West 737-300s retained?

[smoot4208]

Just trying to figure out what's going on. Some people stated it back in the E190 thread but since that is closed, I'll post here. Is this pure rumor or is this something that is a done deal and will be announced sometime in the near future like at the 3rd quarter earnings date? Would the idea be that over the next year, new west airbus will replace current 737 routes and then the 737s will fly the lost E190 routes? I'm not trying to make this into a pilot thread.

Also on a side note, as of right now, there will be 15 E190s left, would it be smart to put those on the shuttle routes? I know the shuttle requires about 15 airplanes. Flights are never full in coach so I would think they could get better loads on those and in return put the A319s on E190 routes that are always full.

 

[OTslave]

Just trying to figure out what's going on. Some people stated it back in the E190 thread but since that is closed, I'll post here. Is this pure rumor or is this something that is a done deal and will be announced sometime in the near future like at the 3rd quarter earnings date? Would the idea be that over the next year, new west airbus will replace current 737 routes and then the 737s will fly the lost E190 routes? I'm not trying to make this into a pilot thread.

Also on a side note, as of right now, there will be 15 E190s left, would it be smart to put those on the shuttle routes? I know the shuttle requires about 15 airplanes. Flights are never full in coach so I would think they could get better loads on those and in return put the A319s on E190 routes that are always full.

I can tell you that the LGA-DCA-LGA and LGA-BOS-LGA shuttle takes 8 airplanes to run, with no spares.
I don't know what the DCA-BOS-DCA route requires.

 

[FlyUs]

Just trying to figure out what's going on. Some people stated it back in the E190 thread but since that is closed, I'll post here. Is this pure rumor or is this something that is a done deal and will be announced sometime in the near future like at the 3rd quarter earnings date? Would the idea be that over the next year, new west airbus will replace current 737 routes and then the 737s will fly the lost E190 routes? I'm not trying to make this into a pilot thread.

Also on a side note, as of right now, there will be 15 E190s left, would it be smart to put those on the shuttle routes? I know the shuttle requires about 15 airplanes. Flights are never full in coach so I would think they could get better loads on those and in return put the A319s on E190 routes that are always full.

BOS-LGA Shuttle flights have been full for about a month now.. not every flight but a good percentage of them.

 

[HPDriver]

Just trying to figure out what's going on. Some people stated it back in the E190 thread but since that is closed, I'll post here. Is this pure rumor or is this something that is a done deal and will be announced sometime in the near future like at the 3rd quarter earnings date? Would the idea be that over the next year, new west airbus will replace current 737 routes and then the 737s will fly the lost E190 routes? I'm not trying to make this into a pilot thread.

Also on a side note, as of right now, there will be 15 E190s left, would it be smart to put those on the shuttle routes? I know the shuttle requires about 15 airplanes. Flights are never full in coach so I would think they could get better loads on those and in return put the A319s on E190 routes that are always full.

- The west is keeping a few 737's because the lessor let us keep them in exchange for maintaining them. They are, more or less, free. And this is NOT a rumor.

- E190's are going. Parker (as he's stated many times) is getting rid of them to reduce ASM. The money is a bonus, but removing seats is the reason. And its a small fleet. ALL the E190's will be gone by the end of the year. And no, the company will not bring on more Airbuses to replace them.

 

[smoot4208]

- The west is keeping a few 737's because the lessor let us keep them in exchange for maintaining them. They are, more or less, free. And this is NOT a rumor.

- E190's are going. Parker (as he's stated many times) is getting rid of them to reduce ASM. The money is a bonus, but removing seats is the reason. And its a small fleet. ALL the E190's will be gone by the end of the year. And no, the company will not bring on more Airbuses to replace them.

Yeah I know they aren't getting additional airbus, but what I'm saying is that the current airbus order will replace the 737s one for one. So if they are keeping some 737s, then they actually will have a few extra airplanes they originally weren't counting on. So the question is will the "extra airplanes" replace E190 flights.
Also do you know how many 737s they are retaining and for how long? I assume they would still be off property by the end of 2012?

 

[HPDriver]

Yeah I know they aren't getting additional airbus, but what I'm saying is that the current airbus order will replace the 737s one for one. So if they are keeping some 737s, then they actually will have a few extra airplanes they originally weren't counting on. So the question is will the "extra airplanes" replace E190 flights.
Also do you know how many 737s they are retaining and for how long? I assume they would still be off property by the end of 2012?

The number is insignificant. I believe the company will only have two at the end of 2010 instead of the planned one.

 

[john john]

- The west is keeping a few 737's

Since you know for a fact. A FEW I take that as two maybe three

 

[cactusboy53]

- The west is keeping a few 737's because the lessor let us keep them in exchange for maintaining them. They are, more or less, free. And this is NOT a rumor.

Source please. We just dropped off N322AW. That leaves us with 14-15. Five more to go in the first quarter. The last one leaves late December 2010. This is according to a schedule that was shared during training.

 

[HPDriver]

Since you know for a fact. A FEW I take that as two maybe three

I'm hearing two - one more than planned for the end of 2010.

 

[Smokin Cubans]

The number is insignificant. I believe the company will only have two at the end of 2010 instead of the planned one.

Just a little info... the last 37 to leave the West is scheduled to be on Dec 24, 2010; or at least that's what the return group says.

 

[USA320Pilot]

Smot4208 asked: "Also on a side note, as of right now, there will be 15 E190s left, would it be smart to put those on the shuttle routes?"

USA320Pilot comments: US Airways requires 12 aircraft to operate the Shuttle unless the Triangle Aircraft Routing is used where an aircraft flies LGA-BOS-DCA or LGA-DCA-BOS, which requires an 11-aircraft operation. US Airways tried the Triangle routing and performance suffered. In response Andrew Norcella's Department decided to return to a 12-aircraft point-to-point operation.

If US Airways elects to use 12 of the remaining 15 E-190s on the Shuttle 3 aircraft would remain in the inventory for mainline service.

There are a number of inherent problems of using the E-190s on the Shuttle such as reducing Airbus flexibility in route plannning, decreased crew utilization by opening three small Shuttle Pilot Domiciles or increasing crew RON expenses if a Shuttle Crew Base is closed, E-190 maintenance provisioning, etc. All of these issues would increase Shuttle operating expenses and perofrmance.

According to US Airways' management at DCA-LGA Slot Transaction Employee Meetings the current Shuttle operation is profitable.

And, I believe US Airways offers a better Shuttle product than Delta and US Airways will have the preferred Shuttle Terminal in December. US Airways' Shuttle loads are increasing with some spillover/passenger defection from Delta because LGA-DCA customers prefer the A319 over the E-175 and BOS-DCA customers prefer the A319 over the CRJ-200.

In my opinion, it is not a cut and dry decision on whether putting the remaining E-190s on the Shuttle is a good or bad decision. Operating a small fleet type is generally not a smart business move because small fleet types have higher costs, US Airways' current Shuttle operation is superior to Delta's, and is currently profitable.

HPDriver said: "The west is keeping a few 737's because the lessor let us keep them in exchange for maintaining them. They are, more or less, free. And this is NOT a rumor."

USA320Pilot comments: At August CQT sessions B737 Check Airman briefed pilots going through recurrent training that the company has been offered by B737 lessors to keep some East and West B737s in US Airways service instead of returning the aircraft to the lessors. Apparently, the lessors do not have other customers for the used jets and they have made attractive offers to US Airways to keep some B737s in service. In my opinion, if US Airways can get attractive B737 lease rates management may elect to keep some of the B737s scheduled to be retired in service and remove E-190s instead.

Last week USAPA President Mike Cleary said, "Many believe, as do I, that conditions for industry consolidation are becoming more favorable. The elimination of a small fleet type not shared by a partner may be enough of an incentive to convince Management that their decision to sell E-190s is warranted."

In my opinion, Mike Cleary may be correct.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[BoeingBoy]

Parker (as he's stated many times) is getting rid of them to reduce ASM.

Well, technically Parker hasn't publicly said that US intended to get rid of the 190's. Unless I missed it (which is possible) Parker hasn't even said that US is getting rid of the 190's - he left that to Kirby. What he has said, beginning with the 1st quarter analyst's conference call (I think that was the first time), is that the 190's provided the only flexibility to reduce mainline capacity if needed.

All that said, since US was the only major carrier that saw a drop in load factor - traffic dropped more than capacity - it's not surprising that the 190's would be on the auction block.

Jim

 

[debbieb]

I was on a West 737 two weeks ago SNA-PHX and it was in pretty bad shape, really worn.

 

[iheartairbus]

I was on a West 737 two weeks ago SNA-PHX and it was in pretty bad shape, really worn.

They wouldn't be that bad.... if they put new seats in them, new bulkheads and took out a row of coach and added a row of f/c and added a bulkhead wall in front of 1 A & C new extended overhead bins and it would be not only appealing to the eye,but comfortable for the passengers oh and if they added a vaccum system to the lavs.

 

[700UW]

Even the East 737s dont have vacuum lavs, only the A330s, 767s and A320 family A/C have them.