Want afa-CWA representation? Just wait for the afa-CWA Raid

[aislehopper]

Today, Pat Friend, President of the afa-CWA, held a webcast for the Delta Organizing Drive. It ran almost two hours.

There were a couple of items that might be worth mentioning because they are applicable to the APFA.

First, Pat stated that it is the afa-CWA's goal to represent all flight attendants. (after 1:19 in webcast)IMHO, this means that she will stage a Raid on APFA if she is successful in organizing Delta.

Second, she discussed the seniority integration and stated that she was working with ex TWA flight attendants to legislatively extend recall rights (sometime around 1:19 into the webcast). IMHO, this will be the group that she uses to justify an APFA raid. Expect this quote "We were asked by a group of AA flight attendants to step in."

She actually used the term "watched in horror."

If you want to see the webcast, go to afa-CWA Delta Organizing Webcast . It has been archived.

Yes, I am stirring the pot a bit.

However, if you like APFA's representation, you should pass this link along to your leadership. Fighting off an afa-CWA raid will be very, very expensive and they should start planning now.

ah

 

[FA Mikey]

If AA thought they had it good with the APFA, wait until they get to deal with great afa who, managed to run themselves into receivership trying to organize Delta, over and over again. What to they think, third times the charm? Talk about a lesson, NOT learned.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Today, Pat Friend, President of the afa-CWA, held a webcast for the Delta Organizing Drive. It ran almost two hours.

There were a couple of items that might be worth mentioning because they are applicable to the APFA.

First, Pat stated that it is the afa-CWA's goal to represent all flight attendants. (after 1:19 in webcast)IMHO, this means that she will stage a Raid on APFA if she is successful in organizing Delta.

Second, she discussed the seniority integration and stated that she was working with ex TWA flight attendants to legislatively extend recall rights (sometime around 1:19 into the webcast). IMHO, this will be the group that she uses to justify an APFA raid. Expect this quote "We were asked by a group of AA flight attendants to step in."

She actually used the term "watched in horror."

If you want to see the webcast, go to afa-CWA Delta Organizing Webcast . It has been archived.

Yes, I am stirring the pot a bit.

However, if you like APFA's representation, you should pass this link along to your leadership. Fighting off an afa-CWA raid will be very, very expensive and they should start planning now.

ah

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Aislehopper,

It makes no difference if the union is crappy like afa/cwa....or powerful like the west coast Longshoremen to (sadly) the majority of union AAers.
Heres why.

AA's 3 unions have the majority of it's members in places like Tex-Ass, and Oklahoma, and "their" contract voting patterns(since AA moved down there from NY) proves that they are (SADLY) satisfied with the staus quo !

 

[donttouchthebeauty]

If AA thought they had it good with the APFA, wait until they get to deal with great afa who, managed to run themselves into receivership trying to organize Delta, over and over again. What to they think, third times the charm? Talk about a lesson, NOT learned.

FA Mikey, now come on... DAL f/a's need representation. Maybe AFA isn't the best - but as soon as the AFA came out with the webcast, Delta - for some reason, came out with "new" implementations to the contract. Delta f/a's do not have good work rules... and more than anything, whatever is given to them can be taken away, without a negotiation or bargaining... You should know a little about that - The APFA gave up many of your work rules with just the threat of BK... AFA carriers have way better work rules than any non AFA carrier.. Pay can be retrieved but work rules can generally not.. Seniority is another issue with Delta, when consolidation happens, Delta had better have a union... The management team at DAL has supposedly put together a letter stating that they assure the DAL flight attendants their seniority in the event of a merger. People are laughing histerically about this, I just returned from a trip and it must have been mentioned 10 times... It is such a joke... Let me ask you, Do you believe what Arpey tells you??? I hope not, b/c if you do you are in for a real surprise. Do you know that DAL has no published seniority list? Therefore they can schedule them how they want - skip numbers - rearrange bidding sequences etc... Did you know that they are not required to have 9 hours behind the door? Did you know that they don't have a 13 hour duty day? (which is still long)... Things need to change...

 

[IORFA]

You might think you know what Delta F/A's need, but I guess you and AFA have no idea since you are 0 for 2 in trying to organize them. Good luck the 3rd time. They are doing just fine with the treat of joining a union doing just fine for them. The only one it hurts is the AFA treasury, since they get pseudo union protection, without spending one dime. P.S. thanks for giving us the little lesson on what the company can do without a union, it really helped!!! By the way, are you fresh off the turnip truck, I mean new hire training?

 

[StraaightTaalk]

If AA thought they had it good with the APFA, wait until they get to deal with great afa who, managed to run themselves into receivership trying to organize Delta, over and over again. What to they think, third times the charm? Talk about a lesson, NOT learned.

Exactly. Pat Friend has bankrupted AFA trying to organize Delta over and over. The only reason she has not been tossed out on her ear is because the AFA membership at large does not even get to vote for the President of AFA. She is voted in by the various MECs.

Despite what Ms. Donttouch THINKS she knows, AFA folded like a cheap suit during the UA and US bankrutptcies. She thinks that APFA gave up work rules, such as duty rigs, etc. which we did not. UA and US AFA gave up the store. Personally, I think the Delta f/a's are going to laugh once again at AFA, and more millions of membership dollars go down the drain on another failed organizing drive.

Pat Friend's AFA is a big business, every bit as mercenary as the airlines they claim to fight. It is all about keeping HER in office.

Personally, I'd rather have my pension than have holiday pay.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

You might think you know what Delta F/A's need, but I guess you and AFA have no idea since you are 0 for 2 in trying to organize them. Good luck the 3rd time. They are doing just fine with the treat of joining a union doing just fine for them. The only one it hurts is the AFA treasury, since they get pseudo union protection, without spending one dime. P.S. thanks for giving us the little lesson on what the company can do without a union, it really helped!!! By the way, are you fresh off the turnip truck, I mean new hire training?

Ms. Donttouch has got issues. Her ultra-simplistic view of the airline world indicates that either she started flying in the last batch of UA newhires (and we've all heard how UA had to scrape the barrel to get people to work for their new hire pay), or is in la-la land, thinking she's educating the rest of us.

 

[IORFA]

Don't go confusing her with facts and common sense, it confuses her. She is just jealous that, at this point, we won't have to work till we are 100 like she will.

 

[StraaightTaalk]

You might think you know what Delta F/A's need, but I guess you and AFA have no idea since you are 0 for 2 in trying to organize them. Good luck the 3rd time. They are doing just fine with the treat of joining a union doing just fine for them. The only one it hurts is the AFA treasury, since they get pseudo union protection, without spending one dime. P.S. thanks for giving us the little lesson on what the company can do without a union, it really helped!!! By the way, are you fresh off the turnip truck, I mean new hire training?

 

[StraaightTaalk]

Don't go confusing her with facts and common sense, it confuses her. She is just jealous that,at this point, we won't have to work till we are 100 like she will.

So true!

 

[StraaightTaalk]

Pat Friend needs to read Greg Behrendt's book, "He's Just Not That Into You."

Delta flight attendants don't want AFA. They have demonstrated that time and again.

How long is Pat Friend going to keep beating that horse? Isn't it dead yet?

If I were an AFA member, and my dues money was going to organize Delta for the 3rd or 4th time, I'd be VERY angry.

If AFA is such a good deal, then why are the NWA flight attendants looking to jump ship again?

 

[donttouchthebeauty]

OH Jealous are we??? For a fact I have 8 years under my belt. I work 70 hours per month and I DO NOT rely on this job as my primary source of income (not that its any of your business anyway)... You are so dillusional to think that your pension will remain, if another downturn happens, they will be gone in the blink of an eye. If you would watch the webcast you would know that the AFA had enough involvement from DAL to hold an election last time and then the unfortunate events of 9/11... No matter what you MAY want to believe, my union didn't treat members unfair and they are much more desirable and stronger organization than most others. I would love to touch on the pension issue, first off I feel bad for people who lost theirs, It didn't matter much to me b/c at the time I didn't have much invested. You however, fell for the ultimate, they raped you with a threat, of pay and work rules WITHOUT BK.... UAL, US, NW had to enter BK to ammend OUR contracts... You gave more without BK, now when the time comes all they have to do is threaten or go into BK and take even more from you, since you already gave up alot. Maybe if the APFA is so fabulous then you should organize DAL... Pat Friend is no friend of mine, but she is correct when she says there is strength in numbers and all F/As should be under one umbrella... If you do not understand that - then there lies the problem... THERE IS strength in numbers. I know that you despise me, I know my comments burn you up, but the truth hurts and you show that you are miserable in most of your posts. I hate that for you... I enjoy my job but in no way do I refuse to look at other views etc.... I understood that long ago with this business, unfortunately you are stuck with one point of view and are not wanting to look left and right and then LEFT again, which is why you will get ran over sooner or later and I don't think I will call for help when it happens.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Beauty is RIGHT(this time)

Because even a bad union, is better than NO union(think TWU)

But it may be a moot point, if NW and DL "climb in the hay" with each other

Even if DL were to be the (hypothetical) survivor, the addition of NW F/A's voting on representation, would ensure that ALL the combined F/A's would be paying union dues to someone !

 

[FA Mikey]

Come on BEARS, right this time? I dont think so. Its a JR FA's speculating about CBA's of carrier that they know nothing about. Anyone can say Oh our CBA or our work rules are better. But better for who? I like the work rules here. One persons heaven is another's hell.

As the JR FA points out this is not their primary source of income. Pointing it out, and yet in the same sentence telling us all its none of our business. Here is a thought, if that were true, and the case simply keep it to yourself next time. I know I would jump at the chance to be a new hire at UAL sitting straight reserve just for the fun of it.

 

[IORFA]

Exactly Mike. Yet I find it funny she knows what we want and what Delta wants. Apparantly Delta F/A's don't want a union. Maybe she should figure out what her co-workers want first. I can't tell you how many times I get the real scoop on the EL on the way to work. It cracks me up. I also love all the false statements about how our work rules were "gutted". That is my personal favorite. I guess the AFA propaganda machine is in high gear. So after the next failure at organizing the Delta F/A's happens, which union is AFA-CWA going to "merge" with next? Maybe they can join AMFA and really make a difference. Pun intended. Just a thought about that stregth in numbers thing. How is that working for the SW Pilots and I think FedEx pilots (maybe UPS)? I think they are doing just fine without ALPA. It all really depends on how unified your individual work group or Local is. That is what gets the companies attention. DTTB, by the way since you have such a good crystal ball, regarding our future contract including our pension. Why did you not see how far the company you chose to work for would fall. Seems that you made a bad choice.