Us Planning Something In Fll

[mwereplanes]

New crew base in FLL. Announcement forthcoming. Any crews who wish to be based there must pay the company a "new base fee" of 25 bucks per segment flown. However, any new FLL based crewmember will be permitted unlimited pretzels and peanuts on any flight segment over 5250 miles.

mr

 

[enilria]

FAMikey is right. There is no reason why US should try to compete in the NE-Caribbean market via FLL.

I'm not saying this is a good idea for them as an academic exercise, I'm saying IT SEEMS IT IS AN IMMINENT REALITY.

I agree completely with your points that flying to the former MetroJet markets is stupid and they have already proven they can't compete, but the fact is that by announcing LGA-FLL a few weeks ago in the face of Jet Blue they have already proved that they don't agree with either of our assessments.

BDL-FLL, BOS-FLL, BWI-FLL; these are no more surprising than LGA-FLL which is a reality already.

 

[LGA Fleet Service]

If another member of the Waffen AA might point out something,

jetblue? 12+ JFK-FLL alone, and 7 LGA-FLL in the Fall.


AA is the least of your problems in FLL...

 

[enilria]

Let me also say, while this FLL idea is questionable, compared to the other things they are pursuing it is far smarter.

PIT/PHL
They have closed down their hub in PIT in favor of putting more capacity into PHL where WN is expanding rapidly and the ATC is a mess. While they need to defend their turf, let's not kid ourselves --- adding capacity in existing markets always reduces profits. With both WN and US adding capacity, it will be ugly.

DCA
While DCA has traditionally been good, ACA/IAir has just added 300 freakin' departures from IAD. US has picked this same time to add seats at DCA by upgrading their flights to jets from props and Rjs. This won't be great either, but they are again defending their turf.

So, in both these cases they are taking capacity from essentially a monopolistic hub in PIT and moving the planes to places where the competition is much greater. They need to do this to fight off competitors, but neither has much chance of doing anything but pushing them further into the red.

FLL
This FLL thing attempts to build on the success of the Caribbean which they keep saying is the only bright spot they've got. It's risky, but the other stuff they're doing is sure to reduce profits, while this at least has some small chance of success. I guess those of you who work there should be glad they are doing more than crawling into a hole while they wait for the upcoming mauling from WN.

 

[NAPAUS]

If another member of the Waffen AA might point out something,

jetblue? 12+ JFK-FLL alone, and 7 LGA-FLL in the Fall.


AA is the least of your problems in FLL...

AMEN BROTHER!!! Enough already from the nazis at AA. They are scared that we are rapidly encroaching on THEIR carribean.....They forget our prsence on the east coast!! I say GO FOR FLL...BIG TIME!!!!!!

 

[nycbusdriver]

Offshore airports (east coast) that do not need an international arrivals terminal and customs:

NAS, FPO, BDA and AUA (foreign ports with US Customs and Immigration pre-clearance facilities.)

STX, STT, and SJU (these are the major airports in U.S. possessions off the east coast. There are other minor airports in this category.)

 

[MAH4546]

People from the islands are looking for easy ways to and from S. Florida just like everybody else is. The airport is much more user friendly than MIA, from parking to accessibility, to concessions... etc. Ask anyone around, they'd much rather travel through FLL. Just because they know the airport doesn't really matter. Besides, it's less than 25 miles from anywhere in Miami.



I'll defend the POSSIBILITY.... there are certainly some valid points being brought up as to why the FLL-focus may not work out... and yes, it will take some time (and concessions) to change this airline into something that works and is consistently profitable. AA is nowhere near as untouchable as FA Mikey may lead us to believe... it is easy to feel comfortable at the top and look down on the small guys. Just ask anyone who worked for TW in its glory days. Nonetheless, as already suggested, the competition in S Fla is very stiff, decreasing CASM is still questionable, etc. Not to mention, FLL needs a new second main runway in order to support any more expansion. So suffice to say, to turn this venture into a viable opportunity, there are some hurtles to be jumped. But nothing is impossible.

Concessions at FLL suck, especially at T4 where most international arrivals (those that don't pre-clear) arrive. That is one area (of few) where MIA scores above.

And immigration at FLL is getting to be very hectic now that international traffic has exploded at the airport. They very much need another international terminal.

As for the growth at FLL, I think it is a smart thing. And they don't need connections from the northeast to fill up Caribbean flights...orgin & destination will do it. The problem is that expansion won't go uncontested. And I'm not talking about Spirit Airlines responding, I'm talking about American Airlines. They fly FLL-PAP/SDQ/CCS/NAS to make sure they remain dominant in those markets (not surprisingly, they are five of the four largest international O&D markets out of the Miami area), and AA has FLL-GUA and FLL-SJO are in the waiting room. A US Airways FLL announcement is just the thing to set them off. American Airlines considers Ft. Lauderdale/Hollywood, where they recently overtook WN to be #2 at the airport, to be their turf, and they do protect it very well (i.e. jetBlue announces FLL-LGB, AA announces 3rd daily FLL-LAX; Song announced FLL-LAX, AA announces 4th daily FLL-LAX; Spirit announces FLL-SJU, AA announces 4th daily FLL-SJU...)

 

[LGA Fleet Service]

AMEN BROTHER!!! Enough already from the nazis at AA. They are scared that we are rapidly encroaching on THEIR carribean.....They forget our prsence on the east coast!! I say GO FOR FLL...BIG TIME!!!!!!

You do understand when I say "Another member of the Waffen AA" I am refering to myself don't you?

You missed the point about FLL altogether.

Besides the AA service in FLL you will have to contend with jetblue's 12+ daily JFK-FLL frequencies as well as the 7 daily LGA-FLL frequencies that will be starting in the fall, as well as Song.

By all means "Go for FLL big time"

Sehr Gut!

 

[USAir757]

American Airlines considers Ft. Lauderdale/Hollywood, where they recently overtook WN to be #2 at the airport, to be their turf, and they do protect it very well (i.e. jetBlue announces FLL-LGB, AA announces 3rd daily FLL-LAX; Song announced FLL-LAX, AA announces 4th daily FLL-LAX; Spirit announces FLL-SJU, AA announces 4th daily FLL-SJU...)

[post="166401"][/post]​

AA keeps up in FLL moreso because they need to protect their network south of MIA more than they need to protect FLL itself. They connect a very small percentage of passengers through FLL... that's what MIA is for (where of course they service many more destinations in Carib/SA, etc). By AA having the FLL-PAP, -SDQ, -NAS, etc, they are keeping competitive almost exclusively with local traffic, not connecting. Therefore, if US wants to make FLL-Caribbean work for them, they must tap into the old BWI-FLL, BUF-FLL, BDL-FLL, BOS-FLL markets to provide the traffic. Of course, however, it all goes back to being able to cut costs enough to remain competitive.

jetblue? 12+ JFK-FLL alone, and 7 LGA-FLL in the Fall.


AA is the least of your problems in FLL...

In this case above, US doesn't need to concentrate as much on B6 because they are not likely to book connecting travel through an airport like FLL. NK may however, and that's an area that is still a question mark.

 

[RowUnderDCA]

Who is the largest operator at FLL?

 

[phllax]

Delta is probably the largest in terms of available seats, considering most flights from ATL are 767's of all 3 series. AA might be number 1 in terms of departures.

I am surprised that Terminal 1 was not designed or built with a customs and immigration area. It would seem to be a no-brainer to me. T4 can be nasty, especially on Saturday's during caribbean cruise season and when there are a lot of Canadian charters. If they moved all the Canadian flights to Concourse E, where US currently is, then there may be room for US in the international terminal, with only Air Jamaica, Cayman and Avianca being forced to use it.

The other, more costly and time consuming option, would be to continue using Concourse E, but instead of having an int'l arrival pull up to the jetway, they could use air-stairs and bus the people to the int'l terminal to clear, and then just re-check bags. The plane could then be cleaned, and towed the last few feet to the gate. Also, if they realigned E1, they might be able to squeeze another narrowbody gate between there and the Delta terminal.

Regardless, things have gotten pretty tight in FLL these past few years and there are very few, if any, gates available. Combine that with the fact that there is really only 1 runway for jets, and FLL is probably near capacity at certain times of the day.

 

[enilria]

I have a few more bits of information...

1) I think it's well known that many of the Caribbean destinations have been giving "incentives" to US Airways (and everybody else but AA) to eliminate much of the risk US Airways would normally face in expanding there. The reason these destinations give incentives is that they HATE the 400 pound gorilla, AA. Read any trade publication for the region and the headlines are always: "<INSERT ISLAND> looks for ways to reduce dependence on American Airlines" or "<INSERT ISLAND> recognizes need for competition to bring down fares".

It's also of note that FLL is very aggressive in waving fees to get new service. The mating of these two things would reduce US's risk considerably.

2) I believe new schedules load in Sabre on Saturday nights...so if they are announcing this week it would probably load tonight. They can't wait too much longer as the Holidays are already booking heavily in the Caribbean so waiting much longer would really hurt their results.

 

[MAH4546]

AA keeps up in FLL moreso because they need to protect their network south of MIA more than they need to protect FLL itself. They connect a very small percentage of passengers through FLL... that's what MIA is for (where of course they service many more destinations in Carib/SA, etc). By AA having the FLL-PAP, -SDQ, -NAS, etc, they are keeping competitive almost exclusively with local traffic, not connecting.

Exactly correct. MIA/FLL are the same O&D market, and AA knows this, so they do protect their turf at FLL. And if US Airways moves in, regardless of wether they are going for the local traffic or O&D, AA will not stand still about it. They will open up more FLL routes to protect their market share against other carriers.

Therefore, if US wants to make FLL-Caribbean work for them, they must tap into the old BWI-FLL, BUF-FLL, BDL-FLL, BOS-FLL markets to provide the traffic. Of course, however, it all goes back to being able to cut costs enough to remain competitive.
In this case above, US doesn't need to concentrate as much on B6 because they are not likely to book connecting travel through an airport like FLL. NK may however, and that's an area that is still a question mark.

[post="166457"][/post]​

I think there are too many problems with aiming at connecting traffic. Firstly there is Charlotte's Caribbean operations. This relies heavily on connecting traffic. Why move it through FLL, a key O&D market to the Caribbean (not only in leisure, but business passengers too). The point with FLL service is exactly that it provides a lucrative base to expand in the Caribbean with lucrative O&D traffic. You will find buisness passengers on routes like FLL-GCM (MIA-GCM is a huge business route) and you have oppurtunities to open up new markets that PHL and CLT can't really support (even with connections) like POS, thanks to O&D. Plus, connecting would be hell at FLL, since international arrivals are all at T4, and US Airways gates are at T3.

I am curious to see US move foward with this, I think they can do well, even though the market is competetive.

As for the largest carriers at FLL, in passenger terms it is DL, AA, WN, B6, US, in that order. In departures, I believe (not 100% sure) it is the same, just AA and WN switch spots.

 

[ringmaruf]

I've been meaning to ask, is there room in US's existing terminal for a US Airways Club?

 

[TransatlanticFlyGuy]

Folks....there will be pleanty of room for us in FLL. Just wait and see.