Us Airways And Alpa

[4lowed]

All,

Passed Over stated: "But will MDA really get off the ground if the ALG employees don't cave into the demands of senior management as there will be no certificate for MDA to operate under ??? And once again the wholly owned employess groups are being told to give up everything to save the the mailine my gag reflex is about worn out "

Passed Over MDA is operating under the mainline certifificate. There is no need for them to use the ALG certificate. I don't know anything about the ALG certificate, but does anyone know if ALG has approvals on their certificate to fly anything larger than 50 seats? If not the certificate is worthless to MDA anyway. Getting larger aircraft approval to the certificate requires a CSET review, and is just as cumbersome as appying for a new certificate.

4lowed

 

[Diesel8]

At this point, a merger with Mesa would increase pay on the E-170.

Someone just got sold down the proverbial river!

 

[autofixer]

What was the pay rate on the F-28 over 10 years ago? Nearly identical seating capacity with the E-170. Great job ALPA! But I guess everyone's seat on the negotiating committee is safe....for now and that is all that really matters. I am sorry for the hate and venom I am spewing, I just can't believe what has been done to the profession in such a short time. The most shocking part of all this is the unions are ready and willing to destroy the profession to keep their sorry bottoms in the air.

 

[PITbull]

Bob,

Folks love fly'in but not at any cost to themselves. Not all of us are "knuckleheads" and would sell our souls to the devil for a passion.

This poster is one of those types. B)


Pilots fly in all types of inclimate weather and control a piece of equipment worth millions of dollars and have lives in their hands, whether it be a 37 seater to a 500 seater a/c, they are certainly worth much, much more for that ultimate responsibility and skill than what MAA is offering.


Sad to say this, but our company really doesn't deserve to stay in business with these types of managment people running our company that don't see any value in this skill and are not willing to reward these types of professionals in our industry.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Hi Bob,

A couple of clarifications for your post...

1) Because of the nature of the job (being away from home base), probably 40% of pilots can't attend the meetings because of work schedule. Another 20% or so don't make the effort because it would mean flying in from where they actually live (think of the pilot who lives in CLT but has been displaced to PHL - he is in the PHL "council" and his representatives have their meetings there)(or the pilot that commutes from Florida to CLT). The end result is that a minority of pilots actually attend the meetings. Of course any pilot could (and more should) contact their representatives and let them know their feelings known.

2) The latest changes affect MDA and the ongoing negotiations will possibly affect MDA, the W/O's, and determine (apparently) who get which and how many of the RJ's (including e-170's). The people affected by this are furloughed or W/O pilots who have no say in "mainline" ALPA decision making - no vote & no voice. That's where the oft-seen phrase "ALPA eats its young" partially comes from. Unfortunately, there are enough people with the attitude of "give up whatever it takes for me to keep mine" that the result is that those with the least power (votes) get the short end of the stick.

Jim

 

[PITbull]

Bob,

I'm still making a living at it that's why. Would I go to MAA. No! Hell No!

You don't know what my passions are. And when I'm 80, I will be just like Lilly, and do what I love. At that point, you don't have to worry about supporting a family. Main thing, is to stay healthy so you can get to 80.

Passions not always pay the bills. And unfortunately folks have to eat, support themselves and their families. That's reality, the rest is BS.

Orstein is just one CEO, just like Lorenzo, and Icahn, who did not have staying power in this industry. Orstein's book, along with Siegel's is not finished being written now is it?

 

[usfliboi]

Pit I agree with your post concerning what pilots do ! However, the passion you feel unfortunatly will not be supported in the end by the union that burns the flame under you. Id say my friend watch yourself because I assure you in the end the union will know whats best for itself and its few remaining members.

 

[756pro]

Pit I agree with your post concerning what pilots do ! However, the passion you feel unfortunatly will not be supported in the end by the union that burns the flame under you. Id say my friend watch yourself because I assure you in the end the union will know whats best for itself and its few remaining members.

I'd say from observation Pit is not your friend and I assure you that what's best for the union members is not in your best interest which also is obvious.

 

[BlackOps]

In 1993, Allegheny applied for a "Certificate of Public Conveyance" which limited its aircraft capacity to 50 seats, as the company didn't anticipate flying anything bigger. All that is needed for 70 seat authorization is a minor paperwork filing.

Allegheny has already written the Bombardiaer ground school cirriculum, so it would just be simple matter of adding employees and airplanes.

Duane Woerth tried to get the ALG MEC to sign its life away, but it didn't work. Now ALPA has its teat in the wringer. One can only wonder what ALPA's treatment of ALG will do to the public relations campaign it launched on the cover of Air Line Pilot, where it went all out to try and get smaller member pilot groups to believe that ALPA really cares about them.

 

[Furloughedagain]

The truly sad result of the new MDA payrates is how significantly they "lower-the-bar" and dramatically reduce bargaining power at many airlines who are currently negotiating (including ASA, Air Wisconsin, etc).

By agreeing to payrates that are significantly less than Horizon or Comair's, US Airways ALPA has also opened the door for airline management at DOZENS of properties to go back to their own pilot groups seeking to open concessionary talks.

I understand the challenges that US Airways faces but they do not operate in a vacuum. The decisions that ALPA makes at US Airways impacts other pilot groups.

I would have expected this from an aggressive regional (Mesa), but never from a major airline. You are starting up a division that will be crewed by pilots with more experience than any regional airline in the COUNTRY. That has value!! Why should you be paid less than a pilot for AirTran, or Jetblue, or even Comair??? What is the difference between an EMB170/175 and an F100, BAe146, Bac1-11, CRJ700, DC9-10, etc..?

But what is done is done.

I am curious though what other "scope relief" Siegel is asking for.

It seems to me that he can operate or contract-out a virtually unlimited number of airplanes 70 seats an below...

What in the world could he possibly be asking for NOW... and (the truly frightening part), how many more jobs will it cost?

 

[U 737 PILOT]

The MDA pay rate issue will come back to bite the company in the butt. Furloughed pilots will come back to fly at MDA, but not because they want to. They will return mainly for one reason. Many furloughees have not flown or have flown very little since being furloughed. They will come back for the type rating and to get current flying again. Then they will move on to other carriers with better pay and benefits and job stability. Several MDA check airmen have already bailed for Jetblue. The turnover and associated training cost for MDA will be very high. The pay at MDA is an insult and the company and ALPA should be ashamed of themselves for setting the bar to a new low !