bOBCAT: i read your whole intire post and really took it to heart. I have never really understood from my little "perch' just what your job was all about. You have educated me today, and I thank you for this. I too, was on these boards for a long time and learned alot. Some on here have (as you have) educated me, inlightened me and infuriated me. You have made me cry to night . I can tell you have so much heart in all of this. I do too. I too, want this company to survive and I am a brotheren in all that you have said. I don't have or do your job, but I can tell from what you posted that WE Are USAIR employees, hoping for a better future for all of us. Thank you !!!!!!
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Us Airways Flight Attendants Demand Detailed Busin
- Thread starter 700UW
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usfliboi
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- Aug 20, 2002
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Ill do what it takes..... I dont see them asking afa group for a whole lot since we frankly dont make a whole lot now however there are some productivity changes that could happen that would help. With our "me too" clause however I think we wont have much choice there . I dont like it no more than you. I remember the nice long layovers and shorter day, more money etc. Those days are all but gone. Unfort we wont have any control over what the pilots give and im sure they arent concerned that we shot our selves in the foot with the "me too" clause. They will do whats best for alpa, and afa will for AFA.AP Tech said:
OK now THAT was funny...usfliboi said:
Fliboi, I think I see where you are coming from now. You seriously think U won't be asking for much from the F/A group because you already don't make much? That explains why you are so eager for everyone to hurry up and accept another haircut, if you think all the "other" groups will be taking a big hit and you won't be.
Dude. If you want to keep giving until it hurts, go for it. But if you really think management gives a crap that you are already not making alot so they couldn't POSSIBLY ask for too much more, you are going to be in for a rude awakening.
Plus consider the other labor groups. Do you really think ALPA and IAM and CWA will agree to a plan to give, say, 15% with AFA giving, say, 3%, with the disparity being explained away as "because the F/As already don't make very much?"
Don't think so.
usfliboi
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- Aug 20, 2002
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tHERE YOU GO AGAIN!!!!!!!!! It was implied im eager (since i believe afa wont be asked for much) that im "eager" for that very reason and that i want other unions to take the brunt. As usual you didnt understand and posted about something you didnt understand. In other words u jumped in on a conversation .... But hey Im glad i keep you on top of your toes. Obviously you enjoy my opinions or u enjoy debates....700UW said:
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Nope, I just point out the obvious inaccuracies in your postings. I see the truth finally comes out, you want everyone else to sacrifice instead of yourself! Any relation to A320Pilot?usfliboi said:
Implied? Now we are suppose to read your mind?
You should be ashamed of being a union member, it is totally apparent that you know nothing about Trade Unionism and what it means to be a Union Member, not a Member of Union.
Labor union: an organization of workers formed for the purpose of advancing its members' interests in respect to wages, benefits, and working conditions .
Here is a poem written by the famous Author Jack London, read it!
The Scab
"After God had finished the rattlesnake, the toad, and the vampire, he had some awful substance left with which he made a scab."
"A scab is a two-legged animal with a corkscrew soul, a water brain, a combination backbone of jelly and glue. Where others have hearts, he carries a tumor of rotten principles."
"When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the devil shuts the gates of hell to keep him out."
"No man (or woman) has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with. Judas was a gentleman compared with a scab. For betraying his master, he had character enough to hang himself." A scab has not.
"Esau sold his birthright for a mess of pottage. Judas sold his Savior for thirty pieces of silver. Benedict Arnold sold his country for a promise of a commision in the british army." The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer.
Esau was a traitor to himself; Judas was a traitor to his God; Benedict Arnold was a traitor to his country; a scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class."
Author --- Jack London (1876-1916)
usfliboi
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
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DUDE ! Obviously I could use many words to describe attitudes like yours but i wont. Ive been a union member for 17 yrs but in no way shape or form am i a fanatical. I will do what I feel is best for me as well as the company and you can sink your own ship with your "crap" if you want to . I feel for you I really do . I dont need to explain to you nor you to me. In fact i will not "debate" you on any issue again because it is obvious to me and MANY others your def not going to be rational about anything....
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Lets see attitude?usfliboi said:
If being fanatical is standing up for your rights and defending your contract then call me a fanatic, I bet the British called Washington a fanatic too.
Dave has lied to the employees time after time, they have violated every single labor agreement on the property, hundreds of outstanding grievances remain.
20,000 employees laid off.
Take concessions and we will save the company, 10 weeks later Bronner Threatens employees give us more or we will liquidate. 18 months later they are wanting more. Ask the TWA employees they gave time after time and now they are still out of a job.
Distress termination of Pilot's pension after Dave and Jerry tells ALPA, take concessions to save your pension.
Orders 76 seat RJs to be placed at affilates violating ALPA's contract days after settling on language that prevents anything over a 70 seater to be flown by an affilate.
Violates F/A contract with involuntary furloughs before offering voluntary as contract states. (twice).
Violates IAM Mechanic and Related contract with outsourcing of A320 maintenance.
Dave tells all we will give our laid off members jobs at MAA, then wants no utility, no stock clerks, part time mechanics and vendor out all work deemed necessary.
Do I need to continue?
If you can actually trust the inept leadership of this company to honor anything they agree to, then you need to call the EAS and seek help.
I am not sinking this ship, I did not run this company off the blood, sweat and tears of the employees. Last time I check Siegel runs the company not I.
This leadership fails to enact any cost savings that the hard working employees have told them time after time after time. (Ask Pineybob about the information he collected from the employees to help save the company money and it went on deaf ears.)
This executive rules on fear and intimidation, how much is too much to give back? When you have to pay them to come to work? You really need to educate yourself on the facts (oh wait, I forget you don't use them) and see what really happened and take of your rose colored glasses and get a does of reality.
I will state it very plain and simple, NO AIRLINE HAS EVER BEEN SAVED OFF OF EMPLOYEE CONCESSIONS.
I am very rational and very factual, you just seem to believe anything Dave tells you and you take it for gospel, learn the facts and educate yourself, and I for one will not give a cent to subsidise the shareholders or anyother employee group.
usfliboi
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
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You still dont get it do you? All the half facts you state! This isnt about Dave!!!!!!!!!!!! Wheres your facts about the industry . Wheres you facts about the economy ! Wheres your facts about who really got the company where it is today ? Wheres your facts about US pay scale and work rules for the past 10 to 15 years and that might be a reason why we are where we are? Where are your facts about why "unions" played a big role in where this company is today ? Where are your facts about anything that has to do with DAVE not being the sole problem. Dave has a job and thats to do what he has to do and has a fudicairy responsiblity to the board and shareholders . If you think for one moment that any AND I DO MEAN ANY..... other ceo/ ppres wouldnt come in here and cut even further your in for an unpleasant surprise my friend.
jetmech01890
Advanced
dont take 700uw dionsaur too serious he has had some trouble since mamagment took his chairs and he cant think standing up a true caveman
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- #43
First of all, I think you need to get your facts in order, #1, I do not work in the station where the chairs were removed.jetmech01890 said:
Second you don't know me, my job, my bid area and my station.
And sorry if I am still employed at US and you are not, seniority rules, don't take your anger out on me.
And if you are doing so well, why do you keep coming back for more?
hi guy...still in the whine mode,eh?jetmech01890 said:
wasn't 'fer us old farts how would you have gotten this far in life sonny boy?
at some point some old fart showed you which way the wrench twists,eh?
here you go...i'll tell you where you can get off:
PITbull
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- Dec 29, 2002
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USfliboi,usfliboi said:
Where we are today? That unions played a part in where we are today?
The union played a part in negotiating a contract for which you were able to last 17 years. Otherwise, you would not have a job today, because all managements would have kept conditions at FAA min. on all a/c. Because of the "no furlough" language we had since 1992, you stayed on and were paid at a wage you brag about now, keeping yourself out of debt.
Where we are today is because of the general economy, 9/11, security problems, mismanagment with no vision, etc...
Unions have stepped up to the plate every single time. Management told us what they needed the last two concessions and EVERYONE GAVE THEM THE BOOGY NUMBERS THEY REQUIRED. Every concession creates more job losses across the company...in our particular group, the next round YOU, and I mean YOU will become reserve.
Your union fights for you every single day. If its not you, than it is for your collegues who are emotionally struggling with how severe their quality of life has been impacted with all these changes. WE haven't had a chance to adapt and come of for air. Those changes are effecting every aspect of the employees working life, where they spend most of their waking hours. To add insult to injury, we have a managment team that continues to violate agreements and make policies that punish folks for just living their lives, and attempting to have a life outside of their employer.
700UW is trying to emphasize that historically NO company survives on just employee concessions. So far, management has been much less than genuine (and I'll be nice) on what effects these concessions would have and furloughs. They said that there would be jobs for the furloughees through MAA. This Division still is not running, and just like a poster said, as fast as the RJs are coming in they are being outsourced to other affiliates. There is specualtion that the W/O may be sold. So what happened to that "soft landing"? Management states that the financing is all of a sudden in jeopardy. MAA may never happen.
You want to blame labor....that's why you part company with most of the posters...you do not allow yourself to think freely, other than the NEED you have and the affinity you have for this company and management.
