Why hasn''t anyone posted the Mar 1 codaphone?

[chipmunn]

PITBull:

PITBull said, "ALPA IS TESTIFYING ON HOW THE COMPANY CAN SAVE MONEY BY FREEZING OTHER GROUPS PENSIONS, THEY HAVE LOST MY SUPPORT! Union leaders do NOT behave this way! Unions do not go to management and ask them to BURN everyone else's house down."

Roy Fruendlich said,"An actuary witness for the objector attorney testified to the legitimacy of assuming that future legislation would produce the higher interest rate to reduce funding obligations for the pension plan, which he estimated to be 500-600 million dollars below the Company’s forecast over the seven-year period between 2003 – 2009. The objector actuary witness also testified that if the pension plans were frozen, as opposed to terminating one plan, the funding obligation would be reduced by 700-900 million dollars over the same period when combined with assuming that the higher interest rate from expected legislation is legitimate for forecasting pension funding requirements."

Chip comments: PITBull, ALPA has not suggested to the court that other pensions be frozen, this was done by an objector attorney and his licensed actuary witness. There are five independent defense attorney's who all are introducing witnesses and cross-examining company witnesses.

In fact, in some cases the non-ALPA defense attorney's have hurt the case for all US Airways employees.

However, the challenge is this option (that was not initiated by ALPA) has now been placed before the court, which is an option or potential settlement to the company's motion to terminate the pilot pension plan and is now part of the testimony.

Unfortunately, now all pension plans face some risk.

Chip

 

[mlt]

Hi Savy,
No, I'm not surprised with the testimony presented by ALPA at yesterday's hearing. If we go back a few months I believe you and I went a few rounds with OBG over this very issue. However, what does surprise me is ALPA's intentions on this issue have been well publicized for 2 months and most of labor elected to sit back. Now on the last day of testimony and potentially the day the judge issues a decree, people are rallying against this motion.

So the question remains, why pay Jerry Glass when U has ALPA? When will we learn?

 

[savyinvestor]

ALPA, the altruistic association!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Some say let them do their thing. Well it looks like they are at the expense of all. Surprise? I don't think so! Savy

 

[savyinvestor]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 3/1/2003 3:49:14 PM mlt wrote:

Hi Savy,
No, I'm not surprised with the testimony presented by ALPA at yesterday's hearing. If we go back a few months I believe you and I went a few rounds with OBG over this very issue. However, what does surprise me is ALPA's intentions on this issue have been well publicized for 2 months and most of labor elected to sit back. Now on the last day of testimony and potentially the day the judge issues a decree, people are rallying against this motion.

So the question remains, why pay Jerry Glass when U has ALPA? When will we learn?
----------------
[/blockquote]
MLT, Good to hear from you and no you don't have to marry me!It should come as no surprise to anyone. ALPA will do and sacrifice ALL to save their little corner of the world. Savy {Not mean spirited just calling a spade a spade }

 

[chipmunn]

Hula Girl:

The bankruptcy court has fairly tight security and no electronic devices can be taken past the security checkpoint. Upon entrance all cell phones must be checked at security and updates from the courthouse can only be obtained when the court is in recess or an individual leaves the hearing.

It's anticipated the parties will present closing arguments this afternoon, but ALPA's attorney's say its a 50-50 chance that the court will rule from the bench today. However, it is expected that if a ruling is not made today, the court will quickly issue its "opinion and award".

Chip

For today's news see www.chipsplace.com and Rumor Control.

 

[Hula Girl]

I mean you no ill will PineyBob. My father, uncles, and grandfathers all fought so we have the rights we have today. Truce? And congrats on your impending nuptials.

 

[chipmunn]

PineyBob:

Unlike the IAM, each individual ALPA unit is independent and each pilot group negotiates their own agreement.

However, you are right that the implications go beyond the ALPA pilot group and could effect other US Airways labor groups and other airline employees.

Chip

 

[PITbull]

Chip,

I am going to attempt to take the "high road" on this, and hope that the ruling will be NOT to terminate the pilots pension.

I have, however, put our MEC on "alert".

 

[blockquote]
----------------
On 3/1/2003 3:05:00 PM Hula Girl wrote:

Mr. PineyBob, sadly you have too much anger for me. I do have my private pilot's license but work in a completely different field with USAirways. I will skip over what you write and let you vent in in the flacid way you do oh so well. I hope you find some peace in this world and I will pray that you find some happiness. From your post it sure sounds like you could use some. God Bless You.
----------------
[/blockquote]
Hula Girl, I love your way with words! That was a hoot! The visual you provide is priceless. I do agree with all you wrote above. Keep trucking towards that commercial rating, etc.
And by the way, I am purrrrrrrrfectly happy for you to be Board Goddess if I can be Board Granny. If you wear a size 8, we can borrow each other's stilettos. I ain't your father's grandmother.
[img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/2.gif'] [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/12.gif']

 

[mlt]

Hi Savy,
Good to hear from you also. I think you're great, however you are confusing me with friendlypup--I believe f.p. was the one discussing marriage. Certainly not me!

 

[PITbull]

[blockquote]
----------------
On 3/1/2003 3:38:07 PM chipmunn wrote:

PITBull:

PITBull said, "ALPA IS TESTIFYING ON HOW THE COMPANY CAN SAVE MONEY BY FREEZING OTHER GROUPS PENSIONS, THEY HAVE LOST MY SUPPORT! Union leaders do NOT behave this way! Unions do not go to management and ask them to BURN everyone else's house down."

Roy Fruendlich said,"An actuary witness for the objector attorney testified to the legitimacy of assuming that future legislation would produce the higher interest rate to reduce funding obligations for the pension plan, which he estimated to be 500-600 million dollars below the Company’s forecast over the seven-year period between 2003 – 2009. The objector actuary witness also testified that if the pension plans were frozen, as opposed to terminating one plan, the funding obligation would be reduced by 700-900 million dollars over the same period when combined with assuming that the higher interest rate from expected legislation is legitimate for forecasting pension funding requirements."

Chip comments: PITBull, ALPA has not suggested to the court that other pensions be frozen, this was done by an objector attorney and his licensed actuary witness. There are five independent defense attorney's who all are introducing witnesses and cross-examining company witnesses.

In fact, in some cases the non-ALPA defense attorney's have hurt the case for all US Airways employees.

However, the challenge is this option (that was not initiated by ALPA) has now been placed before the court, which is an option or potential settlement to the company's motion to terminate the pilot pension plan and is now part of the testimony.

Unfortunately, now all pension plans face some risk.

Chip
----------------
[/blockquote]

Oh, please Chip, don't start with me. ALPA MEC has presented this in their original motion, page 35.

 

Dear Friendly, (new kid on the block)

You are CORRECT, we are all living human beings.

Tell me, though, what would be gained by ALPA suggesting that the co. freeze all other pensions , reduce their RJ investment, in order to maintain the pilots pesnions? So, ALPA states that they are subsidizing OUR defined pensions; as if no other group made any major sacrifices but them. Come on. Their line of thinking has gone "haywire". Freezing IAM and AFA's pensions, under these circumstances, would COST the co. much in anger between one group and another. Especially knowing that management did not suggest this OR motion this.

----------------
[/blockquote]
[img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/1.gif'] Thanks PITbull, for the welcome. And the "kid" reference. I haven't been a kid in about 198 years.... or so it feels like these days.
If ALL pensions were frozen, I have no problem with that. As for the RJ issue, I think it is dead wrong to take away any pensions in order to buy or lease aircraft. Pensions $$$ is money already earned. Some people have already been living on them for many years. Why do THOSE people have a role in saving USAir? Their work is done.
Why don't you wait to see if that is what ALPA ACTUALLY did.......there will be a transcript of all of the testimony and it is public record. When that becomes available, then we'll all know EXACTLY what went on and who actually did or proposed what. I don't personally know any line pilots who want any other unions' pensions screwed with.
The class warfare approach taken in this entire industry is the ONLY thing successful about the industry......at the moment.
One more thing. Yeah, things are bad all over today, or so it seems. But the economy is starting to come back. The war will be over in a virtual nano as compared to WW2 et al. The Feds and Pakistan caught a really big terrorist leader today. Pendulums swing both ways. Battles have to be fought when one side attacks another side, whether its countries or companies and unions. That's what ALPA, the Soaring Eagles, The Silver Eagles, et all are doing right now......But things DO get better and my best guess is that when they do, everyone involved in this ugly mess will have learned many lessons. If they don't, they deserve exactly what they will get. And that, means every single one of us.

 

[savyinvestor]

Hi MLT, Darn my mistake! Friendly seems to be of the ALPA persuasion and that wouldn't work for me no matter how big their salary or pension is. Savy

 

[blockquote]
----------------
On 3/1/2003 4:56:50 PM Light Years wrote:

Hey Chip, is that picture on your site you?
----------------
[/blockquote]

That's Chip's dad.

 

[chipmunn]

PITBull:

Please see my earlier post, ALPA has not suggested in testimony that any other pension plans be frozen. Meanwhile, did you see the recent action regarding management pensions?

Chip