Twu Solicits Help To Save All 3 Bases!

[Checking it Out]

Rum wrote,

CIO claims:
Amfa believes TWU Scope Clause = 100% Farm-out of work=Job loss=Amfa

Show us documentation in which "AMFA" states this so call belief. We AMFA organizers can read the contract where it says, in effect, that 49.9% can be outsourced.

Show us documentation where NWA is planning more lay-offs.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Check the meetings on the (9th and 12th of September and the previous meetings Amfa had. Look at the video's and you will see what Delle and the wantabes have stated.

Look under Yahoo for Airlines and you will see Mem. is laying off Mechanics again. It was posted on another thread.

Has everyone notice the Amfa is the Majority who are the whiners and are doing everything in their power to increase layoffs?

Have a Great DAY!

 

[MCI transplant]

And what will this begging cost the union worker?

Loss of more wages and benefits?

As was stated before, Let's urge AA to open repair stations in every state and pay minimum wage. :angry:

:angry: Buck! You talk pretty big when it's not your job on the line!!!!!!!!

Yes you are correct. It is not my job on the line. I have worked for American Airlines for 20 years. I was not aquired in a business transaction. I did not have my livelyhood threaten by this transaction. I was not the puppet of the the TWU and IAM deal cutting. The members at TWA could have received 100% of their seniority and I would most likely still be employed. But the fact remains that the TWU and the IAM are the unions that made the deal. Had it been the TWU alone you would have been placed to the bottom of the seniority list. And who said your job was on the line? I understand that the great and mightly industrial unions and their big daddy AFL-CIO have saved all three bases? So go and beg Mr. Arpey, but at least accept all the parameters of what his decesion will be.

I do have a question for you.

How low should union wages and benefits be allowed to go to protect jobs?

<_< Buck, I never said I was a fan of the TWU, or the AMFA either! And if you can't see what's going on here, it won't matter anyway! If you like it or not you'll have to live with the contract that the TWU has given you! Notice I did say TWU! If the AMFA took over today, they still would have to live with it for the next five years! Can the AMFA do better? I doubt it! The company has all of us right where they want us! DIVIDED!!!! TUL against AFW! AFW against MCI, Twu against AMFA, AA employees, against TWA!!! Until that changes, we're all screwed! That's reality of it friend!!!! And I personally don't think the AMFA can, or will change that! There is too much of a I've got mine, and to hell with you attitude at AA! So you've got 20 years! That would get you swing shift here. Maybe even with week-ends off! So don't knock people here, for trying to do the same as you did there in Tulsa with your 2025 vote!!!! Will the AMFA win an representation vote here at AA? It could happen! Could they, or would they, stand up to the company in five years? I doubt it!!!!! :down:

 

[Boomer]

MCI Transplant,
You are correct: the Union replacing the TWU will inherit the existing contract.

The question is: so what? The TWU is selling the early reopeners they "negotiated" in the Concessionary agreement. If you replace the TWU with AMFA, AMFA "inherits" the early reopener clause along with all of the other contractual provisions.

We can use the time between now and the "early reopener" to set up our Locals, Elect Officers, Vote on Our Negotiating Priorities, Set Up Open Negotiations at Various Locations and clear up the huge docket of Arbitration Cases left by the TWU.

The difference is that without the TWU, you will not be bound by the statement issued by John Kerrigan, Appointed International Secretary Treasurer for the TWU:

TWU Blasts Toussaint Efforts to Undermine Industrial Unionism
NEW YORK, Aug. 20 /PRNewswire/ -- TWU International Officers today
criticized TWU Local 100 President Roger Toussaint and many members of his
paid Local 100 staff for participating in a demonstration outside TWU
headquarters in New York in support of a TWU airline Local 562 officer (Robert
Owens), who is charged with aiding the efforts of a non-AFL-CIO craft union
(Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association) to replace TWU as the collective
bargaining representative among American Airlines aircraft mechanics.
TWU International Secretary Treasurer John J. Kerrigan stated: "TWU was
founded as an industrial union to advocate for the needs of all workers,
regardless of job title. For Roger Toussaint to offer this kind of support
for a person charged with bringing in an organization, whose basic belief is
that mechanics should have nothing to do with cleaners, baggage handlers, bus
drivers and other blue collar jobs, to replace TWU at American Airlines is a
total outrage to the very basic concept of our union and would have Mike Quill
turning over in his grave."

I believe that Sonny Hall took out Chuck and Bob because they had made "significant" political ties with Local 100 and their Democracy movement called New Directions. Members of the New Directions movement within Local 100, where Sonny Hall came from, sued him over violating workers rights:Sonny was convicted. Sonny Hall took this as the Political Threat that it was and used the AMFA issue in an attempt to destroy the More Union Democracy movement before it could threaten him and his cronies at the next Consitutional Convention.

Dude, Do Not Be Confused By the TWU "Smoke-n-Mirrors Campaign". These guys are treating us worse than $2.00 Groupies not worth dinner before they enjoy dessert. We fought for Separation only to have the Aircraft Maintenance, Automotive Maintenance, Facilites Maintenance, Fuelers, Simulator Technicians and Tech Services not brought together for the Maintenenance & Related TWU concessions. We are now being fed the line that a separate maintenance division of the TWU will give us something AMFA cannot. We do not want to abandon our Union brothers within the same class and craft; we want them represented the same as any other skilled Aviation Professional SHOULD BE.

Cast a vote for a real NEW DIRECTION. Sign an AMFA CARD TODAY!

 

[RUM@AA]

Rum wrote,

CIO claims:
Amfa believes TWU Scope Clause = 100% Farm-out of work=Job loss=Amfa

Show us documentation in which "AMFA" states this so call belief. We AMFA organizers can read the contract where it says, in effect, that 49.9% can be outsourced.

Show us documentation where NWA is planning more lay-offs.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Check the meetings on the (9th and 12th of September and the previous meetings Amfa had. Look at the video's and you will see what Delle and the wantabes have stated.

Look under Yahoo for Airlines and you will see Mem. is laying off Mechanics again. It was posted on another thread.

Has everyone notice the Amfa is the Majority who are the whiners and are doing everything in their power to increase layoffs?

Have a Great DAY!

I was at the noon meeting on the 12th and never heard Delle or anyone else say that the TWU scope clause allowed 100% farm out. I even watched the video and never heard it there either.

NWA is laying off again, well so is AA. The difference? 17.5% pay, 10 paid days off a year, "without further ratification" etc.

And what exactly are we doing to increase layoffs? I don't know one AMFA supporter that plays dominoes.

 

[Buck]

And what will this begging cost the union worker?

Loss of more wages and benefits?

As was stated before, Let's urge AA to open repair stations in every state and pay minimum wage. :angry:

:angry: Buck! You talk pretty big when it's not your job on the line!!!!!!!!

Yes you are correct. It is not my job on the line. I have worked for American Airlines for 20 years. I was not aquired in a business transaction. I did not have my livelyhood threaten by this transaction. I was not the puppet of the the TWU and IAM deal cutting. The members at TWA could have received 100% of their seniority and I would most likely still be employed. But the fact remains that the TWU and the IAM are the unions that made the deal. Had it been the TWU alone you would have been placed to the bottom of the seniority list. And who said your job was on the line? I understand that the great and mightly industrial unions and their big daddy AFL-CIO have saved all three bases? So go and beg Mr. Arpey, but at least accept all the parameters of what his decesion will be.

I do have a question for you.

How low should union wages and benefits be allowed to go to protect jobs?

<_< Buck, I never said I was a fan of the TWU, or the AMFA either! And if you can't see what's going on here, it won't matter anyway! If you like it or not you'll have to live with the contract that the TWU has given you! Notice I did say TWU! If the AMFA took over today, they still would have to live with it for the next five years! Can the AMFA do better? I doubt it! The company has all of us right where they want us! DIVIDED!!!! TUL against AFW! AFW against MCI, Twu against AMFA, AA employees, against TWA!!! Until that changes, we're all screwed! That's reality of it friend!!!! And I personally don't think the AMFA can, or will change that! There is too much of a I've got mine, and to hell with you attitude at AA! So you've got 20 years! That would get you swing shift here. Maybe even with week-ends off! So don't knock people here, for trying to do the same as you did there in Tulsa with your 2025 vote!!!! Will the AMFA win an representation vote here at AA? It could happen! Could they, or would they, stand up to the company in five years? I doubt it!!!!! :down:

So tell me, what is going on here....

I have had to live with industrial union contracts my whole career, I have grown very tired of their philosophies. As for being divided in the eyes of the company, you are correct. The only difference today, is that we are attemping to do something about it. Being divided amongst ourselves and attemping change is better than being the company puppet. The former members of the IAM / TWA, that write on this board have one thing in common, doubt. YOu guys doubt any change will work. If my 20 years got me swing shift and it was in democratic union based on the mechanic craft and clss I would gladly stand my watch.

As for 2025, I voted no. The only vision you have of the members at Local 514, is those the Local leadership have allowed you to have. Noy everyone was for the blackmail tatics associated with 2025, especially after a 17.5% paycut.

 

[TonyB]

"Union solicits pleas for American chief

By Trebor BanstetterStar-Telegram Staff Writer"

I see the mighty TWU ssssnake has resorted to begging!

WILL BEG IF PROVOKED!

Of course with their so called iron clad scope language, they can't help but to beg. Because as we all know article 1 states,
"IT IS UNDERSTOOD THAT NOTHING IN THIS ARTICLE GUARANTEES THE MAINTENANCE OF THE PRESENT VOLUME OF WORK"

 

[Checking it Out]

will beg if provoked,

What a smart comment, Did you think this up yourself?

The TWU is fighting for jobs as others are laying off? The choice is clear in this decission.

 

[TonyB]

If checking it out is so smAArt, then can he please explain to me what
[/B]" IT IS UNDERSTOOD THAT NOTHING IN THIS ARTICLE GUARANTEES THE MAINTENANCE OF THE PRESENT VOLUME OF WORK"
means?

Of course he'll come back with something smaft like AMFA sucks, strength in numbers, will beg... I mean, strike if provoked, an injustice to one is an injustice to all or the two latest jewels from the industrial toy company union slogan shop, Team TWU and TWU American's Strength."
That last one say's it all. The Totally Worthless Union isAmerican's strength. Without the TWU's help they would have never given us the spanking that they did.

 

[TonyB]

TWU, AMERICAN'S ENFORCER

 

[Bob Owens]

will beg if provoked,

What a smart comment, Did you think this up yourself?

The TWU is fighting for jobs as others are laying off? The choice is clear in this decission.

What do you call that thing thats due to happen this November in STL?

The International only fights its own members, it does not fight for them. Sonny Hall is a CEOs best assett.

Why is Sonny Hall presenting a manager who has a hostile record against a TWU Local the Lawe Labor Award?

Why were there more managers. including Don Carty than TWU members at Koziateks retirement party?

Sonny Hall has turned the TWU into a "Company Union".

 

[Buck]

I have attempted to point out in the past that for the leadership and many members of the TWU Local 514 that no other members or locals exist.

 

[RV4]

will beg if provoked,

What a smart comment, Did you think this up yourself?

The TWU is fighting for jobs as others are laying off? The choice is clear in this decission.

Any good union man knows that "job security" and job protections are defined in the labor agreement.

It is the TWU that is blazing the new trail of "fighting" for jobs in new fashion, by politicking for tax increases and corporate welfare checks, and now a begging campaign to the C.E.O. of AA.

I am embarrassed to even be associated with the TWU.

What's the deal CIO? Is the LANGUAGE in your current labor agreement weak and flawed? I thought we were told we had "iron clad" language?

Why can't we just file a grievance a go to arbitration if the company treats the worker unjust?

At least AMFA at Northwest has arbitrated the force majeuere layoffs and is awaiting a decision. What has the TWU done?

I must say, the current acts by you and the TWU expose even weaker negotiating skills that we have suspected.

It is time to get OBSERVERS into negotiations, it is time demand "further ratification", it is time to obtain accountability within our leadership, it is time for...

...AMFA


Hey Bob Owens...What is the verdict on you and Chuck?

 

[Bob Owens]

Hey Bob Owens...What is the verdict on you and Chuck? [/QUOTE]
No "official" notice yet, however unofficially we are suspended from all TWU activities for three years.

Three years! It may as well be 300 years!

 

[Steve Connell]

Tony B...please post your local monthly meeting attendance.

Bob...you received less than you deserved..and so did Chuck...BTW..please advise all of Dan's outcome!

 

[Bob Owens]

Boomer;
Yes its true that Chuck and I have been involved with Local 100 in trying to reform the TWU.

My involvement started at the Convention. I'd urged Bobby Gless- who was Local 562 President at the time- to join in the reform movement at the Convention but he was too busy at the Craps tables to be bothered. During the Convention Local 100 was the only thing that kept it from being a complete sham, it was still a sham but Local 100 put up resistance against Sonny Halls tyranny.

Sonny's moves against us are dual in purpose, one is because of actions we took as a result of the sellout at AA and the other a move to eliminate allies of Local 100 in an attempt to isolate them.

Sonny would love to do the same to Local 100, the problem is if Sonny did try that,it could blow up in his face. Local 100 is structured different from us. The deposed leadership could start a decertification drive and establish a new union and leave. Since these 38000 workers are concentrated and all in one local this could be done in a matter of weeks. In Local 100 the leadership is chosen by and supported by the members. Our top leadership is actually the ATD, none of them are elected by the membership. Since no single local could ever initiate a decertification drive in the AA-ATD and all the power is centered in the International controlled and appointed ATD no real leadership that was opposed to Sonny could ever develop. If any did, like us, he could isolate and remove, as he has done.

This structure in the AA-ATD not only limits resistance but the only real way any decertification drive could ever take place is one that is grass roots in nature. No one AA/ATD local could ever lead an exodus from under the International. Thats why Sonny likes having all these small Locals. Its also why the company agrees to facilitate so many Localsand pay the Presidents salaries. Technically this is what company unions used to do and the practice was banned in either the LMRDA or Taft Hartley, I'm not sure which.

As long as there are so many Locals all bound into one agreement that Sonny in effect has complete control over the company benifits. In the meantime the members are caught in a vicious cycle. The ATD leaders who have control make sweetheart deals with management, get the presidents to sell it, when the deficiencies of the agreement are revealed the International deflects blame to local presidents, the members vote out the presidents and the International gets a fresh crop of Presidents to hoodwink again.

Until the development of the internet, which makes mass communication over vast distances easy, grass roots movements were difficult to sustain. The internet in effect brings transparency and power to the members. Sonny refuses or is incapable of adapting. This will cost the Union dearly, first he will lose the dispatchers, then the mechanics, then maybe Fleet Service, somewhere in between he may lose SWA Flight Attendants, that pretty much leaves Local 100 in charge.

Too bad we will not be around to see his regime toppled. Maybe then the legacy of Mike Quill will be restored. Rojer Toussaint is a labor leader with powerful convictions. Unlike Sonny Hall and his regime he actually believes in the membership. Ive heard statements from various International leaders that show that they feel contempt towards the people they represent. Rojer mobilizes often and has to rent out places like the Javits Center to have indoor meetings. When he has rallys you see a sea of people, I participated in the March Across the Bridge last December as contract talks heated up between the TA and the Union. It was a solid line of people 20 ft across the entire length of the Brooklyn Bridge. At city hall there were so many people that the streets were all blocked off and you could not even see the podium. It was the countdown and none of knew if there was going to be a strike, we did not know how we were going to get home, but it was great!

In the meantime Sonny Hall was stabbing Local 100 in the back, saying that if they struck they were "on their own". He was working in behalf of the Transit Authority. I guess that Sonny did not talk to the Central Labor Council, because they were downtown on the podium offering their full support to the roar of the crowd, this could partially explain Sonnys abscence from this years Labor day parade.

Sonny Hall is a vindictive coward of a man. He is the true enemy of labor. He profits off our dues while doing the employers bidding. He has done more damage to the labor movement than any ultra right wing RTW sub Mason-Dixie line Republican. During my whole suspension and trial process he refused to take my phone calls, answer my letters or even face me during my trial. His charges included posts that were made prior to when I met face to face with him in May of this year. He gave no indication that he objected to my posts at that time. He testified against me to the IEB without ever adressing me face to face about those charges or offering me the opportunity to defend myselfbefore that same board. It is actions such as his, that once made public, drive support for laws that bind up labor unions. He maintains that by making this public, that we are "helping the enemies of labor", I maintain that it is the act, not the revelation of the act, that does the damage.