United conserving cash while angering both customers and employees

[ThirdSeatHero]

The details for VSP that are posted here, are for the IAM represented employees - The Mechanics at UAL are teamsters.

While we've received nothing yet in writing, we have been briefed locally that due to poor participation in the VSP by MX that a financial incentive could be added in the near future but NOT to expect anything close to our last buyout (previous buyout was up to 100K)

 

[swamt]

The details for VSP that are posted here, are for the IAM represented employees - The Mechanics at UAL are teamsters.

While we've received nothing yet in writing, we have been briefed locally that due to poor participation in the VSP by MX that a financial incentive could be added in the near future but NOT to expect anything close to our last buyout (previous buyout was up to 100K)

Well then, I guess the co. is not going to get serious about the VSP's. Just like our company found out last time, if you do not at least offer a years salary, then you will not get the numbers the co. wants to see. It has to be a minimum of a years salary to get people interested and puts them in a better position to be "ABLE" to do it. I have no clue United mechs hourly rate but take that times the typical 2080 hours and that is what the buy out program "should" look like if they want to see the numbers they expect to take it, otherwise, they are just wasting their time.
Our co. only offered 75K in freedom 09, and they didn't get close to the number of people from MX that they wanted, as well as Pilots and F/A's. If it would have been 90-100K you would have seen a much larger participation. With our current rate the offer would have to be approx 115,00 to 125,00. It's a no brainer that for folks to even consider leaving earlier than planned on, it has to be at least a years salary.

TSH, please let us know if some incentives comes your way. Ours is being announced today and I will update.

 

[eolesen]

Now this is an interesting article that if I'm reading correctly is not good for United.
In this article it says that United's "passenger volumes" went from 6% up 12% for the mid April to mid May time period. Am I comprehending this correctly as Load Factor?

I did the math - that's a year over year comparison. The airline was running at about 18% of its schedule compared to 2019, and if you assume a load factor of 30-45% like the other airlines are saying would come to that 6-12% year over year.

 

[swamt]

I did the math - that's a year over year comparison. The airline was running at about 18% of its schedule compared to 2019, and if you assume a load factor of 30-45% like the other airlines are saying would come to that 6-12% year over year.

Gotcha--thanks.

 

[swamt]

The details for VSP that are posted here, are for the IAM represented employees - The Mechanics at UAL are teamsters.

While we've received nothing yet in writing, we have been briefed locally that due to poor participation in the VSP by MX that a financial incentive could be added in the near future but NOT to expect anything close to our last buyout (previous buyout was up to 100K)

As promised here are some quick info about our packages being offered at SWA.
6-12 or 18 month Extended Emergency Time Off, Ex ETO. While on leave receive approx 1/2 pay for each month. But co. could call ya back if neede with a 30 days notice for return.
The Early Out is a years pay, years co paid health ins., flight benny's.
Last time, F-09, they offered 75K on the EO's
They are pretty serious this time around. I hope we get a lot of takers on these for the sake of our younger guys and gals.
We have even more and better details in our co. emails but I do not have permission to post.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/southwest-offers-buyouts-ensure-survival-155458833.html

 

[Kev3188]

Speaking just for myself, I’d jump at 18 mos. at 50% pay. I’d love to take a paid sabbatical.

 

[swamt]

Speaking just for myself, I’d jump at 18 mos. at 50% pay. I’d love to take a paid sabbatical.

LOL.
I am tossing around the 12 month one myself.
1 year, still maintaining all benefits, ins., seniority, and quite possibly accruing sick time too. The problem will be finding things to do and keep busy for a full year. I am now hearing of more and more guys are going to take it too.

 

[eolesen]

Word is out that 10% of UA management took a package.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

LOL.
I am tossing around the 12 month one myself.
1 year, still maintaining all benefits, ins., seniority, and quite possibly accruing sick time too. The problem will be finding things to do and keep busy for a full year. I am now hearing of more and more guys are going to take it too.

swamt,

I'm thinking that guys @ AA,UA,WN, who have Union contractual language, will 'roll-the-dice' knowing that they'd HAVE to be recalled within whatever time frame the contract says, will NOT be severing 'all-strings' with their respective companies.

 

[swamt]

swamt,

I'm thinking that guys @ AA,UA,WN, who have Union contractual language, will 'roll-the-dice' knowing that they'd HAVE to be recalled within whatever time frame the contract says, will NOT be severing 'all-strings' with their respective companies.

I agree. Just hoping there are enough folks to take the VSP/E.O. (at my co.) as well as the leave programs and temp time off, ExTO, in order to avoid the layoffs or rifs. I know we will be a smaller airline as we come out of it, but question is for how long and could Southwest stretch it out without any layoffs or rifs? Just to get us back to the norm, hopefully by beginning of 2021 or at least in the spring. But some airline execs are still calling out the 3 year recover time frame, although that might be for the international carriers. We will all see. Keep hearing of good news that the LF's and passengers numbers continue to go up as we head into the summer flying months, and again, HOPEFULLY, this trend will continue thru summer months and stay for years end. Even AA has announced better numbers as well as seeing an end to the cash burn by years end. Now, what are they looking at and going to activate in order to get to the end of cash burn is a whole other story. Maybe they are using the layoffs and rifs to see the end of the cash burn IDK.

 

[jimntx]

LOL.
I am tossing around the 12 month one myself.
1 year, still maintaining all benefits, ins., seniority, and quite possibly accruing sick time too. The problem will be finding things to do and keep busy for a full year. I am now hearing of more and more guys are going to take it too.

I thought I was going to have a problem with the "something to do" issue when I retired. Mostly because I worked at some kind of job from age 15 until I retired from AA at age 72. Turns out I'm very good at doing not much of anything. My next door neighbors are both retired and they are almost never home with their "stuff that needs doing" like volunteer work, etc. I hope never to get that busy. But, if you get bored there are many opportunities for volunteer work especially in the field of instructing young people in the work you have done for years. Just sayin'. If that doesn't work, I bet your spouse will have no problem assembling a "Honey do" list for your entertainment. LOL

 

[swamt]

Well, maybe United is getting smarter. Still not sure if their bump up will still get the numbers from the F/A's. But why only bump them? Why not the other groups?? So I will say, with the better medical offer it may help to get more.
Anyone have info on the mechanics offers???

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/united-airlines-sweetens-voluntary-exit-044500809.html

 

[T5towbar]

Well, maybe United is getting smarter. Still not sure if their bump up will still get the numbers from the F/A's. But why only bump them? Why not the other groups?? So I will say, with the better medical offer it may help to get more.
Anyone have info on the mechanics offers???

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/united-airlines-sweetens-voluntary-exit-044500809.html

That offer you are reading was just announced yesterday. emails were sent out to us late.
All work groups have been offered this in conjunction / addition to the VSP2 offer.
No cash will be in any offer though, because the company is trying to hold on to all the cash they can. (they are hoping for zero cash burn by the end of the year or Q1 of 2021)
The question (about buyout cash) was asked in the Q&A sessions, and the response in so many words that since other airlines made more money than us, they can offer more than we can. So every offer has no cash component. Those of us (on the sCO side still have CARP) and is still funded and can be used in a retirement package. That is a considering factor as well, being if it may not be funded in the future, and no one wants to lose that money. But they need as many of the people who are ready to go to leave, but they should offer some cash (or a better bridge medical) to get the numbers they need. IMHO, this is an attempt to do so.
Personally, I know quite a few people who are putting in their papers. Some of the older people that would survive this would now have to do some REAL WORK and can't hide anymore, since there will be no more cushy jobs or schedules anywhere. They are seeing the writing on the wall, and really considering leaving.

So I don't know how things will be in the end but you will get a sense of things next month when the WARN letters come.

 

[swamt]

T5 I agree there should be some sort of buyout $$ offered with it as well.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Some of the older people that would survive this would now have to do some REAL WORK and can't hide anymore, since there will be no more cushy jobs or schedules anywhere. They are seeing the writing on the wall, and really considering leaving.

that's exactly the case in my station. a few guys in their 70s and others who come to work with a cane or can't drive at night. they have enough time to continue to hide. still some shifts that are nice hiding spots. they may have 36 years but a pm shift with tuesday/wednesday off. they don't care.

these guys will never leave. never. the money would have to be astronomical for them to even consider. money the airline would never offer.