time, who is moving up economically?

 

[B737 driver]

I went into the Wednesday RS with an open mind and the negotiators made a good case for more money. I'll have to say I've been leaning toward the yes side simply because scope was secured and the 14.8% snap-up backdated to April 1st certainly beat a snap-up upon ratification, which is a substantial amount of money. What is causing me to wrestle with my previous posture was the Houston ALR's description of what he experienced during his 12 years in management up until 2017. Many of us who witnessed his confession were appalled by his description of how management bonuses are enhanced by cutting budgets and expenses in maintenance and how that has affected our lack of support in doing our jobs. IMO, it's also directly tied to how much we receive in pay and benefits and to me is a totally unethical way to do business. I am one of those guys who took a pay cut to come here 5 years ago and now making $11 dollars and change more than I made after 23 years at AA but let me assure you, that has not made the decision I've yet to make any easier.

So tell me birdman, if you can't change management mind, on how they run their business, how much more can we really gain, by driving it to 7 years ,or more trying to gain a 3% raise. Tell me how we will ever be made whole?

 

[blue collar]

You never said you were a victim, but you’ve acted like one. I completely understand economics, and while you were struggling while making $46/hr, how do you think they were doing at $30/$33/$35? Who cares if they were getting their step raises- it’s still 2012 wages. So yeah, I do get economics, but I don’t get your argument.
Birdman- I was also on the fence leaning yes, but after looking at the whole thing I can no longer support it.

 

[Birdman]

So tell me birdman, if you can't change management mind, on how they run their business, how much more can we really gain, by driving it to 7 years ,or more trying to gain a 3% raise. Tell me how we will ever be made whole?

I'm not qualified to tell them how to run their business as a whole but I have no problem telling them they're doing a poor job managing their workforce and I believe their business practices in regard to management bonuses are unsavory. The NC numbers certainly exceed 14.8% + 3% snap-up going forward to make us whole and I don't know that a no vote would change managements mind enough to significantly add a ton of money to the deal. Expecting 100% of what our "economist" says we should get is unrealistic but many are being stirred into a frenzy to expect just that. As I see it when we do vote it will finally start the clock on an end to this madness regardless whether it's approved or rejected.

 

[B737 driver]

You never said you were a victim, but you’ve acted like one. I completely understand economics, and while you were struggling while making $46/hr, how do you think they were doing at $30/$33/$35? Who cares if they were getting their step raises- it’s still 2012 wages. So yeah, I do get economics, but I don’t get your argument.
Birdman- I was also on the fence leaning yes, but after looking at the whole thing I can no longer support it.

Which is if you understand economics, $54 and hour as a lead, topping out at $60 in 2023, makes alot better economics , then staying at $46. Not to mention overtime on that, including double and occasionally triple time, which I know American nor Delta Airlines has, especially triple time.

 

[B737 driver]

I'm not qualified to tell them how to run their business as a whole but I have no problem telling them they're doing a poor job managing their workforce and I believe their business practices in regard to management bonuses are unsavory. The NC numbers certainly exceed 14.8% + 3% snap-up going forward to make us whole and I don't know that a no vote would change managements mind enough to significantly add a ton of money to the deal. Expecting 100% of what our "economist" says we should get is unrealistic but many are being stirred into a frenzy to expect just that. As I see it when we do vote it will finally start the clock on an end to this madness regardless whether it's approved or rejected.

Agreed my fellow mechanic.

 

[blue collar]

Well, obviously $54 is better than $46. But is it worth only accepting $54 when you should be at $56-57? Delta does have double time, and while AA doesnt have it now (except for 2nd/3rd day off), it is in the offer from their company.
The way I see it, there’s no down side to me voting no- either it gets voted down and we can go back to the table to get what we’re worth; or, I get 3 good sized checks, and a $7/hr raise. It’s as simple as that. Sure, there’s no guarantee they won’t want something from us for more money, but I’m willing to gamble because a good argument can be made that we’ve earned that extra money we’re worth.

 

[B737 driver]

Well, obviously $54 is better than $46. But is it worth only accepting $54 when you should be at $56-57? Delta does have double time, and while AA doesnt have it now (except for 2nd/3rd day off), it is in the offer from their company.
The way I see it, there’s no down side to me voting no- either it gets voted down and we can go back to the table to get what we’re worth; or, I get 3 good sized checks, and a $7/hr raise. It’s as simple as that. Sure, there’s no guarantee they won’t want something from us for more money, but I’m willing to gamble because a good argument can be made that we’ve earned that extra money we’re worth.

I respect that but for me , if you could do it in 6 months sure. However with our own negotiating committee admitting to the membership, what I have said for months on the ETOPS, that you guys finally have to agree I was right. That was supposedly our big enchilada, to get our contract from the company. The other brilliant plan was family week. Then we had let's say from our Lawyer Seham, SWA is unsafe that will scare them. So for this mechanic I will take the guarantee, and not go 16 months.

 

[blue collar]

I never thought etops would get us a deal, and I didn’t agree with sending that letter after our incident in philly either. Family week didn’t even last a week I don’t think, can’t remember- and publicizing it wasn’t smart either. I can get where you’re coming from, like I said I was on the fence leaning yes.

 

[sendmeupacrowsfoot]

I think I will........vote no

 

[B737 driver]

I think I will........vote no

What a shocker!

 

[B737 driver]

I never thought etops would get us a deal, and I didn’t agree with sending that letter after our incident in philly either. Family week didn’t even last a week I don’t think, can’t remember- and publicizing it wasn’t smart either. I can get where you’re coming from, like I said I was on the fence leaning yes.

Let's face it gentlemen, this version of AMFA is starting to look like the industrial unions, running out of ideas.