UAL & CAL possibly merging

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shaka said:
after further ananlysis...I have come to the conclusion that it will be very difficult for a proposed merger to be approved in this current administration.

Just had seen a lot of opinions presented on the board and did a little more research on the matter. The further research solidified my opinion.

Hope that reasoning did not confuse you.
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If theirs a will their way. I am not saying it will be easy. DOJ would object if they would have total control of a market for example DC area. That was one of the reason UA/US didn't get approved. Most of the markets they share with one more airlines. EWR, IAH, SFO, LAX, ORD, CLE, BOS and IAD would pass due to competition from other airlines nearby. Also if anything they'll be asking them to give up slots/routes in those cities pairs that they believe unfair competition. Biggest obstacle would be labor and many promises have to be made like that it would satisfy DOJ.
 
MERV said:
If theirs a will their way. I am not saying it will be easy. DOJ would object if they would have total control of a market for example DC area. That was one of the reason UA/US didn't get approved. Most of the markets they share with one more airlines. EWR, IAH, SFO, LAX, ORD, CLE, BOS and IAD would pass due to competition from other airlines nearby. Also if anything they'll be asking them to give up slots/routes in those cities pairs that they believe unfair competition. Biggest obstacle would be labor and many promises have to be made like that it would satisfy DOJ.
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I agree about the labor part; but promises? From whom? The company? Ya, good luck with that! :lol:
 
Merv,

You are dead on with your conclusions. LABOR is the issue...a deal will not be blessed by the powers at be unless there is some very strong language that says there will not be a decrease in labor force. And the point in all mergers is econonmies of scale.

Therefore, this will have to wait for another 3 years...unless no jobs our compromised in a merged airline.

Good luck to all
 
shaka said:
Merv,

You are dead on with your conclusions. LABOR is the issue...a deal will not be blessed by the powers at be unless there is some very strong language that says there will not be a decrease in labor force. And the point in all mergers is econonmies of scale.

Therefore, this will have to wait for another 3 years...unless no jobs our compromised in a merged airline.

Good luck to all
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A merger between UA / CO would happen if the money's there, the companies don't need to "be blessed by the powers" The employee's are just a speed bump. As long as the people who stand to make the most are in a position to profit, it will happen. Look at Tilton, no experience. He was hired to steer UA through BK, and he was promised a lot of money for it. Labor didn't want him, and it was obvious their "blessings" meant nothing. When the time (money) is right it will happen. Labor has very little say.
 
Borescope said:
A merger between UA / CO would happen if the money's there, the companies don't need to "be blessed by the powers" The employee's are just a speed bump. As long as the people who stand to make the most are in a position to profit, it will happen. Look at Tilton, no experience. He was hired to steer UA through BK, and he was promised a lot of money for it. Labor didn't want him, and it was obvious their "blessings" meant nothing. When the time (money) is right it will happen. Labor has very little say.
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Just curious. Everyone seems to think Tilton was hired as a hatchet man, which obviously he was, and then was going to walk away with big bucks, on top of the big $$ he already received. My question is; what is making him stay at UA ? Did he get jet fuel in his blood, is the airline biz that intoxicating, does he like the bevy of stews like Bethune did at CAL ? I agree with your statement above.If DL is profitable in the next few years, the merger will be done, one way or the other. Terminology is not important. Did Delta acquire/merge NWA ? Depends on who you ask I suppose.Their internal memos are worded PMDL or Pre Merger NWA, which I assume means merger. There was an article about CAL pilots actually having some leverage in their negotiations regarding their scope clause and how it can impact the UA Aer Lingus venture. Interesting.
 
However, it takes two to tango as the song says. Has anyone seen any statements by someone in charge at CO that they were even remotely interested in merging with United. Being in the same alliance and codesharing gives them most (if not all) of the benefits that a merger would bring, and NONE of the problems.
 
jimntx said:
Has anyone seen any statements by someone in charge at CO that they were even remotely interested in merging with United.
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Nope. The closest was some remarks about seeing what happened with the DL/NW merger and maybe looking at alternatives if DL/NW was financially successful.

Jim
 
I was on a UA flight today PS-JFK-LAX--very nice product I might add. The F/A's seem to think a merger with CO is in fact coming....and many of them think it's a good thing!

We'll see...personally I think it might just happen within the next year or so, but I am just a dumb customer....
 
Art at ISP said:
I was on a UA flight today PS-JFK-LAX--very nice product I might add. The F/A's seem to think a merger with CO is in fact coming....and many of them think it's a good thing!

We'll see...personally I think it might just happen within the next year or so, but I am just a dumb customer....
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I'm glad they seem to think it's happening but it isn't. They should remember how easy it was for them to scum us during our time of need and what they did to us in DEN. They deserve the company they work for. I sincerely hope we only pick up the pieces we need and leave the rest of that bloated, dinosaur to wither.

Our new CEO said after DL proves the merger with NWA was successful only then would they consider moving forward with that option. He also mentioned they would rather pick up with they need during a Chapter 11 filing or Chapter 7 liquidation.
 
As someone who used to fly CO all the time because I lived in Houston, and who suffered with the employees through the Lorenzo years, I fail to see what CO gains from a merger with any of the other Big 5.

CO made a profit in 4th quarter. The rest of us (and especially my airline, AA) lost money. CO is repeatedly favored as the best airline by business travelers. The rest of us are lucky if those same business people don't just spit in our faces.

Granted, there are some routes that CO does not fly, or have the equipment to fly. So? There's a little airline called Southwest that flies to even fewer places and they put all of us to shame in the 4th quarter (and, for most quarters over the past 18 years). It seems to me that CO has learned the lesson that WN evidently knew from the very beginning. Decide what you are good at, and do it. And, don't worry about the things you aren't doing.

As I said in the earlier post, CO gains pretty much every added advantage it needed just by joining the Star Alliance (though, staying with Skyteam would have had the same result in my opinion).

And, by stopping there, they avoid all the myriad problems that come from a merger. (See also, AA/TWA, US/HP, et al). I'm not including the DL/NW merger. It isn't settled enough yet to determine the success or failure, but because of the highly unionized workforce on one side vs. the predominantly non-union workforce on the other, I don't think it's going to be pretty down the road.

Just my $0.02. No, I will not take a check. Cash or valid credit card only.
 
I have to agree with the earlier post...what benefit does Continental get by merging with United that they already don not have with the star alliance?

Continental has been successful in their current structure why would they want to create a gigantic headache with a merger?

They truly do not need any airline to merge with unless they can acquire at bargain prices.

JMO
 
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