UA-CO Merger Rumors Now Surfacing on Wall Street
- Thread starter JAMAKE1
- Start date
CAL also has EWR-HKG and won one of the China authorities. As for COMike, that's a toss up. could be the kind of carrot worth dangling out there.
As for the reaction, I'm inclined to believe that AA is only interested in assett sales anymore given their track record on mergers. Unfortunately though, how would that work with the unions? Much like UA's purchase of PA's pacific and AA's purchase of LHR from TW, both included employees. So, let's say AA buys NW Asia, plus some of the planes (neither of which are currently operated by AA). Could be interesting.
The other problem is that there isn't really a reason for NW to stand alone minus Asia. In other words, do we really need a domestic carrier (minus Asia, NW is little more than purely domestic) with hubs in MSP, DTW and MEM??? I see NW becoming a three way with DL & AA. To AA goes Asia, some planes & employees, and MAYBE MEM. To DL, MSP and or DTW with CVG being a casualty.
As for UA/CO...CLE goes away like a distant memory. IAD might even take a hit. Hubs in EWR, IAH, ORD, DEN, SFO remain with a strong presence in LAX. Could be interesting...
As for the reaction, I'm inclined to believe that AA is only interested in assett sales anymore given their track record on mergers. Unfortunately though, how would that work with the unions? Much like UA's purchase of PA's pacific and AA's purchase of LHR from TW, both included employees. So, let's say AA buys NW Asia, plus some of the planes (neither of which are currently operated by AA). Could be interesting.
The other problem is that there isn't really a reason for NW to stand alone minus Asia. In other words, do we really need a domestic carrier (minus Asia, NW is little more than purely domestic) with hubs in MSP, DTW and MEM??? I see NW becoming a three way with DL & AA. To AA goes Asia, some planes & employees, and MAYBE MEM. To DL, MSP and or DTW with CVG being a casualty.
As for UA/CO...CLE goes away like a distant memory. IAD might even take a hit. Hubs in EWR, IAH, ORD, DEN, SFO remain with a strong presence in LAX. Could be interesting...
Continental Management Won't be running anything BUT
Continental until a mergar takes place and Won't be running Anything if a merger were to take place. The management team at UAL HASN'T been a greatly loved entity but with the maneuvers accomplished during bankruptcy and the turnaround following bankruptcy they've got my vote in running the combined company were there to be a merger. Popularity not withstanding Gordon Bethune lost my respect when he said he wouldn't want to step into the United Cesspool. Well then he can keep his edict and keep his ass in the Continental kiddie pool becuause this pool has ben cleaned at UNITED!! UNLESS HE INTENDS TO RESTORE MY PENSION and MAINTAIN MY profit sharing, and Targer bonuses[/b
He Can "SCREW THE POOCH" OVER AT CONTINENTAL in the "bullpen" like he is now. What would we at United POSSIBLY NEED WITH CONTINENTAL NOW??? All the heavy lifting has been done. We're coming back into our own, making good tactcal moves that will put in the top tier of world airlines that every other airline will check for their future plans (like IAD-PEK)Whatever continental has We don't need to survive Or prosper. They Need United so nobody will take them over! Were I Tilton They'd literally "hand over" Continental in a merger. If any of their top managers remained at all they'd be one of the "gang" but the "GangLord" would come from United and the home office would remain in Chicago! And bethune wouldn't be anyplace in the vicinity. Let his ass Drool from the Window. He doesn't have what it takes to run United since even Continental is doing OK without him
Looks to me like they never needed him. And Neither do WE!
Continental until a mergar takes place and Won't be running Anything if a merger were to take place. The management team at UAL HASN'T been a greatly loved entity but with the maneuvers accomplished during bankruptcy and the turnaround following bankruptcy they've got my vote in running the combined company were there to be a merger. Popularity not withstanding Gordon Bethune lost my respect when he said he wouldn't want to step into the United Cesspool. Well then he can keep his edict and keep his ass in the Continental kiddie pool becuause this pool has ben cleaned at UNITED!! UNLESS HE INTENDS TO RESTORE MY PENSION and MAINTAIN MY profit sharing, and Targer bonuses[/b
He Can "SCREW THE POOCH" OVER AT CONTINENTAL in the "bullpen" like he is now. What would we at United POSSIBLY NEED WITH CONTINENTAL NOW??? All the heavy lifting has been done. We're coming back into our own, making good tactcal moves that will put in the top tier of world airlines that every other airline will check for their future plans (like IAD-PEK)Whatever continental has We don't need to survive Or prosper. They Need United so nobody will take them over! Were I Tilton They'd literally "hand over" Continental in a merger. If any of their top managers remained at all they'd be one of the "gang" but the "GangLord" would come from United and the home office would remain in Chicago! And bethune wouldn't be anyplace in the vicinity. Let his ass Drool from the Window. He doesn't have what it takes to run United since even Continental is doing OK without him
Looks to me like they never needed him. And Neither do WE!
USA320Pilot
Veteran
- May 18, 2003
- 8,175
- 1,539
I had no idea about (or that it existed) the "golden share" provision in the CO & NW agreement until a couple of days ago when a prominent Wall Street analyst told me about the provision when we were discussing industry consolidation. I thought the comment might be insightful to people in this forum, which is why I posted the information.
Separately, I have no inside information regarding a potential UA & CO merger; however, I believe if CO is interested in acquiring another company it might make more sense for the Houston-based carrier to acquire NW instead of UA.
CO & NW already have a comprehensive marketing alliance and the two companies have combined many airport operations. Thus, much of the merger related marketing and operational merger integration work has already been completed.
Moreover, CO could use the bankruptcy laws to obtain significant benefits while the Eagan-based company was still operating in its “formal reorganizationâ€.
Unlike with UA or any other airline, CO could use the bankruptcy code to reject NW leases on headquarters, training facilities, ATO, gates, maintenance hangars, and aircraft leases, etc. to create a greater synergistic effect than if it acquired a non-bankrupt company, similar in scope to what happened at US Airways. As US Airways CEO Doug Parker indicated there are financial opportunities by combining with a carrier going through a reorganization.
With US Airways now the most profitable former legacy airline the benefits of merging with a bankrupt company are now evident, although US Airways revenue performance is astounding.
Regardless, if M&A activity occurs I hope it goes well for all involved.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
P.S. Interestingly, this article may have an affect on UA CEO Glenn Tilton's M&A Plans.
Separately, I have no inside information regarding a potential UA & CO merger; however, I believe if CO is interested in acquiring another company it might make more sense for the Houston-based carrier to acquire NW instead of UA.
CO & NW already have a comprehensive marketing alliance and the two companies have combined many airport operations. Thus, much of the merger related marketing and operational merger integration work has already been completed.
Moreover, CO could use the bankruptcy laws to obtain significant benefits while the Eagan-based company was still operating in its “formal reorganizationâ€.
Unlike with UA or any other airline, CO could use the bankruptcy code to reject NW leases on headquarters, training facilities, ATO, gates, maintenance hangars, and aircraft leases, etc. to create a greater synergistic effect than if it acquired a non-bankrupt company, similar in scope to what happened at US Airways. As US Airways CEO Doug Parker indicated there are financial opportunities by combining with a carrier going through a reorganization.
With US Airways now the most profitable former legacy airline the benefits of merging with a bankrupt company are now evident, although US Airways revenue performance is astounding.
Regardless, if M&A activity occurs I hope it goes well for all involved.
Best regards,
USA320Pilot
P.S. Interestingly, this article may have an affect on UA CEO Glenn Tilton's M&A Plans.
Ha ha ha
You think this is some serendipitous thing, that they're just scratching their heads and looking around?
Ha ha ha..
spacewaitress
Senior
- Aug 27, 2002
- 468
- 0
God I would hope so!!
Why? You guys got about a 1/4 million each with the notes distribution. Invested well, that should make up your lost pension and then some. If not, then you didn't deserve that pension in the first place. No wonder we went BK.
BigRed1
Member
I often lurk, but have not posted in a long while. But I just had to ask if you and your fellow co-workers really believe what you said about the "1/4 million each" comment. Are you just being sarcastic or are you and your group really that mis-informed? Please tell me you aren't really spreading that garbage and poisening the well again with things that are so not true.
Thanks
Unfortunately, there is a lot of misinformation floating around.
There are currently rumors circulating big time on the F/A jumpseats about how the pilots are in bed with UA management and are cutting great pension deals while the other employees get screwed.
But, for the record, just what is the average notes distribution for pilots, if spacewaitress is so off-base?
There are 6,700 retired UAL pilots, 1,400 on furlough and 6,900 active pilots for a total of 15,000. If each received an average of $250k, then that would be $3.75 billion total, and we know that the pilots didn't get anywhere near that much. I'll look further to try to find the aggregate payout to the pilots.
The bond netted approx $540 million. the distribution method resulted in a few VERY senior guys getting numbers near the $250K, but a VAST majority got in the range of $15K to $50K (my OWN estimate). In short, the "one time" bond was less than the annual paycut most pilots took. Nothing like a disgruntled former F/A to sew dissention thru misinformation.
Oh, and only those furloughess who accepted a recall class that was announced prior to BK exit got the bond. That means about 1200 didn't.
767jetz
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
- 3,286
- 2,779
There are just too many variables to come up with an accurate number that depicts the average pilot. Some junior pilots get more than some senior pilots due to the fact that this bond was to compensate us for the pension we would expect at retirement. Then there are adjustments for how many years you have left based on age, and how much you can expect to receive in your B an C plan.
My best WAG is that the "average" f/o gets around 30K to 40K, and the "average" cap gets around 80K to 90K.
My best WAG is that the "average" f/o gets around 30K to 40K, and the "average" cap gets around 80K to 90K.
