SWA, FL FA agree on SENIORITY
- Thread starter gizmo_sc
- Start date
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
- 21,709
- 10,662
- Banned
- #2
details and perspective, Buscador?
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Banned
- #5
"The unions said the pact provides seniority enhancements and job security for Southwest flight attendants and boosts wages and benefits for AirTran flight attendants. Southwest Airlines also will open an Atlanta flight attendant base."
It'll take a little while until real details come out.
Jim
It'll take a little while until real details come out.
Jim
jimntx
Veteran
Got this from one of my union reps:
"Unions representing flight attendants at Southwest Airlines and Air Tran Airways have reached a tentative agreement with each other and the airlines on a new common contract. The agreement announced Monday provides for economic sweeteners for both groups of flight attendants and a way to integrate the Air Tran employees into the Southwest seniority system. The latter was accomplished by Southwest agreeing to open a flight attendant base in Atlanta, where the bulk of the Air Tran flight attendants are now based. Their seniority at the base will be based on date of hire. Terms of the agreement call for Southwest to add two-and-one-half years to each of its fglight attendants seniority, increasing pay and benefits. Air Tran employees (meaing in this case, flight attendants) will see their pay and benefits scale bumped up to Southwest levels. Southwest announced an agreement to acquire Air Tran in September 2010 and completed the deal on May 2. Pilots of the two airlines approved their seniority and integration plan last month."
(bolding is mine)
"Unions representing flight attendants at Southwest Airlines and Air Tran Airways have reached a tentative agreement with each other and the airlines on a new common contract. The agreement announced Monday provides for economic sweeteners for both groups of flight attendants and a way to integrate the Air Tran employees into the Southwest seniority system. The latter was accomplished by Southwest agreeing to open a flight attendant base in Atlanta, where the bulk of the Air Tran flight attendants are now based. Their seniority at the base will be based on date of hire. Terms of the agreement call for Southwest to add two-and-one-half years to each of its fglight attendants seniority, increasing pay and benefits. Air Tran employees (meaing in this case, flight attendants) will see their pay and benefits scale bumped up to Southwest levels. Southwest announced an agreement to acquire Air Tran in September 2010 and completed the deal on May 2. Pilots of the two airlines approved their seniority and integration plan last month."
(bolding is mine)
Do you have a link to the AFA web site?
Never mind. Found it. Here it is as posted on AT AFA web site. It reads as if the SWA F/A's get a 2.5 year boost in senority across the board except for ALT and MCO. Is this how you guys read it??
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SWA MERGER NEGOTIATIONS UPDATES
** SENIORITY INTEGRATION AND TRANSITION AGREEMENT REACHED! **
December 26, 2011 1600 EST
Association of Flight Attendants Council 57, Transport Workers Union Local 556, Southwest Airlines, and AirTran Airways are pleased to announce we have reached a Seniority Integration and Transition Agreement for the full integration of AirTran Flight Attendants into Southwest Airlines.
This agreement has been approved by both the Master Executive Council of AFA 57 and the TWU Local 556 Executive Board. The agreement will now be placed before the Southwest and AirTran Flight Attendants to vote on. The voting schedule and instructions will be communicated as soon as they are finalized. AFA and TWU will be conducting educational events and providing resources through all available communication resources. Please take the time to review all material, and if you have any questions, let us know. It is our goal to make sure that all Flight Attendants have the information they need to make an educated vote.
Both Unions, along with Southwest, worked hard to reach an agreement that recognizes the contributions of all Flight Attendants, meets the fair and equitable requirement of federal law, and preserves the Culture of Southwest Airlines. Most importantly, this Tentative Agreement gives our Members the opportunity to vote on our future as opposed to resorting to the uncertainty of the decision of three arbitrators who would never have to live under their decision and on which we would not get to vote.
Additional information will be available in the next few days. Thank you for your patience and support throughout this process.
Below are some highlights of the agreement:
SENIORITY
•AirTran Flight Attendants on the seniority list as of September 26, 2010 will be credited with their full seniority. (Date of Hire).
•Southwest Flight Attendants on the seniority list as of September 26, 2010 will receive an additional 2 1/2 years of seniority. (Date of Hire + 2.5 years). NOTE: See exception under DOMICILES.
•All (both AirTran and Southwest) Flight Attendants hired after September 26, 2010 will be credited with their “Date Of Hire” seniority. (Date of Hire).
•If both Southwest and AirTran flight attendants share the same seniority date, the Southwest flight attendants will be placed above the AirTran flight attendants.
PAY RATES/WORK RULES
•AirTran flight attendants will continue under the AFA CBA until they cross the “partition” to Southwest.
•Upon crossing the partition, AirTran flight attendants will be credited with their full years of service at AirTran, and paid under the applicable TWU CBA pay rates.
•Upon crossing the partition, AirTran flight attendants will become Southwest flight attendants and members of TWU 556. All aspects of the TWU CBA will be applicable.
DOMICILES
•Southwest will establish an Atlanta Domicile no later than January 1, 2015.
•All bidding within the ATL domicile will be based on “date of hire”. (SWA flight attendants will not receive the “2.5 years of credit increase” for bidding purposes within ATL).
•ATL AirTran flight attendants will have a “first right of return” to the ATL domicile only.
•MCO AirTran flight attendants will have a “first right of return” to both the MCO and ATL domiciles.
•AirTran flight attendants will bid for their domicile prior to attending “Special Merger Training”.
•AirTran flight attendants who do not return to their AirTran domicile will be considered displaced and will be covered by the TWU 556 CBA for moving expenses and provisions.
PROFIT SHARING
•AirTran flight attendants will become eligible for the Southwest Profit Sharing Plan effective January 1, 2012, regardless if they have crossed the “partition”.
TRAINING
•AirTran flight attendants will receive single occupancy rooms during Merger Training.
•Bidding will be done two bid cycles prior to the training event.
•Bidding will be done in seniority order, however, may be awarded by domicile as necessary to protect the AirTran operation.
•Training will be compensated pursuant to the AFA CBA.
VACATION
•AirTran flight attendants will carry all accrued vacation across partition.
•If AirTran flight attendant crosses partition after annual vacation bid, they will rebid for vacation in SWA domicile and be awarded at that seniority level in that domicile, regardless of week availability.
•AirTran flight attendant may opt to “cash out” vacation prior to crossing partition.
UNIFORMS
•AirTran flight attendants will be provided with 5 tops, 5 bottoms, 1 belt, 1 jacket.
•AirTran flight attendants with uniform credits will be paid out the balance of their account after crossing the partition.
PROBATION
•AirTran flight attendants who have successfully completed probation will not be placed on probation after crossing the partition.
SICK LEAVE
•AirTran flight attendants’ accrued and unused sick days will be converted to 7 TFP (trips for pay) per day.
These are some highlights of the agreement only. Additional information about all of these areas, as well as more regarding 401k, personnel files, leaves of absence, insurance, retirement, furlough, etc. may be found in the document itself.
Sweet deal, those AT FA's are so accomadating,, I am going to ask the company if I do absolutely NOTHING but give up 2.5 years seniortiy if I can have a $30k pay raise,, hopefully they will say yes and cave as easily as the TWU556 did,, they out to be ashamed...
Good job TWU,, you were given a tough steak sandwich to deal with and a 1 year old baby could of biten into or gummed into it harder.... whohooo 2.5 years,, and they keep DOH,,, I didnt read the small print did the TWU throw in a $50k signing bonus to the AFA... well they should, AT deserves it ,,
DOH is never acceptable,, AT has given up NOTHING, therefore they keep taking and get everything,,look out SWA when you go for a company with real seniority,, TWU will cave again,,,,, so welcome aboard AT,, just try not to waive your lottery ticket around too much....I saw the odds of winning a 25K$ a year for life lottery ticket.. its like 1: 1.5 miliion,, and you may well end up with 2,200 of them,,,and you didnt have to even buy one, it was handed to you,,wow what are the odds of that???
Good job TWU,, you were given a tough steak sandwich to deal with and a 1 year old baby could of biten into or gummed into it harder.... whohooo 2.5 years,, and they keep DOH,,, I didnt read the small print did the TWU throw in a $50k signing bonus to the AFA... well they should, AT deserves it ,,
DOH is never acceptable,, AT has given up NOTHING, therefore they keep taking and get everything,,look out SWA when you go for a company with real seniority,, TWU will cave again,,,,, so welcome aboard AT,, just try not to waive your lottery ticket around too much....I saw the odds of winning a 25K$ a year for life lottery ticket.. its like 1: 1.5 miliion,, and you may well end up with 2,200 of them,,,and you didnt have to even buy one, it was handed to you,,wow what are the odds of that???
Kev3188
Veteran
According to who?
Ok , let me rephrase that as a question,, if DOH is fair, then what in the big picture are the AT FA;s giving up to counterweigh the 30-50% pay raises and incredible amounts of new flexibility????? How have they shown any GOOD FAith or appreciation for $35k a year newly found income???????????????
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Banned
- #13
It's really two sides of the same coin. Whether the WN FA's get an extra 2.5 years credit for placement on the combined list or the FL FA's get 2.5 years less the effect is the same - a FL FA's position on the combined list would be after a WN FA hired 2.5 years after them. I don't know when the most senior FL FA was hired, but using 1/1/94 as an example, every WN FA hired on or prior to 7/1/96 would be above that FL FA on the combined list. A greater number of WN FA's won't have a single FL FA above them than a pure DOH integration, and most if not all WN FA's will have fewer FL FA's ahead of them on the combined list.
I guess one could argue that the extra 2.5 years seniority for placement on the combined list is too little - it should have been 5 or 10 years. But at some point the combined list would start to look like the FL FA's were stapled to the bottom of the WN list.
Jim
I guess one could argue that the extra 2.5 years seniority for placement on the combined list is too little - it should have been 5 or 10 years. But at some point the combined list would start to look like the FL FA's were stapled to the bottom of the WN list.
Jim
I guess the 12 years AMFA thru out there to get rid of the LOA letter protecting SWA mechs, and the protections, wasn't as far out there as alot of the AT guys were saying it was, now is it?? This was AMFA's first yearly increase offer to the SWA mechs. AT should have rebuttled with something, anything, but they did not. It was a start. They should have countered. This is when the company really started to get more involved, and as such, as AMFA CLEARLY states, "this is a company offer, not an AMFA offer."
This is yet another reason why I am a no vote for the mechs agreement. I agree with your assumption that the years for the F/A's should have been more like in the range of 5-10 years.
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Banned
- #15
I don't know enough about the mechanic's situation to make even a semi-informed guess. All I can say is that a negotiated method of integration is better than going to an arbitration and that Kelly has the power to prevent an arbitration by operating WN and FL separately, although separate ops is a less desirable outcome as the number of employees in the affected groups gets smaller.
As for the 5-10 years extra seniority for WN FA's, that's not my assumption but merely an observation that some WN FA's could feel that way. As I've said before, from my perspective as an outsider it seems the worst deal for WN FA's would be a straight ratio integration. DOH would be better, expecially for WN FA's hired before FL started operations in early 1994. This is better for more WN FA's since it means no FL FA's will go above any WN FA hired before midish 1996 and every FL FA would be lower than they would be based on their DOH. What would be the perfect amount of longevity to add to WN FA's? Depends on who you ask - some near the bottom of the WN list might want all the FL FA's placed below themselves, which would require 15 or more years be added to their hire date and effectively be stapling. Others near the top of the WN list might say straight DOH would be fine since all the FL FA's would be below them using that. In other words, there is no perfect answer - someone's ox is going to be gored, so it depends on who you ask.
Jim
As for the 5-10 years extra seniority for WN FA's, that's not my assumption but merely an observation that some WN FA's could feel that way. As I've said before, from my perspective as an outsider it seems the worst deal for WN FA's would be a straight ratio integration. DOH would be better, expecially for WN FA's hired before FL started operations in early 1994. This is better for more WN FA's since it means no FL FA's will go above any WN FA hired before midish 1996 and every FL FA would be lower than they would be based on their DOH. What would be the perfect amount of longevity to add to WN FA's? Depends on who you ask - some near the bottom of the WN list might want all the FL FA's placed below themselves, which would require 15 or more years be added to their hire date and effectively be stapling. Others near the top of the WN list might say straight DOH would be fine since all the FL FA's would be below them using that. In other words, there is no perfect answer - someone's ox is going to be gored, so it depends on who you ask.
Jim
